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Men's GNAC attendance report

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  • Men's GNAC attendance report

    It took me less than 10 minutes to find these numbers, so maybe I should do California conferences attendance reports. I have a theory on D2 basketball: If you are at 700 attendance or above, you're getting pretty darn good numbers. If you're at 500 to 700, that's pretty solid. If you're below 500 it's not good. If you're below 400 you suck.

    NNU -- 1,145 per game, super impressive, great job. They're usually about 800 which is nice. This year they've gone the extra mile for a really good team.

    CWU -- 713, really good, but I thought they'd do a little bit better. It's not like there's a ton of stuff to do in the winter in Ellensburg. But you can't make people go to games. Wildcats have a good team this year. I thought they'd draw around a thousand a game.

    UAA -- 683, solid but Anchorage is a big place and there's not another University in town. I expected better though, I think the team is pretty average this year.

    MSU-Billings -- 475, good team, only game in town for miles around. Maybe there's another any NAIA school in Billings, I'm not sure. Recently they've played really good ball and people haven't shown up.

    WWU -- 442, they have the same coach but they are not the same program they were maybe a decade ago. I also don't think it's a big sports town but they probably should work on getting better crowds.

    St Martin's -- 407, head scratcher here. St Martin's is going on nearly a decade of really good, competitive basketball. It's not like Olympia is a hot spot, especially in the cold, rainy winter. They should get better crowds. They are well coached and have exciting players.

    Alaska Fairbanks -- 286, it seems like they could be doing better with a new coach, who is pretty good. Not a great team but they can upset anybody on any given night. Decent size population up there. Probably could draw better at the gate.

    Simon Fraser -- 270, I've never understood Simon Fraser's desire to play American sports. It's supposedly supposed to give them some boost in publicity and reputation. When you cut your football program and then you're getting 270 people a game in men's basketball, I'm sorry but you suck. Join the Canadian League.

    Seattle Pacific -- 270, Underachievers of the decade. I remember when they used to contend for national titles for a span of about six or seven years. Those two coaches have long since left, as did Ryan Looney who was pretty good. But as I noted in a story a couple weeks ago, you wouldn't know the campus existed even in the Queen Anne neighborhood, of which it resides. They're not good this year but they could do better at the gate.

    WOU -- 127, this is what happens when you suck beyond compare. I believe they are working on the worst record in school history. The athletic department doesn't want people to know that and they don't want you to know no one's going to the games. They actually don't want you to know anything. It's really bad there in men's and women's hoops and I'm not confident they're going to do the things to change it.

    * What these numbers show me is that the West Coast really isn't big into sports. But two, these athletic departments just don't market their programs at all. They expect people to show up when they don't even know when the games are. You wouldn't have to hire some expensive marketing firm or even a full-time marketing person. Find some business students or marketing majors to come up with a program. They could do a better job than what's going on right now. I still think division 2 Athletics is a pretty good product, they simply need to promote it better. They seem to be afraid of failing. They are already failing at the gate, except for Northwest Nazarene and Central Washington.
    Last edited by tsull; 02-13-2025, 06:08 PM.

  • #2
    The city of Billings does have another college. Rocky Mountain college, a traditionally strong NAIA basketball power. Quick Check shows that they're only drawing 338 on average at the gate, so they're not really dipping into MSU Billings attendance.

    This begs the question of why the small colleges just can't attract fans. I think marketing is just not part of their mission. Seems odd to me.

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    • #3
      Keep in mind there are usually a few games that either a) are on days without students in town, or b) against terrible opposition, that drive numbers down a bit. So you're probably drawing slightly better crowds for bigger games.

      Western averaged 690 two years ago, 591 last year, so that 442 number is definitely disappointing. Still have the Central game upcoming, and a Senior night against NNU on a Saturday should get at least 600, so hopefully that puts us back over 500 by the end of the year.

      Pretty sure Anchorage and Western better for Volleyball, where both teams had down years as far as wins and losses. I think I remember hearing a couple years ago that Volleyball is actually a better revenue sport per home game than basketball for Western, don't remember if it was by a significant margin. Both of those schools are actually getting outdrawn by their Women's team too.

      It is encouraging that 7 teams are doing better than everyone but Chico in the CCAA.

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      • #4
        I'm inclined to agree with you on D2 needing to be marketed better, but it is tough to sell live sports to a society that gets all of it's entertainment online. My suspicion is that the marketing training that a young professional gets both in school and on the job just doesn't work to reach these kinds of markets. Here in Emporia, we put out posters that say "Basketball Schedule" on them, but don't actually have a schedule, just a QR code. How are you going to catch the attention of people in small-town America with a QR code? I haven't lived on the West coast in 5 years, not sure what people are trying out there.

