PASSHE Institutions Merging

[boatcapt]

Yep. And the decreased state funding made the PASSHE price creep higher and higher to the point that students looking to go there deem it a better value to just pay a little more to go to one of the other schools.

Layer on top of that competition from the SNHU's of the world that can provide online classes anywhere...and you have a hyper competitive market.

So what do you do? Do you work on trying to get your quality/brand image better? Do you work on cutting costs more? It's really probably the toughest market spot to be in.

A few months back I looked at the PASSHE approved budgets for the last 10ish years. Only once over the time frame was the budget cut. As I recall the years were evenly divided between the same budget the year before and a budget increase.

PASSHE is in a tough place...They can't really compete with the name universities and can't really compete on a precieved quality stand point.

[complaint_hopeful]

A good reason to fight against the merger plan. If a university can keep it's name and athletic programs, they should be able to keep the money they raised.

I would think they'd let them keep it as alumni donate to specific schools. If they thought the money went elsewhere, they'd likely not give. Which gets into a lot of the discussions we're having.

[Fightingscot82]

That really is excellent. But how are you going to justify keeping that $60 million at the Bloomsburg campus?

My understanding is that just like with other functions, back-end operations for alumni relations & fundraising will be pooled (database management, prospect research, estate giving, etc) but Bloom will ask Bloom alumni for money for Bloom purposes. Endowments are managed differently at each school. The Edinboro group I'm affiliated with holds roughly $1.5 million in endowed funds for Edinboro. Since we're a separate 501c3 non-profit that money's not going anywhere. There would be some legal work to combine foundations.

[iupgroundhog]

A good reason to fight against the merger plan. If a university can keep it's name and athletic programs, they should be able to keep the money they raised.

Have the big mahoff's figured this out yet?

[Bart]

That really is excellent. But how are you going to justify keeping that $60 million at the Bloomsburg campus?

A good reason to fight against the merger plan. If a university can keep it's name and athletic programs, they should be able to keep the money they raised.

[Fightingscot82]

That's not even mentioning the elite Carnegie Mellon level.

I think by his description they're Tier 2.

[IUPbigINDIANS]

Seems that there are three "types" of 4 year colleges in PA. 1. Schools with a big name (Penn State, Pitt and I guess Temple). These schools use that name to charge higher tuition and are able to bring in a very large number of students. 2. Privates that "sell" their academic superiority/exclusivity. They bring in students looking for higher academics and/or the snob appeal of an "exclusive" college. 3. Schools that compete by being the lowest priced and least exclusive in town. They are like a volume car dealer, you get the best price but none of the frills (big name, academic reputation, snob appeal). Id put the PASSHE in the last category. Problem is that not as many people are buying cars anymore. Also the dealership seems to have forgotten its business model and are trying to compete with the 1's and 2's.

That's not even mentioning the elite Carnegie Mellon level.

[complaint_hopeful]

Seems that there are three "types" of 4 year colleges in PA. 1. Schools with a big name (Penn State, Pitt and I guess Temple). These schools use that name to charge higher tuition and are able to bring in a very large number of students. 2. Privates that "sell" their academic superiority/exclusivity. They bring in students looking for higher academics and/or the snob appeal of an "exclusive" college. 3. Schools that compete by being the lowest priced and least exclusive in town. They are like a volume car dealer, you get the best price but none of the frills (big name, academic reputation, snob appeal). Id put the PASSHE in the last category. Problem is that not as many people are buying cars anymore. Also the dealership seems to have forgotten its business model and are trying to compete with the 1's and 2's.

Yep. And the decreased state funding made the PASSHE price creep higher and higher to the point that students looking to go there deem it a better value to just pay a little more to go to one of the other schools.

Layer on top of that competition from the SNHU's of the world that can provide online classes anywhere...and you have a hyper competitive market.

So what do you do? Do you work on trying to get your quality/brand image better? Do you work on cutting costs more? It's really probably the toughest market spot to be in.

[boatcapt]

Seems that there are three "types" of 4 year colleges in PA. 1. Schools with a big name (Penn State, Pitt and I guess Temple). These schools use that name to charge higher tuition and are able to bring in a very large number of students. 2. Privates that "sell" their academic superiority/exclusivity. They bring in students looking for higher academics and/or the snob appeal of an "exclusive" college. 3. Schools that compete by being the lowest priced and least exclusive in town. They are like a volume car dealer, you get the best price but none of the frills (big name, academic reputation, snob appeal). Id put the PASSHE in the last category. Problem is that not as many people are buying cars anymore. Also the dealership seems to have forgotten its business model and are trying to compete with the 1's and 2's.

[complaint_hopeful]

It looks like other states have schools merging or talking or merging:

University Merger Talks On The Rise (forbes.com)

[complaint_hopeful]

It's not like having several factories that serve the same market. There you can lop off excess capacity to fix the problem, except for some transportation considerations. Each school has it's own market, albeit overlapping to some extent. It has been shown how much it will cost to close schools, also.

Ultimately, the market will dictate the future of these schools. If after the first round of changes are made schools continue to lose enrollment or stay insolvent, further changes will be required. If that happens (and few people think it won't) schools may close or be repurposed. The slow demise of the schools will enable the constituent groups of the schools and the local area and local economy to absorb the loss in a less painful way. That's what I see on a macro level.

