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  • Originally posted by KleShreen View Post



    If D1 were to happen, I would fully expect XC to compete for D1 national titles. Right now, Northern Arizona is the most dominant XC program in the country. GV can compete with that.
    i'm gonna stop you right there and post the scoring five for each team from their most recent race, 2021 nationals for NAU and 2019 nationals for GV:

    NAU
    NAME, PLACE TIME POINTS
    Nico Young, 4th 29:58 3
    Blaise Ferro, 6th 30:02 5
    Abdihamid Nur, 7th 30:05 6
    Luis Grijalva, 9th 30:10 8
    Brodey Hastey, 44th 30:50 38

    GV
    same format
    Tanner Chada, 24th 30:20 20
    Noah Steffen, 27th 30:28 23
    Ben Zaremba, 34th 30:38 27
    Andrew Hylen, 51st 31:00 42
    Jesse Becker, 76th 31:19 65

    You aren't competing with NAU if your 5th man is scoring more than their entire team.

    Comment


    • Originally posted by Mk63NuclearBomb View Post

      i'm gonna stop you right there and post the scoring five for each team from their most recent race, 2021 nationals for NAU and 2019 nationals for GV:

      NAU
      NAME, PLACE TIME POINTS
      Nico Young, 4th 29:58 3
      Blaise Ferro, 6th 30:02 5
      Abdihamid Nur, 7th 30:05 6
      Luis Grijalva, 9th 30:10 8
      Brodey Hastey, 44th 30:50 38

      GV
      same format
      Tanner Chada, 24th 30:20 20
      Noah Steffen, 27th 30:28 23
      Ben Zaremba, 34th 30:38 27
      Andrew Hylen, 51st 31:00 42
      Jesse Becker, 76th 31:19 65

      You aren't competing with NAU if your 5th man is scoring more than their entire team.
      Sorry, I should have been more clear. NAU is dominating the men's XC in D1. They don't have a women's team. GV's women have been dominating XC in D2. There really is no dominant force in women's D1 XC. The GV women could easily take that spot. Men's XC, the GV men won the title in 2018. They are always near the top of the standings. They could easily become championship contenders and contend regularly.

      I'm just pointing out that XC is a sport where really any school can win titles in D1. It's not normally limited to only power conference schools or the D1 blue bloods like Alabama and Michigan and Stanford and UCLA and North Carolina and whatnot, as most other sports are. Anyone can win national titles in D1 XC.
      2021 D2Football Fantasy Champion

      Comment


      • Originally posted by Irishlaker View Post


        I don't get a say, but my preferred mode would be to let it ride for another couple of years. Cobbling football schedules together will have some difficulty, but the rest of the league and its sports are on decent footing. I'd like to see what happens how/when the P5 split off and the NCAA has to either dissolve or reorganize. Once the P5 are gone, THEN we could adjust our positioning and actually have a fighting to chance to derive some value out of the change and actually justify the expense involved...
        I'm with Irish on this one. Let the P5 go have their fun.

        In terms of positioning within the divisions, I've always felt that the football playing members of the GLIAC are too big for D2, but would get pounced in the existing D1. Assuming the G5, FCS, and non-football conferences merge to form a new D1, I would love to see the football schools create a Michigan conference with Eastern, Western, and Central while the non-football schools could either remain in D2 or join the Horizon.

        One can dream, I guess.

        Comment


        • Just for the sake of discussion, if GV and Ferris both decide to move up to FCS, how much more likely does that make the GLIAC pursuit of the Michigan NAIA football schools? I would think they are considering them at least a little at this point, but would that not be a big motivator in trying to get that done? I realize that the GLIAC simply cannot go pick up an NAIA school like going to the grocery store, but I have to think they could talk one of the 4 in Michigan to make the jump.

