The Enigma that is Wayne State

[KleShreen]

Certainly one man's opinion. On the contrary, with actual knowledge of having played at Wayne that is not a correct assumption based on my experience and teammates we've had. In the past decade alone we've had plenty players from Birmingham, West Bloomfield, Rochester, Clarkson, Lake Orion, Northville, etc. And a lot of these players were all-region/all-state caliber players.

Couple things to clarify for you, WSU's campus is in Midtown Detroit which is a pretty built up and nice part of the city. A lot of neat things to do there if you haven't visited the area in awhile. Detroit Mercy on the other hand doesn't have a lot going for it in on that side of Detroit.

I spend plenty of time in Detroit proper. Just spent a weekend right near Comerica and enjoyed the best breakfast sandwiches on Earth at Iggy's. Of course there's exceptions. That's why I said "most" high schoolers from affluent Detroit suburbs are not trying to go spend time in Detroit. Not the ones who are of the talent level to bring Wayne out of their hole. Wayne isn't picking up the suburban Detroit kids who are weighing a D-II offer vs an FCS or MAC offer. Ferris and GV are. Wayne is not.

[GV Retired Bum]

I spend plenty of time in Detroit proper. Just spent a weekend right near Comerica and enjoyed the best breakfast sandwiches on Earth at Iggy's. Of course there's exceptions. That's why I said "most" high schoolers from affluent Detroit suburbs are not trying to go spend time in Detroit. Not the ones who are of the talent level to bring Wayne out of their hole. Wayne isn't picking up the suburban Detroit kids who are weighing a D-II offer vs an FCS or MAC offer. Ferris and GV are. Wayne is not.

Now you are saying they are choosing GV or Ferris because those kids are more talented and have interest from the FCS or MAC school, which is completely different then your original statement. Kids want to stay home and play in Detroit, we have had teammates from that area, countless of them wanted to stay, but they left because GV or Ferris was better options for football. Which comes back to my original point that Wayne should be better if they had a coach that could bring some excitement around the program. That would draw in more recruits. Kids arent leaving because they "want to get out of" detroit, they are leaving because Wayne has consistently shown to be underwhelming due to poor leadership from top to bottom.

[Thelakerman]

[The Warrior]

This seems to be quite the thread. Some of the statements that were made were spot on and others were far-fetched.

As a very recent alumnus of the program, and a "suburban recruit". I want to address a few points that were made here.

1. Leadership: Coming from a high school program that has won state championships and consistently competed for them. I can honestly Wayne State football has no real leadership. The program has leaders based on Title. There is no true servant leadership amongst those in positions of leadership. As a former player, I can genuinely say I can only count on a few of the coaches to this day if I ever needed something. To me, leadership spans beyond the field. That is the starting point. From top to bottom leadership is poor. If you desire to win games this is where it starts on any great football team. Not to mention the greatest leader/coach/man in the locker room they let get away to Allendale. Wooster was the heart and soul of the program. Can almost guarantee if He was at that helm the past 18 we would not be having this discussion.

The program is a dictatorship. Everything is Winters way or the highway. He does not allow his offensive assistants to vocalize their expertise let alone allow them to have an impact on a game. I can honestly say if some of the assistants had more input on in-game play calling Wayne state would win more games. Winters is extremely distant from the players and I can confidently say many do not enjoy playing for him. Many guys stay because of the bonds we make in the locker room. Me being one of those guys. His ego has been the reason we have lost games during my stent. His ego has caused us to lose talented players. If he is unwilling to change his ways the program will not win under his guidance. Judging by the last 18 years I will let you all decide.

2. Recruiting: First things first, Pound for pound Wayne state has one of the most talented rosters in the GLIAC before and after many teams left. The reason many of you believe there is a massive talent deficit is that the talent many times is not being put in positions to be successful. Think square peg round hole. I can assure you many Detroit kids want to stay home and play for their home city. Many decide to go elsewhere because of the negative things they see on the field as well as what they have been told about the Head Coach. Also, there is not an emphasis on recruiting at home in the city of Detroit. I never understood this but we do not seek to recruit the city of Detroit the way we should. The experience I had in midtown Detroit is to date some of the best times of my life and I am certain it will remain that way. Wayne State is one of if not THE BEST campus lifestyle in the conference. We should have no problem getting great talent. When it comes to scholarships if it is true that the program is short, we must get more creative and overcome this somehow in some way.

3. The facilities Have to get better and have to get better fast. Uniforms are not the fix. The excuse for funding is not valid to me. Again, you are in the heart of Detroit there are plenty of companies and businesses that would love to do a partnership with the athletics department. When it comes to facilities The university/ Athletic department lacks innovation.

All in all. We have to look at leadership. In a perfect world, we clean house and get a fresh staff in but I do not foresee that happening. There is no pressure to win from the president and the AD which leads into the head coach and assistants. Until winning becomes an emphasis the program will continue to be mediocre. The program needs fresh energy but I just do not see that happening anytime soon due to the relationship between AD and Winters. So as Warriors fans we will just have to continue to weather the storm and let time run its course.

Go, Warriors!

[Thelakerman]

This seems to be quite the thread. Some of the statements that were made were spot on and others were far-fetched.

As a very recent alumnus of the program, and a "suburban recruit". I want to address a few points that were made here.

