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  • Re: West Liberty Hilltopper Basketball

    Originally posted by boatcapt View Post
    And I would add that scheduling easier teams is low risk, high reward. I would argue that the fact that the MEC is much stronger actually argues for scheduling OOC games you have a really good chance of winning BECAUSE you are quite probably going to lose a couple of games to some really, really good teams in conference play...couple those two regular season conference losses with a couple of OOC losses because you scheduled tough and you are possible in a place were you don't want to be...even if you have a high SOS. Have a truly down year for WLU (four in conf losses) and lose two OOC because you scheduled hard and now you are sitting on the bubble with a real chance of sitting at home.

    You also have to look at how teams develop and how coaches approach preparing their teams. Since Crutch came on board and now with Ben at the helm, WLU seems to have approached the first couple of games as almost and extension of pre-season practice. Lineups are juggled...different on-court combinations are tried...minute allocations are determined. In short, the way they approach seasons is quite different than say, IUP. IUP practices and prepares for tough opening games because that is what Joe wants. Pretty much the starting lineup is set and the minute allocations are penciled out long before the opening tip. So if WLU is going to continue to schedule tough games right out of the gate, they are going to have to change how they approach the season to do things they haven't done in MANY years...OR run the risk of losing one or both opening weekend games every year.

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      • Re: West Liberty Hilltopper Basketball

        And if they do, so be it. But as IUP learned last season, scheduling tough has a much greater down side than scheduling easier opening contests.

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        • Re: West Liberty Hilltopper Basketball

          Some people like to argue for argument's sake...

          one man's opinion: I prefer WLU to play a tougher OOC schedule than they typically have (no more cheyney, no more seton hill, no more Point Park). And if playing a solid PSAC team at home costs them hosting or costs them entry to the regional, they weren't great anyway.
          I think a quality loss is still looked at positively, as long as there are not too many of them...

          If anyone on the board was consulted by the schedule makers at WL to see who we thought they should play, raise your hand?
          Go head, don't be shy.

          Ok, I think we can assume that WL scheduled who they wanted this year, without getting any inputs from the messageboard folks, so I'm pretty sure, WL wanted to go this direction with tougher opponents. Boat, you're narrative about WL caving in to what a few message board folks wanted, doesn't fly with me.. They scheduled them...and let's sit back and enjoy the games and the rivalary's and debate other things...
          this is tired.

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          • Re: West Liberty Hilltopper Basketball

            Originally posted by boatcapt View Post
            And if they do, so be it. But as IUP learned last season, scheduling tough has a much greater down side than scheduling easier opening contests.
            It's a risk but last year was nothing new. IUP has done that for the past decade. No doubt, it has cost them hosting a couple times. This isn't just an IUP thing. Fairmont State always schedules tough. Several do.

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            • Re: West Liberty Hilltopper Basketball

              Hahahahaha!!! What do you think he's going to say? "Gee, we made a mistake and scheduled too hard this year. Next year we are going to go back to what worked." I wonder what Joe would say if you asked if he regretted scheduling such a tough OOC slate last year that he didn't even make the playoffs? Doubt he's say, "Oh I definently should have scheduled easier opponents." That's not what coaches would ever do...at least not in public!!

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              • Re: West Liberty Hilltopper Basketball

                Originally posted by boatcapt View Post
                Hahahahaha!!! What do you think he's going to say? "Gee, we made a mistake and scheduled too hard this year. Next year we are going to go back to what worked." I wonder what Joe would say if you asked if he regretted scheduling such a tough OOC slate last year that he didn't even make the playoffs? Doubt he's say, "Oh I definently should have scheduled easier opponents." That's not what coaches would ever do...at least not in public!!
                Nope. I think Ben was telling the truth. I also have read that you are the ONLY WL poster complaining about them not playing cupcakes.

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                • Re: West Liberty Hilltopper Basketball

                  Originally posted by boatcapt View Post
                  Hahahahaha!!! What do you think he's going to say? "Gee, we made a mistake and scheduled too hard this year. Next year we are going to go back to what worked." I wonder what Joe would say if you asked if he regretted scheduling such a tough OOC slate last year that he didn't even make the playoffs? Doubt he's say, "Oh I definently should have scheduled easier opponents." That's not what coaches would ever do...at least not in public!!

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                  • Re: West Liberty Hilltopper Basketball

                    Originally posted by IUPbigINDIANS View Post
                    Nope. I think Ben was telling the truth. I also have read that you are the ONLY WL poster complaining about them not playing cupcakes.

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                    • Re: West Liberty Hilltopper Basketball

                      Originally posted by IUPbigINDIANS View Post
                      It's a risk but last year was nothing new. IUP has done that for the past decade. No doubt, it has cost them hosting a couple times. This isn't just an IUP thing. Fairmont State always schedules tough. Several do.
                      High risk, high reward vs lower risk, high reward. WLU has always done things "differently" than other teams or the traditional ways of doing things AND they have been very successful at it. Now it appears, at least in scheduling, we are giving in to conventional wisdom and changing what we have been successful at. As happens in almost everything, a change in one area results in a change in other unanticipated areas. If we continue to schedule tough games to open the year, we are going to have to change how we approach the early season and the pre season camp. Also, you have to face the reality that there is a good chance you could have two more losses than you might typically have which will probably equal lower chances of hosting the Regional Tourney.