Plus, you have the SNHU's that can serve the market too...and have agreements with the Community Colleges. So it's not like it's just residential schools.

The pandemic has shown that basically any school can be an online school. But, not everyone can do it well.

[complaint_hopeful]

Probably way out of left field but just thinking out loud ... wonder if the PASSHE would ever consider -- in some manner -- selling off the perceived dead weight or poor-performing schools?

I'd have to think Pitt would love to have "Pitt-Clarion" or "Penn State-Lock Haven", etc. The towns don't get ravaged by a school closing. Things perhaps get a bit easier for the PASSHE to financially handle.

I guess the PASSHE downside is that's even more students their BFE branches can poach from us.

Of course, the way IUP is going maybe it becomes Happy Valley West.

Who knows ... maybe long term the majority of the PASSHE schools get gobbled up by Pitt and Penn State.

Quite a mess. With the privates -- the perceived 'better' schools -- offering mass discounts ... yet another massive hurdle for our lowly state schools.


To an extent today's kids are the children of the diploma factory 90s. Mom and Dad left IUP or Kutztown with a degree, debt and a job outside of their major. Going to college, per se, doesn't seem like it's being pushed like it was in the 80s and 90s. There are lots of other (sometimes better) paths to take. Just 25 years ago the perception was along the lines of go to college or go to McDonalds. Now for many of our majors it's go to college and straight to Starbucks or bartending.

There was some study, I believe before the current Chancellor got here that suggested merging or affiliating with a Penn State/Pitt/Temple or similar.

[iupgroundhog]

Ahhhh... Finally, as a consulting professional, the real necessary pain that I mentioned previously is being realized. In my opinion, the only way to solve this problem is to lop off excess capacity by closing some schools. It is also essential for the legislature to repair the mess they have contributed to creating. I don't know what the excess capacity is in PA but I suspect it would be somewhere in the 50% range. Also, Pitt, Temple, and Penn State have to be brought into the solution because they are a big part of the state colleges' mess. If they come onboard maybe there is some life left for some state schools becoming remote campuses of PSU, Temple, and Pitt (like UPJ).

It's not like having several factories that serve the same market. There you can lop off excess capacity to fix the problem, except for some transportation considerations. Each school has it's own market, albeit overlapping to some extent. It has been shown how much it will cost to close schools, also.

Ultimately, the market will dictate the future of these schools. If after the first round of changes are made schools continue to lose enrollment or stay insolvent, further changes will be required. If that happens (and few people think it won't) schools may close or be repurposed. The slow demise of the schools will enable the constituent groups of the schools and the local area and local economy to absorb the loss in a less painful way. That's what I see on a macro level.

[IUPbigINDIANS]

I believe that they would close campuses if they could, but there's a lot of debt tied up in these and when you close a school, the system is responsible for that debt.

To the previous poster, I agree that the state gov is responsible. I just don't see them looking at the Pitt's and Penn States...since a lot of them are alumni. I just don't see the gov fixing it. IF they increased funding to the state avg for higher ed, the issues go away.

Probably way out of left field but just thinking out loud ... wonder if the PASSHE would ever consider -- in some manner -- selling off the perceived dead weight or poor-performing schools?

I'd have to think Pitt would love to have "Pitt-Clarion" or "Penn State-Lock Haven", etc. The towns don't get ravaged by a school closing. Things perhaps get a bit easier for the PASSHE to financially handle.

I guess the PASSHE downside is that's even more students their BFE branches can poach from us.

Of course, the way IUP is going maybe it becomes Happy Valley West.

Who knows ... maybe long term the majority of the PASSHE schools get gobbled up by Pitt and Penn State.

Quite a mess. With the privates -- the perceived 'better' schools -- offering mass discounts ... yet another massive hurdle for our lowly state schools.


To an extent today's kids are the children of the diploma factory 90s. Mom and Dad left IUP or Kutztown with a degree, debt and a job outside of their major. Going to college, per se, doesn't seem like it's being pushed like it was in the 80s and 90s. There are lots of other (sometimes better) paths to take. Just 25 years ago the perception was along the lines of go to college or go to McDonalds. Now for many of our majors it's go to college and straight to Starbucks or bartending.

[iupgroundhog]

Nice points.

The whole Armenti privatized without a plan thing kind of saw the state funding declining and the amount of students in the pool decreasing. Now, the things like private schools discounting, etc...no one saw that. Although it's kind of a consequence of the 1st items.

And I remember, oh maybe 2 Chancellors ago talking about sharing services like Purchasing. And...it...didn't...happen...until...now. Seems like many things were identified as things that should be done over the years, but few were actually done. I guess that's the point I was going for.

But yes - your big point that when schools have record enrollment, it's hard to see the upcoming cliff coming. And I agree. And maybe instead of 10 years I should have said 7 years ago to when enrollment started to decline.

And as far as the identity...that's the million dollar question. How do they keep that and not upset current and former students? What is enough? What will be too confusing? It's such a tight-rope act.

A couple things here. About a week ago I posted a system redesign doc that reviewed the history of shared purchasing in the system. It's extensive and has been part of PASSHE since its original charter in 1983. Some things (actually the smaller line items) are more economical to purchase on a local basis, though.

Secondly, it was not impossible to see the enrollment decline coming. Everybody knew it. Ever since the year current college students were born we knew the demographics.