        I'm also not a huge fan of the price point to get in. $12+ a ticket feels like you're paying for something bigger than local entertainment, but D2 is effectively local entertainment. I'm sure there's some business-economic model that says that's the necessary price, but I get why people stay home instead, especially for lower-quality games. I know you can't really set the price based on the quality of the team, but good D2 basketball is worth $12-$20, average D2 basketball often isn't.

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        • #5
          It seemed like just a few years ago I looked and UAA was averaging close to 900 a game. 1200 to 1400 for big games wasn’t unheard of. This drop in attendance tracks with what I’ve been seeing. Just an overall apathy with the men’s program by fans, by administration and by the community. It’s all about the women’s program. The Great Alaska Shootout, where D1 teans come to play, was a staple of the men’s program since the 70s, today it’s a tournament for the women only. They cut the men’s team out of it. For one because the men’s product isn’t at a level anymore that they could compete but also there just isn’t the sponsorship interest in supporting it for the ment. I don’t know what needs to happen to reignite the men’s program but it isn’t working under its current construction.

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          • #6
            CWU had three games during Christmas break that were all under 500. One of those was against NW Missouri State that has 3 or 4 national titles in the past 7 years. The basketball nutcase in me thought that would drive tickets, but like we were talking about on the football board, most people aren't into D2 athletics like us junkies. Our home game against Western had less than 800 people, but that game has to be played on a Thursday. This year's contest was a Saturday. Two of our better attended games however were on MLK weekend, where we were basically at 1100 both days. The OT win over NNU had almost 1300, so maybe we just don't do well in December draws since CWU's attendance is trending upward. Our last two home games are this week.

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            • #7
              CWU men had 897 at the game last night. Honestly, I thought it was more. Certainly felt like it and sounded like it. Whatever the actual number, the crowd was good.

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              • #8
                Originally posted by Goods View Post
                CWU men had 897 at the game last night. Honestly, I thought it was more. Certainly felt like it and sounded like it. Whatever the actual number, the crowd was good.
                That's an excellent number anytime you're over 700 and hovering near a thousand I think that's really good and what division two should be. If you're under 500 you're athletic director needs three examine things or leave. You should be able to get 500 students from the student body if you had some decent marketing going on.

                Great job Central Washington, I want to see what others can do.
                Last edited by tsull; 02-22-2025, 10:12 AM.

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                • #9
                  Northwest Nazarene gets over 2,000 fans last night in their game against last place Western Oregon. That's an impressive showing, good job Nighthawk fans.

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                  • #10
                    For what it's worth, I went to Hays this weekend in West Kansas and was one of 3,375 there for both legs of the double header. That's in a county with a population under 30,000, with the nearest bigger (not big) cities over an hour away. Obviously a very different culture here in Kansas, but drawing for D2 can be done - Fort Hays State has had one home conference game under 2,000. I wonder if admins on the West coast are looking at what other institutions do to promote D2 athletics that is working better?

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by D2Rover View Post
                      For what it's worth, I went to Hays this weekend in West Kansas and was one of 3,375 there for both legs of the double header. That's in a county with a population under 30,000, with the nearest bigger (not big) cities over an hour away. Obviously a very different culture here in Kansas, but drawing for D2 can be done - Fort Hays State has had one home conference game under 2,000. I wonder if admins on the West coast are looking at what other institutions do to promote D2 athletics that is working better?
                      Super impressive, those are D1 mid-major numbers. Good idea on A.D.'s perhaps researching what other schools do. Small county and they get 3K+. I'm sure the A.D.'s over here would say, "Yeah, but Huskies, Beavers, Ducks, etc., are close by, we can't do anything." That's the attitude. Just open the doors, turn on the lights and watch 200 fans (if that) take their seats.

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by D2Rover View Post
                        Keep in mind there are usually a few games that either a) are on days without students in town, or b) against terrible opposition, that drive numbers down a bit. So you're probably drawing slightly better crowds for bigger games.

                        Western averaged 690 two years ago, 591 last year, so that 442 number is definitely disappointing. Still have the Central game upcoming, and a Senior night against NNU on a Saturday should get at least 600, so hopefully that puts us back over 500 by the end of the year.

                        Pretty sure Anchorage and Western better for Volleyball, where both teams had down years as far as wins and losses. I think I remember hearing a couple years ago that Volleyball is actually a better revenue sport per home game than basketball for Western, don't remember if it was by a significant margin. Both of those schools are actually getting outdrawn by their Women's team too.

                        It is encouraging that 7 teams are doing better than everyone but Chico in the CCAA.
                        Broke 1,000 for all three home games after this post, ended up averaging 589 for the year. Still not beautiful, but much more respectable than the sub-500 numbers we were at for most of the season, basically where we were last year.

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