          Comment


          • Originally posted by Uindy18 View Post
            Just for the sake of discussion, if GV and Ferris both decide to move up to FCS, how much more likely does that make the GLIAC pursuit of the Michigan NAIA football schools? I would think they are considering them at least a little at this point, but would that not be a big motivator in trying to get that done? I realize that the GLIAC simply cannot go pick up an NAIA school like going to the grocery store, but I have to think they could talk one of the 4 in Michigan to make the jump.
            It's a tough issue, but I would ask why the GLIAC would wait for any other team to leave? Go after them YESTERDAY. If the reason is because FSU and GV are in the conference and that is chasing away new (small school) members, well, one should just resign oneself that the GLIAC is doomed. The GLIAC needs new football members now, not AFTER another institution leaves.

            It's a dream, but it's too bad that Indy doesn't want to shift to the GLIAC. Admittedly, it would indeed be a tough, if not impossible sell.

            And with the way things are trending, I think a departure from the GLIAC is in the cards sooner than later.

            Comment


            • From an outsiders view - I have always through that GV, Wayne St. and FSU kind of seem like DI MAC schools playing in DII. I'm sure that a MI local can tell me that there is a huge difference in the way the schools were set up years ago or function institutionally now, but that's just what I've always kind of thought from the outside looking in. Conversely, some of the private schools (basically the ones that left) seem set up very similar to DIII schools - they just have the ability to offer scholarships. On the surface, that appears to be a huge institutional (not just sports) difference. And add to that the OH / MI divide, and I don't think anyone should be too surprised by the split. To me, Northwood is the only huge surprise - I thought that geography would be enough to keep them in the GLIAC despite institutional differences. Now that Northwood is in, I would think that any MI private school in the southern part of the state (like a Madonna) would be at least as likely to look to the G-MAC as the GLIAC.

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Redwing View Post

                It's a tough issue, but I would ask why the GLIAC would wait for any other team to leave? Go after them YESTERDAY. If the reason is because FSU and GV are in the conference and that is chasing away new (small school) members, well, one should just resign oneself that the GLIAC is doomed. The GLIAC needs new football members now, not AFTER another institution leaves.

                It's a dream, but it's too bad that Indy doesn't want to shift to the GLIAC. Admittedly, it would indeed be a tough, if not impossible sell.

                And with the way things are trending, I think a departure from the GLIAC is in the cards sooner than later.
                I agree, the GLIAC needs more membership as quickly as they can get it. I wonder if they could snap their fingers and add all four Michigan NAIAs, would that convince Northwood to call off the GMAC move? I think it could help them retain Davenport, make the conference more balanced, and maybe make up with Northwood. All of which I would want regardless of what GV and FSU decide to do.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Uindy18 View Post

                  I agree, the GLIAC needs more membership as quickly as they can get it. I wonder if they could snap their fingers and add all four Michigan NAIAs, would that convince Northwood to call off the GMAC move? I think it could help them retain Davenport, make the conference more balanced, and maybe make up with Northwood. All of which I would want regardless of what GV and FSU decide to do.
                  Sounds like a good path forward, but I'm not holding my breath. I do find it interesting that SVSU gets left out for much of these discussions. So GV, FSU, WSU, SVSU can all be more or less in the same boat. Davenport is also a bit of an odd duck. They are private but I think they have a +7k student count (and growing), so I wouldn't consider them small... though not large.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by Uindy18 View Post

                    I agree, the GLIAC needs more membership as quickly as they can get it. I wonder if they could snap their fingers and add all four Michigan NAIAs, would that convince Northwood to call off the GMAC move? I think it could help them retain Davenport, make the conference more balanced, and maybe make up with Northwood. All of which I would want regardless of what GV and FSU decide to do.
                    Northwood didn't make the decision to move to the GMAC on the spur of the moment. They decided it was the best thing to do for them. While it may not make sense to a lot of people, they probably have knowledge of other upcoming GMAC plans.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Redwing View Post

                      Sounds like a good path forward, but I'm not holding my breath. I do find it interesting that SVSU gets left out for much of these discussions. So GV, FSU, WSU, SVSU can all be more or less in the same boat. Davenport is also a bit of an odd duck. They are private but I think they have a +7k student count (and growing), so I wouldn't consider them small... though not large.
                      I know in the past, there hasn't been much support for athletics at SVSU from the top of the food chain. I believe that left when Gilbertson hit the trails, though. I think the new president is much more supportive of SVSU athletics.
                      2021 D2Football Fantasy Champion

