Harding Football evidently out of money

[BisonBones]

Think what you want. I was giving when we weren’t in the playoffs and didn’t have winning records. I’m not saying there aren’t people who would stop giving if we didn’t have winning records. I’m just saying I’m not one of them. There’s other things that matter more to me. And, yes, it’s easier to motivate young men when they’re winning. Win or lose there’s more important things at stake. That’s one of reasons I like D2 athletics.

As a good coach once said, "I'm not afraid of losing, but I am afraid of winning at something that doesn't matter".

[BisonBones]

I'll bring up a bit of a tangent, but I may cite this thread whenever people moan about the GAC silo. I'd love to see the silo broken up as a football fan and see Harding schedule teams like Delta State or strong MIAA components, but there's a reason the GAC was created and travel budgets were a big part of that.

[HomegrownBison]

How does the university not catch heat for this from supporters?

Clearly tons of people love Bison football and the program is wildly successful. Are those people not frustrated by their coach having to fundraise for almost everything?

I'm just surprised to hear the school doesn't invest at the level many of us would expect.

It absolutely is surprising and something that does not make much sense. However, it is frustratingly true. Regardless of a very successful program in the last 10+ years and a national championship to boot the school in and of itself does very little regarding the FUNDING for the football program. Not that they do not support it, but financially nearly every dollar is donated. Simmons reaches out to old bisons frequently in many different ways to raise these funds. Posts like the one he made today are not new, or surprising to the bison faithful. Nor was it intended to be a slap in the face to the school. My 2 cents.

[OldBison]

How does the university not catch heat for this from supporters?

Clearly tons of people love Bison football and the program is wildly successful. Are those people not frustrated by their coach having to fundraise for almost everything?

I'm just surprised to hear the school doesn't invest at the level many of us would expect.

It’s a different mindset. This is private education focused on educational excellence from a distinctive Christian perspective. Everything has to be kept in balance with priorities that transcend athletics. Athletics are seen as an enhancement, not an essential priority.

[FoothillBison]

How does the university not catch heat for this from supporters?

Clearly tons of people love Bison football and the program is wildly successful. Are those people not frustrated by their coach having to fundraise for almost everything?

I'm just surprised to hear the school doesn't invest at the level many of us would expect.

Or maybe the Coach just outspends his budget more than other coaches in the conference. There is nothing about his post that was a shot at the school. At the end of the day, I’ll send some money and don’t care as long as he raises the money and continues to dominate!

[Bisons10]

Legitimate questions from all sides on this one. Hard for me to defend either side at this juncture.

[ReddieMade]

Or maybe the Coach just outspends his budget more than other coaches in the conference. There is nothing about his post that was a shot at the school. At the end of the day, I’ll send some money and don’t care as long as he raises the money and continues to dominate!

Certainly not a direct shot, no. But I just wonder how a school president or AD feels about the optics of a post like that. Obviously it seems like the Harding community is familiar with these, but the outside world has no clue. It just makes it look like they’re underfunded. Do other Harding coaches have to do this as well?

[BisonDOc]

Certainly not a direct shot, no. But I just wonder how a school president or AD feels about the optics of a post like that. Obviously it seems like the Harding community is familiar with these, but the outside world has no clue. It just makes it look like they’re underfunded. Do other Harding coaches have to do this as well?

There are probably better people on this board who have a much more intimate knowledge than I do now. The school president is a big fundraiser and currently working on increasing fundraising dollars overall for the university (not just athletics) and enrollment. The AD is the former Men BBall coach and has been at HU since 90's. He known Simmons well since he's been a coach there for close to 20 years. Obviously post like this have been happening for at least 3-4 years, so I think both are familiar with him asking in this manner and are okay with it because it works (my opinion, no direct knowledge). You can easily find many years of post like this on his Facebook page.

To answer your question, yes other HU coaches do this just in their own manner and not as publicly as Simmons. All coaches have to fundraise at the D2 level. Either you do and compete or you get left behind, especially at private institution.

Again I will express that part of some of this fundraising requirements is his own doing but what he prioritizes. His building with success on field, in the classroom, and spirituality with young men who come to HU and stay goes along way in why he can constantly do this.

[GorillaTeacher]

None of that came from the university? I knew the indoor was all fundraised, but the end zone complex, the moving the stands closer to the field, etc. That's wild. Always just assumed as the football program got better, they were getting more support.

That's really interesting to hear.

