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PASSHE Institutions Merging

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  • iupgroundhog
    replied
    Originally posted by Bart View Post

    The loss of degree programs, increased virtual classes, sharing of campus news outlets, identity issues, and more. Bloom's size makes the others look better. Bloom's number is down about -3.71% or 261 students. LHU dropped 244 students or -8.53. Mansfield dropped 480, down -26.77. Yet Bloom gets marked with an 8% drop because of the others. Bloom had a 17% increase in first year students, while Mansfield's first year students dropped 9%, but when everything is averaged under Commonwealth, it doesn't look as bad.

    Not to mention Bloom's sports teams have taken a dive under Commonwealth. (funny stuff)
    You make good points but Bloom was well on its way to a slide when they got pulled into Commonwealth. As far as sports go, the decline started years before Commonwealth. For athletics, don't go by what I say, ask long-time Bloom supporters (e.g. Blue Jay et al).

    Leave a comment:


  • IUPNation
    replied
    Originally posted by Fightingscot82 View Post

    I don't see how that's much different than what was done.
    I think merging three schools together was too much. Clarion and Edinboro are fairly close together as are Lock Haven and Mansfield. Clarion and Mansfield were the weakest links. Edinboro and Lock Haven would have been the control schools. Maybe merging would have been smoother.

    The fact is there are too many schools north of 80. It’s too remote and kids from the suburbs generally don’t want to be stuck on a campus where there is nothing around it.
    Last edited by IUPNation; 10-31-2023, 08:51 AM.

    Leave a comment:


  • IUPbigINDIANS
    replied
    Originally posted by Ship69 View Post

    If those are the actual total enrollments, the "My God" is warranted.

    It's also becoming clear they are becoming 'athletic colleges'. A huge percentage of the enrollment, based on those numbers, are athletes.

    Leave a comment:


  • IUPbigINDIANS
    replied
    Originally posted by DawgPound View Post

    Cabrini will close at the end of the school year with an enrollment of ~3, 300. The public schools will go under as tax rolls continue to shrink and the endownments can't sustain the money demands to Jeep the school a float. The smart thing to do would be to sale the campuses and move the students to other PASSHE schools. But that's the smart thing to do and politicians have never followed financial common sense.
    That's easier said that done, however. Who is really going to buy up those buildings in remote places like Clarion? California is a dump aside from campus.

    It's a mess.

    Leave a comment:


  • Ship69
    replied
    Originally posted by IUPbigINDIANS View Post

    My God.
    If those are the actual total enrollments, the "My God" is warranted.

    Leave a comment:


  • DawgPound
    replied
    Originally posted by Fightingscot82 View Post

    No they don't report that out. Media in Pittsburgh had to do a FOIA request to get overall campus-level enrollment for this fall:

    California - 2,981
    Clarion - 2,034
    Edinboro - 2,532
    Global Online - 3,758
    Cabrini will close at the end of the school year with an enrollment of ~3, 300. The public schools will go under as tax rolls continue to shrink and the endownments can't sustain the money demands to Jeep the school a float. The smart thing to do would be to sale the campuses and move the students to other PASSHE schools. But that's the smart thing to do and politicians have never followed financial common sense.

    Leave a comment:


  • Fightingscot82
    replied
    Originally posted by IUPbigINDIANS View Post

    My God.
    Clarion has 1,745 dorm beds and 2,034 students. If they were a private liberal arts college with a huge endowment catering to rich kids, that wouldn't be terrible.

    Leave a comment:


  • Fightingscot82
    replied
    Originally posted by iupgroundhog View Post

    Bart, LHU didn't need to be "fostered" in any way. They were fine on their own. They had perhaps the most effective school President in the PASSHE and they were showing positive trends. LHU is small and always has been. That is not a problem. Remember that LHU didn't want the merger, either. It's hard to say which schools benefit or are hurt by the merger into the future. It is working a lot better than PennWest, though. Also, remember that Bloom got pulled in after SRU basically told Greenstein that they didn't want to be part of the western merger. I am not sure whether Bloom is hurt by the merger or not.

    Mansfield was saved by the merger.
    Commonwealth has stronger and stable executive management. They also have a better (and more attractive) variety of degree programs. Mansfield hurts the most because their degree programs are the most traditional (humanities and liberal arts), which are not popular with middle and working class Gen Z. This is the same problem at Penn West. The three campuses have very similar degree programs (so much overlap) but there's a lot that our core students want anymore. Penn West also has three campuses that were already doing poorly at recruiting students and after the merger they still have the same teams of poor recruiters now recruiting for this Penn West sh*t show. Slippery Rock was able to throw off the merger arguing that point exactly - the academic menu doesn't play nicely with Edinboro or Clarion. If anyone, SRU's overlays nicely with IUP.