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by UFOILERFAN View Post

                        Northwood didn't make the decision to move to the GMAC on the spur of the moment. They decided it was the best thing to do for them. While it may not make sense to a lot of people, they probably have knowledge of other upcoming GMAC plans.
                        True, it is also true that these conference changes can change rapidly, and who knows what could happen by the time NU joins in 2022? I believe the GMAC had announced additions of Georgetown, UVA-Wise, and Cumberlands which all fell through when they did not get NCAA approval. GLVC did a similar thing with Benedictine in Chicago, but with the school pulling the plug, not the NCAA.

                        Nothing against Northwood, but if the GLIAC were to stabilize with a more balanced group of public/private schools over the next 5 years (or over the next year), I could seem them swing back to the GLIAC at some point.

                        End of the day, geographic outliers tend to find more comfortable conference situations over time. Most of the GMAC is a great example of that.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by BlueBlood View Post
                          Now that Northwood is in, I would think that any MI private school in the southern part of the state (like a Madonna) would be at least as likely to look to the G-MAC as the GLIAC.
                          Agree. With Hillsdale and Northwood in the GMAC, there is every reason to believe that Davenport is a future possibility and that IF private MI NAIAs want to go D2, they will strongly consider the GMAC.

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by Stea1th View Post

                            Agree. With Hillsdale and Northwood in the GMAC, there is every reason to believe that Davenport is a future possibility and that IF private MI NAIAs want to go D2, they will strongly consider the GMAC.
                            Fair, on the GLIAC side, i have to think that the pitch will be "Look at how well Davenport transitioned over from NAIA in our conference. You can do the same here."" I am not so sure the GMAC would be an option for those schools if they wanted to make a jump as they do not really need the new members.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by mtsax305 View Post

                              I'm with Irish on this one. Let the P5 go have their fun.

                              In terms of positioning within the divisions, I've always felt that the football playing members of the GLIAC are too big for D2, but would get pounced in the existing D1. Assuming the G5, FCS, and non-football conferences merge to form a new D1, I would love to see the football schools create a Michigan conference with Eastern, Western, and Central while the non-football schools could either remain in D2 or join the Horizon.

                              One can dream, I guess.
                              It'd be something, wouldn't it? I mean, this is totally living in fantasyland but imagine a league that looked like this:

                              Ferris
                              Central
                              Saginaw
                              Eastern
                              Wayne
                              Toledo
                              Bowling Green
                              Western
                              Davenport
                              Grand Valley

                              This could be simply a football conference, but it'd be one heckuva league in total. Every trip is under 4 hours. Undergrad enrollments are well-aligned (Saggy and DU are a bit light, GV is a tad heavy). A couple of research institutions, etc. DU is the only private, but they aren't the same sort of private that everyone thinks of...in truth, they honestly might bear a closer resemblance to this list than they would a list of typical D2-style privates (heavy on-line and non-traditional enrollment, 10 campuses, etc.). And, they are comparatively well funded.

                              Again, it's fantasyland but once we are in a post-P5 world, who knows what's possible?

                              I agree with the idea that GLIAC expansion at this moment seems like an uphill climb. Given what we have seen over the last few years, I'm hard-pressed to see how some of the candidates mentioned (Larry Tech, Madonna, Siena, et al) would consider the GLIAC ahead of the GMAC...and that's tied to the presumption that any of them are actually looking to move up. RW is right that these moves (if the GLIAC were serious about them) should have been in motion a while ago.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Stea1th View Post

                                Agree. With Hillsdale and Northwood in the GMAC, there is every reason to believe that Davenport is a future possibility and that IF private MI NAIAs want to go D2, they will strongly consider the GMAC.
                                For that reason, I would say the GLIAC should not pursue any private school to join the conference. Every single one that joined has left. All remaining members (minus Davenport) are public universities and it's only a matter of time before Davenport departs as well. From what I've heard, they're hurting financially. Throwing money at the athletic program to compete with GVSU can only last so long.

                                Comment

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