When people say that none of that comes from the university, they are all generally lying, accounting speaking. Nearly all sports programs run in the literal red and figurative red. Some states have laws, (KS, MO others...) say that you cannot use state funding for athletic scholarships, but you can use it for other things. With all the voodoo accounting state schools do to make it work, or at least appear as not a huge loss, you can guarantee that private schools that don't have as much public accountability do it even more. None of this to say that many of the projects are privately donated in large portions, some of the portions can be from other departments. I think for the playoff games, one of the student associations buys like 300 student tickets at PITT. It is well known that University accounting is the wild wild west and the vast majority (>90% of departments?) are subsidized by the university.

None of this counters that head coaches are largely fundraisers for their programs, and must play the politics game.

[OldBison]

Certainly not a direct shot, no. But I just wonder how a school president or AD feels about the optics of a post like that. Obviously it seems like the Harding community is familiar with these, but the outside world has no clue. It just makes it look like they’re underfunded. Do other Harding coaches have to do this as well?

I’d be less concerned with our optics and more with your own. Putting up 10 pts against the Bisons over the past two years is not a good look for supposedly the best offense in the conference.

[Searcy]

Harding just has a drastically different funding model than most schools. Let me give you some examples:

• Harding would regularly send out letters to their boosters and season ticket holders asking them to fund/provide holiday meals for various teams. Example: "Our basketball team has to stay in town during part of Christmas break due to games/tournaments/etc. Would you consider providing one of the meals for either the men's or women's teams during that time since the cafeteria will be closed?" That's a real letter I received on several occasions.
• Harding's athletic teams go on Spring Break mission trips (those evil college kids, spending their breaks helping less fortunate folks and spreading the gospel, right?), but the University didn't provide funding for those, either. I attended a church where every year we sent a check to the athletic department to cover the cost of transportation for the football team to go to the Timothy Hill Ranch in New York.
• Harding's buildings (athletic and academic) are pretty much 100% funded by donations from alumni and others. One example is the Thornton Educational Center, that was built when one of the Stephens' family members (not an alumnus) wrote a check to cover the cost of its construction to honor his sister (I believe), who was a retired educator.

It's not how things are done at most schools, but it works for Harding. For many years they were (I think still are) the least expensive private school in the state and is only a little more expensive than in state attendance at the University of Arkansas, the flagship University for the state. Not many private universities can say that.

[BisonDivot]

When people say that none of that comes from the university, they are all generally lying, accounting speaking. Nearly all sports programs run in the literal red and figurative red. Some states have laws, (KS, MO others...) say that you cannot use state funding for athletic scholarships, but you can use it for other things. With all the voodoo accounting state schools do to make it work, or at least appear as not a huge loss, you can guarantee that private schools that don't have as much public accountability do it even more. None of this to say that many of the projects are privately donated in large portions, some of the portions can be from other departments. I think for the playoff games, one of the student associations buys like 300 student tickets at PITT. It is well known that University accounting is the wild wild west and the vast majority (>90% of departments?) are subsidized by the university.

None of this counters that head coaches are largely fundraisers for their programs, and must play the politics game.

I'm sorry, but your post is just projection from the traditional "state funding model". Believe me, at Harding, the fundraising paying 100% for these buildings. There is no accounting voodoo, but there is a hard NO from accounting when it comes to spending university resources on non-academic projects. I will admit to a little knowledge on this subject.

[Mulerider]

Ehh... Harding has plenty of money. I'm sure the athletic department just has to make a few phone calls.

[GorillaTeacher]

I'm sorry, but your post is just projection from the traditional "state funding model". Believe me, at Harding, the fundraising paying 100% for these buildings. There is no accounting voodoo, but there is a hard NO from accounting when it comes to spending university resources on non-academic projects. I will admit to a little knowledge on this subject.

Dude it's not projection. If anything its probably more so voodoo accounting for private schools where they can just discount tuition as a scholarship. Just because the school is frugal, as they should be, doesn't mean they aren't paying. There are tons of articles about how athletic departments are funded out there, why would small school Harding be different?

[Divisiontwo]

Dude it's not projection. If anything its probably more so voodoo accounting for private schools where they can just discount tuition as a scholarship. Just because the school is frugal, as they should be, doesn't mean they aren't paying. There are tons of articles about how athletic departments are funded out there, why would small school Harding be different?

You’re talking about different things. We’re talking about the football operating budget and the improvements to the facilities cited initially. The football budget in itself is University funded, but not very well. not certain why you believe you know more about how Harding is operating than people with inside knowledge of the way things operate at a specific institution in regards to a specific issue.