    Nobody wanted the merger. Some presidents had the fortitude to speak out publicly. Those who wanted a chance at the permanent job played along nicely. Lock Haven's alumni were the most vocal but alumni have absolutely no power at our schools. We don't elect alumni trustees. The affiliate groups (foundation, alumni association, co-op, SGA, etc) don't have the money to bully their agendas. We generally don't have scion alumni who can dictate strategic initiatives.

    Leave a comment:


  • IUPbigINDIANS
    replied
    Originally posted by Fightingscot82 View Post

    No they don't report that out. Media in Pittsburgh had to do a FOIA request to get overall campus-level enrollment for this fall:

    California - 2,981
    Clarion - 2,034
    Edinboro - 2,532
    Global Online - 3,758
    My God.

    Leave a comment:


  • Fightingscot82
    replied
    Originally posted by SecretlySavage View Post
    "At PennWest, a union of the former Clarion, California and Edinboro University campuses in the more sparsely populated western regions of the state, the news was more bleak: first-time enrollment dropped by over 20 percent, contributing to an 11.5 percent overall enrollment decline."

    Anyone have that 20% broken down by campus or know where to find it?
    No they don't report that out. Media in Pittsburgh had to do a FOIA request to get overall campus-level enrollment for this fall:

    California - 2,981
    Clarion - 2,034
    Edinboro - 2,532
    Global Online - 3,758

    Leave a comment:


  • SecretlySavage
    replied
    "At PennWest, a union of the former Clarion, California and Edinboro University campuses in the more sparsely populated western regions of the state, the news was more bleak: first-time enrollment dropped by over 20 percent, contributing to an 11.5 percent overall enrollment decline."

    Anyone have that 20% broken down by campus or know where to find it?

    Leave a comment:


  • Bart
    replied
    Originally posted by iupgroundhog View Post

    Bart, LHU didn't need to be "fostered" in any way. They were fine on their own. They had perhaps the most effective school President in the PASSHE and they were showing positive trends. LHU is small and always has been. That is not a problem. Remember that LHU didn't want the merger, either. It's hard to say which schools benefit or are hurt by the merger into the future. It is working a lot better than PennWest, though. Also, remember that Bloom got pulled in after SRU basically told Greenstein that they didn't want to be part of the western merger. I am not sure whether Bloom is hurt by the merger or not.

    Mansfield was saved by the merger.
    The loss of degree programs, increased virtual classes, sharing of campus news outlets, identity issues, and more. Bloom's size makes the others look better. Bloom's number is down about -3.71% or 261 students. LHU dropped 244 students or -8.53. Mansfield dropped 480, down -26.77. Yet Bloom gets marked with an 8% drop because of the others. Bloom had a 17% increase in first year students, while Mansfield's first year students dropped 9%, but when everything is averaged under Commonwealth, it doesn't look as bad.

    Not to mention Bloom's sports teams have taken a dive under Commonwealth. (funny stuff)

    Leave a comment:


  • iupgroundhog
    replied
    Originally posted by Bart View Post

    They could have split them up, and had Bloom foster LHU and ESU foster Mansfield. Bloom will go down with the ship trying to keep both afloat.
    Bart, LHU didn't need to be "fostered" in any way. They were fine on their own. They had perhaps the most effective school President in the PASSHE and they were showing positive trends. LHU is small and always has been. That is not a problem. Remember that LHU didn't want the merger, either. It's hard to say which schools benefit or are hurt by the merger into the future. It is working a lot better than PennWest, though. Also, remember that Bloom got pulled in after SRU basically told Greenstein that they didn't want to be part of the western merger. I am not sure whether Bloom is hurt by the merger or not.

    Mansfield was saved by the merger.

    Leave a comment:


  • Fightingscot82
    replied
    Originally posted by Bart View Post

    They could have split them up, and had Bloom foster LHU and ESU foster Mansfield. Bloom will go down with the ship trying to keep both afloat.
    That's actually a pretty good idea. Unfortunately I'm not sure you could have done that in the West though.

    Leave a comment:


  • Bart
    replied
    Originally posted by Fightingscot82 View Post

    They needed an anchor to help manage things correctly. Merging just Lock Haven and Mansfield doesn't change anything.
    They could have split them up, and had Bloom foster LHU and ESU foster Mansfield. Bloom will go down with the ship trying to keep both afloat.

    Leave a comment:

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