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  • #76
    Originally posted by boatcapt View Post

    So you admit that the flag was the point. Kapernick chose it for a reason which was insulting to most veterans. But in his personal opinion HIS cause was of greater importance that the insult that millions of Americans, black, white, hispanic, and every other color felt about his choice of protest vehicles.

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    • #77
      But when the veterans protest back and point out that they find his form of protest disrespectful to those that faught to give him the very right to protest, he and his supporters say 1. He isn't disrespecting them and 2. They should be OK with his protest because one Green Beret said it was OK.

      I would say that his chosen protest actually hastened the rioting, killing, destruction and looting we are now seeing play out.

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      • #78
        Originally posted by boatcapt View Post

        But when the veterans protest back and point out that they find his form of protest disrespectful to those that faught to give him the very right to protest, he and his supporters say 1. He isn't disrespecting them and 2. They should be OK with his protest because one Green Beret said it was OK.

        I would say that his chosen protest actually hastened the rioting, killing, destruction and looting we are now seeing play out.

        Comment


        • #79
          As this is a chat board, my opinion. Kaperneck is a scum bag and should be banned from the NFL for life. The us Flag to me stands for those who died in military service to this country. If you don't like the USA.... Bye bye, you are free to leave. It is out of respect for these people, black, white, green, Asian or wherever they came from is not important. What's important is that they were there to face death (and many gave). They wrote a blank check to death with their name signed. Some were cashed in many were not. To me anyone who takes a knee dishonors that pledge. If you don't like it, bring back the dead or get the hell out.
          Just my opinion.
          Go ahead fire away.
          I don't care and you'll never change my mind

          Comment


          • #80
            Originally posted by Sec10-A-14 View Post
            As this is a chat board, my opinion. Kaperneck is a scum bag and should be banned from the NFL for life. The us Flag to me stands for those who died in military service to this country. If you don't like the USA.... Bye bye, you are free to leave. It is out of respect for these people, black, white, green, Asian or wherever they came from is not important. What's important is that they were there to face death (and many gave). They wrote a blank check to death with their name signed. Some were cashed in many were not. To me anyone who takes a knee dishonors that pledge. If you don't like it, bring back the dead or get the hell out.
            Just my opinion.
            Go ahead fire away.
            I don't care and you'll never change my mind
            We're all entitled to our opinions, however wrong they may be.

            He cares about the USA, he just doesn't meet your subjective idea of patriotism. He's trying to make this country better for a group of people historically ignored. He's gotten people to talk about the issue at the very least, so it was probably a success in that regard. If you aren't willing to at least try to see it, that's fine - but then you should expect for other people not to see your side of it either.

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            • #81
              I'm not going to tell anyone how they should feel about it.

              In my opinion, only: The ability to disrespect the flag is the very thing that the flag is supposed to stand for. Having heard and studied the story of the flag and its' creation, the symbolism speaks to me, and I always stand with my hat off during the anthem. On a personal level, the kneeling doesn't bother me at all, especially now that I know more about the reasoning behind it and thought that went into it. I think it's about 10,000 times more disrepectful to be talking to your friends, playing on your phone, or sitting on your arse drinking beer and/or eating nachos during the anthem, and there are lot more people doing that than kneeling at games.

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              • #82
                Originally posted by Predatory Primates View Post
                I'm not going to tell anyone how they should feel about it.

                In my opinion, only: The ability to disrespect the flag is the very thing that the flag is supposed to stand for. Having heard and studied the story of the flag and its' creation, the symbolism speaks to me, and I always stand with my hat off during the anthem. On a personal level, the kneeling doesn't bother me at all, especially now that I know more about the reasoning behind it and thought that went into it. I think it's about 10,000 times more disrepectful to be talking to your friends, playing on your phone, or sitting on your arse drinking beer and/or eating nachos during the anthem, and there are lot more people doing that than kneeling at games.
                Well said!!!

                Comment


                • #83
                  Originally posted by Sec10-A-14 View Post
                  As this is a chat board, my opinion. Kaperneck is a scum bag and should be banned from the NFL for life. The us Flag to me stands for those who died in military service to this country. If you don't like the USA.... Bye bye, you are free to leave. It is out of respect for these people, black, white, green, Asian or wherever they came from is not important. What's important is that they were there to face death (and many gave). They wrote a blank check to death with their name signed. Some were cashed in many were not. To me anyone who takes a knee dishonors that pledge. If you don't like it, bring back the dead or get the hell out.
                  Just my opinion.
                  Go ahead fire away.
                  I don't care and you'll never change my mind
                  We won't waste our time...