                      But weather it is a good idea or not, it seems like we have changed. We'll see starting this year weather that change produces good results and starting with the next recruiting class, we'll see if there are other unanticipated changes this focus on the early season causes.

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                      • Re: West Liberty Hilltopper Basketball

                        Originally posted by boatcapt View Post
                        High risk, high reward vs lower risk, high reward. WLU has always done things "differently" than other teams or the traditional ways of doing things AND they have been very successful at it. Now it appears, at least in scheduling, we are giving in to conventional wisdom and changing what we have been successful at. As happens in almost everything, a change in one area results in a change in other unanticipated areas. If we continue to schedule tough games to open the year, we are going to have to change how we approach the early season and the pre season camp. Also, you have to face the reality that there is a good chance you could have two more losses than you might typically have which will probably equal lower chances of hosting the Regional Tourney.

                        But weather it is a good idea or not, it seems like we have changed. We'll see starting this year weather that change produces good results and starting with the next recruiting class, we'll see if there are other unanticipated changes this focus on the early season causes.
                        Not sure it really caused you a whole lot of damage. Granted, 0-2 would be a different conversation.

                        But, this seems to be a good year to lose one if you are going to lose one.

                        Many of the teams we expect to make noise got off to bad starts.

                        FSU has 2 losses. ESU, VSU, WCU and SRU are 0-8 combined. Kutztown dropped one. Virginia Union took a loss. Corcord has a loss. That was a HUGE weekend of top Atlantic teams playing each other.

                        Nobody is going undefeated. IUP still has Le Moyne, at Fairmont and the East Big 4 ... and then the West season.


                        I am interested to see the results of the upcoming Glenville and WVW games against WL. Both seem really improved.

                        Keep an eye on Shaw. We don't want them hosting. Talk about homecourt advantage. That's like a shoebox.

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                        • Re: West Liberty Hilltopper Basketball

                          WL sitting at 1-1 after 2 games against strong competition is not going to make or break them when it comes to hosting in my opinion. It is also my opinion that even though WL has been use to hosting or at least in the conversation...it is just not good to put the cart so far in front of the horse.

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                          • Re: West Liberty Hilltopper Basketball

                            Originally posted by IUPbigINDIANS View Post
                            Not sure it really caused you a whole lot of damage. Granted, 0-2 would be a different conversation.

                            But, this seems to be a good year to lose one if you are going to lose one.

                            Many of the teams we expect to make noise got off to bad starts.

                            FSU has 2 losses. ESU, VSU, WCU and SRU are 0-8 combined. Kutztown dropped one. Virginia Union took a loss. Corcord has a loss. That was a HUGE weekend of top Atlantic teams playing each other.

                            Nobody is going undefeated. IUP still has Le Moyne, at Fairmont and the East Big 4 ... and then the West season.


                            I am interested to see the results of the upcoming Glenville and WVW games against WL. Both seem really improved.

                            Keep an eye on Shaw. We don't want them hosting. Talk about homecourt advantage. That's like a shoebox.
                            We'll see. Makes the game at King that much more important. That is a very losable game no matter how you cut it. Lose that and add a couple of losses in the very rugged MEC conference play and WLU could be sitting at four (or more) losses at the end of the regular season with probably a strong SOS. The wisdom here seems to be that a weak OOC slate is what has held the Toppers back over the last three seasons. We could see if that is the is true and playing Kutz, WCU and King but finishing the season with more L's results in a Regional hosting call.

                            Interesting point, but WLU's next three opponents are sitting at 2-0. There is some smoke and mirrors there but all, including upcoming Salem, are looking down at 1-1 WLU right now.
                            Last edited by boatcapt; 11-12-2018, 02:33 PM.

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                            • Re: West Liberty Hilltopper Basketball

                              Originally posted by boatcapt View Post
                              We'll see. Makes the game at King that much more important. That is a very losable game no matter how you cut it. Lose that and add a couple of losses in the very rugged MEC conference play and WLU could be sitting at four (or more) losses at the end of the regular season with probably a strong SOS. The wisdom here seems to be that a weak OOC slate is what has held the Toppers back over the last three seasons. We could see if that is the is true and playing Kutz, WCU and King but finishing the season with more L's results in a Regional hosting call.

                              Curious of the last 5 years how many 'hosts' actually won the regional? I don't know the answer off hand but from memory ESU hosted and lost. WL lost the year IUP beat them. Virginia State hosted and lost. Didn't Mercyhurst upset host Wheeling Jesuit a few years back?

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                              • Re: West Liberty Hilltopper Basketball

                                Originally posted by IUPbigINDIANS View Post
                                Curious of the last 5 years how many 'hosts' actually won the regional? I don't know the answer off hand but from memory ESU hosted and lost. WL lost the year IUP beat them. Virginia State hosted and lost. Didn't Mercyhurst upset host Wheeling Jesuit a few years back?
                                While it was a lot like hosting, WLU did technically win the Regionals on the road at WJU three years ago. Think that was the year that Hurst beat WJU at WJU. I think the last time the Regional host has won was when WLU won in 2013. WLU's out of conference slate that year? Cedarville, Findlay, Point Park, PR-Mayaguez and PR-Bayamon.
                                Last edited by boatcapt; 11-12-2018, 02:44 PM.

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