1. Leadership: Coming from a high school program that has won state championships and consistently competed for them. I can honestly Wayne State football has no real leadership. The program has leaders based on Title. There is no true servant leadership amongst those in positions of leadership. As a former player, I can genuinely say I can only count on a few of the coaches to this day if I ever needed something. To me, leadership spans beyond the field. That is the starting point. From top to bottom leadership is poor. If you desire to win games this is where it starts on any great football team. Not to mention the greatest leader/coach/man in the locker room they let get away to Allendale. Wooster was the heart and soul of the program. Can almost guarantee if He was at that helm the past 18 we would not be having this discussion.

The program is a dictatorship. Everything is Winters way or the highway. He does not allow his offensive assistants to vocalize their expertise let alone allow them to have an impact on a game. I can honestly say if some of the assistants had more input on in-game play calling Wayne state would win more games. Winters is extremely distant from the players and I can confidently say many do not enjoy playing for him. Many guys stay because of the bonds we make in the locker room. Me being one of those guys. His ego has been the reason we have lost games during my stent. His ego has caused us to lose talented players. If he is unwilling to change his ways the program will not win under his guidance. Judging by the last 18 years I will let you all decide.

2. Recruiting: First things first, Pound for pound Wayne state has one of the most talented rosters in the GLIAC before and after many teams left. The reason many of you believe there is a massive talent deficit is that the talent many times is not being put in positions to be successful. Think square peg round hole. I can assure you many Detroit kids want to stay home and play for their home city. Many decide to go elsewhere because of the negative things they see on the field as well as what they have been told about the Head Coach. Also, there is not an emphasis on recruiting at home in the city of Detroit. I never understood this but we do not seek to recruit the city of Detroit the way we should. The experience I had in midtown Detroit is to date some of the best times of my life and I am certain it will remain that way. Wayne State is one of if not THE BEST campus lifestyle in the conference. We should have no problem getting great talent. When it comes to scholarships if it is true that the program is short, we must get more creative and overcome this somehow in some way.

3. The facilities Have to get better and have to get better fast. Uniforms are not the fix. The excuse for funding is not valid to me. Again, you are in the heart of Detroit there are plenty of companies and businesses that would love to do a partnership with the athletics department. When it comes to facilities The university/ Athletic department lacks innovation.

All in all. We have to look at leadership. In a perfect world, we clean house and get a fresh staff in but I do not foresee that happening. There is no pressure to win from the president and the AD which leads into the head coach and assistants. Until winning becomes an emphasis the program will continue to be mediocre. The program needs fresh energy but I just do not see that happening anytime soon due to the relationship between AD and Winters. So as Warriors fans we will just have to continue to weather the storm and let time run its course.

Go, Warriors!

[WayneStatesman]

There is no pressure to win from the president and the AD which leads into the head coach and assistants. Until winning becomes an emphasis the program will continue to be mediocre.

!

Your post is excellent but the crux of the situation is the lack of pressure to have a winning program. Wayne State has literally hundreds of thousands of alumni but I would say maybe only 1% care about or have any interest in sports at Wayne State. An even smaller percentage of those who care about sports has any clout or influence with the administration to effect any meaningful changes as I see it and therein lies the rub.

[mtsax305]

[BillyGV]

I think that Kle and Bum both make good points. that of a safe and progressive city

unfortunately it is a VERY PROGRESSIVE city and that is why it will never be anything but a cesspool

[KleShreen]

unfortunately it is a VERY PROGRESSIVE city and that is why it will never be anything but a cesspool

What a dumb post.

You live in Florida, for god sakes.

[BillyGV]

What a dumb post.

You live in Florida, for god sakes.

what a dumb post!

I grew up in Detroit and despite living in Florida today I have been in Detroit more in the last couple years then you have in your whole disturbed life - lol - Go Lakers!!

[BeachinLaker]

unfortunately it is a VERY PROGRESSIVE city and that is why it will never be anything but a cesspool

Seeing as how Detroit is on the upswing, I'm not sure what you're talking about. Never is a long time and often hyperbolic. Also, the majority of large cities are "progressive," which I'm assuming is a word you use for anything that isn't far right.

[KleShreen]

what a dumb post!

I grew up in Detroit and despite living in Florida today I have been in Detroit more in the last couple years then you have in your whole disturbed life - lol - Go Lakers!!

Ah. There you are actually trying to make your original post about Detroit. Good try.

Kinda weird that "progressive" cities all happen to be where the most people want to live, eh? How awful.

[Redwing]

Ah. There you are actually trying to make your original post about Detroit. Good try.

Kinda weird that "progressive" cities all happen to be where the most people want to live, eh? How awful.

A classic case on how numbers can lead to incorrect conclusions.

[BillyGV]

Ah. There you are actually trying to make your original post about Detroit. Good try.

Kinda weird that "progressive" cities all happen to be where the most people want to live, eh? How awful.

LOL - who lives in the these progressive cities? - LOL

[BillyGV]

Seeing as how Detroit is on the upswing, I'm not sure what you're talking about. Never is a long time and often hyperbolic. Also, the majority of large cities are "progressive," which I'm assuming is a word you use for anything that isn't far right.

no, progressive has a true meaning - the fact you don't know it shows you have no business trying to participate in this type of conversation - lol - peace brother - Go Lakers