                  Comment


                  • #84
                    This is admittedly a little disingenuous, as there is a National Anthem code (Title 36 USC 301) that says people should stand at attention with their hands over their heart (but look around at the next ballgame and see how many people/players actually do that). Still good food for thought imo.




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                    • #85
                      Suddenly those of us that believe it is disrespectful to kneel during the flag ceremony are the horrible people. None of you have taken that position but many have.

                      I have posted this before, but here it is again. I became friends with a black football player and we developed a good relationship. I kept teasing him that he was going to stay in Goodwell, Oklahoma, after he graduated instead of going home to the big city. He couldn't wait to get back to the city. Finally, as graduation approached and we were having the same back-and-forth, I told him to go back home to his neighborhood and encourage people to get an education. He took on a very serious face and said, "You don't do that in my neighborhood". That has remained with me. Therein lies the problem.

                      Democrats created the projects, which was probably an improvement in many peoples lives. But then, they threw away the key. They didn't create opportunities to go with the new housing. They didn't improve their educational opportunities.

                      I have a hard time being sympathetic at times. There is no uproar over black-on-black violence. Where is the riot over the black man who was arrested in the murder of a 19 year-old black woman and a 75 year-old white woman, both who attended a George Floyd rally? What about the 92 year-old woman using a walker who was shoved to the ground by an individual as he walked by her on the sidewalk?

                      Before you call me racist, you need to consider the make-up of my family. We are black, brown, white, mixed-race. I have had all races and religions in my home. I have helped a non-citizen attend college. What matters is your character and what's in your heart.

                      I am beginning to understand why they take a knee and understand that it is not necessarily meant to mean disrespect to the flag. However, they have a lot of house cleaning to do before they blame whites for every one of their problems.

                      BTW, my black brother-in-law will agree with me on most of this.
                      Last edited by OPSUALUM77&81; 06-16-2020, 07:00 PM.

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                      • #86

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                        • #87
                          You do realize that there was a time when blacks and whites were segregated at the same event. When I people say XYZ should be free of politics, it's usually because people want to avoid the issue. You're right, it's not comfortable to mix sports with politics. But that's the point.

                          Comment


                          • #88
                            Originally posted by njmav1 View Post

                            You do realize that there was a time when blacks and whites were segregated at the same event. When I people say XYZ should be free of politics, it's usually because people want to avoid the issue. You're right, it's not comfortable to mix sports with politics. But that's the point.
                            There's this idea that sports has become political all of a sudden. It's really been political all along, or at the very least has always been influenced by outside issues. The two have never been mutually exclusive. The 1980 hockey team would have just been another "big upset" if it weren't for the political angle. We wouldn't know who Jackie Robinson was if politics weren't involved, etc etc.

                            I'm not saying you didn't know that, I'm just stating it in general.

                            Comment


                            • #89
                              Originally posted by Techster88 View Post
                              But at the local level where every day folks live is where businesses will stop sponsoring local youth because they will not want to upset any of the locals.
                              "Think of the kids" always makes my skin crawl, but if the children are of a legitimate concern - think of the kids who see Collin Kaepernick fighting for change who start to make strides in their own life. Think of the kids who have been touched by racism or violence who see something positive in what's going on. Think of the kids who need this.

                              If Billy doesn't get the newest set of baseballs for his summer league, I think he's going to be just fine. Back when I was a kid, we didn't have corporate sponsors. The city hosted the league, locals volunteered their time, and we brought our own equipment - whatever we had, and we did just fine.

                              Comment


                              • #90
                                Originally posted by SW_Mustang View Post

                                "Think of the kids" always makes my skin crawl, but if the children are of a legitimate concern - think of the kids who see Collin Kaepernick fighting for change who start to make strides in their own life. Think of the kids who have been touched by racism or violence who see something positive in what's going on. Think of the kids who need this.

                                If Billy doesn't get the newest set of baseballs for his summer league, I think he's going to be just fine. Back when I was a kid, we didn't have corporate sponsors. The city hosted the league, locals volunteered their time, and we brought our own equipment - whatever we had, and we did just fine.
                                And we walked uphill BOTH ways!!!

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