Off-season Chatter

[KleShreen]

Saw that quite a few GVSU players are in the portal, so I thought I'd start a topic here for off-season stuff.

So far, I've seen the following GV players announce their transfer portal intentions:

DL Jibriel Conde, who has offers from basically everyone. Basically same recruitment as Suggs.
DL Khamani Potts, who has offers from some G5 schools so far
DL Jamari Buddin, but have not seen any offers for him yet on social media
DB Quinn Wills, who has some G5 offers
Center Cannon Mackey, haven't seen offers posted for him yet
K Jay Cady

Every year, the d2 model feels so unsustainable lol. I can't imagine coaching in d2 anymore. We're now essentially junior colleges. You're coaching guys for, at most, two years with one of them actually consisting of playing time on the field, and then they're gone. Rebuilding entire rosters every single year. I just don't know how you sustain that.

[BillyGV]

You are right - this is a big reason why Saban left - how do you coach and build a team when you aren't ever sure who is going to be there - you count on a part of your team being good and lets recruit to our needs but then guys leave creating new holes - if he thought it was hard at Alabama how is it at D2 and at the upper level teams in D2 where full rides get dangled at underclassman that typically don't have them at the D2 level PLUS the possibility of some cash - we need to all switch to the Harding model where you are taking undersize guys anyway that can't ever move up and run an option giving more money to top defensive guys - not knocking Harding so don't anyone get in an uproar, they have a nice system that allows them to recruit undersize guys for o-line and rb's because that option system works excellently with that player, it does not require big o-line for pass blocking - CN under their former great coach did the same thing and were successful for decades with it and we see NMU making strides with the same thought process - I'm very familiar with it in that I played in that same system in the 70's - anyway I agree, something needs to be done to tighten up the NIL/Portal situation for NCAA football - thoughts?

[Gliac_fan10]

The biggest issue is the unregulated "agents/handlers" that are out there. Most of them are just in it to make money and have 0% of the player's best interest in mind. They are promising some wild things and for a few of the players they are able to come through but for most it falls way short of what was promised. Many of the players are listening to the bad advice by what these "agents" are selling. I'm not against kids moving up who have a real legitimate shot, they absolutely deserve to if they want, but unfortunately a large percentage are moving up on false pretences or flat out lies. Way too many players are ending up in bad situations at new schools or not ending up anywhere at all.

[Redwing]

The biggest issue is the unregulated "agents/handlers" that are out there. Most of them are just in it to make money and have 0% of the player's best interest in mind. They are promising some wild things and for a few of the players they are able to come through but for most it falls way short of what was promised. Many of the players are listening to the bad advice by what these "agents" are selling. I'm not against kids moving up who have a real legitimate shot, they absolutely deserve to if they want, but unfortunately a large percentage are moving up on false pretences or flat out lies. Way too many players are ending up in bad situations at new schools or not ending up anywhere at all.

That's true for too many. Still, the best talent at D2 seems to get scooped up by a D1 school with added NIL dollars. Just look at who GV will likely lose... kids going to G5 or even lesser conferences with big dollars. I suspect other schools are facing the same issues. I admit, the Harding model is a bit of a mystery. But I think there is more there then what we see on the surface. Not implying cheating, but more resources are there than what we see. A D2 program MIGHT find a way to keep one guy.. but even then it's doubtful I don't have the solution. But it doesn't mean I can support the current system.

[FSUBulldogs]

Bummer to see some GV players enter the portal, but that is to be expected now. Curious how many FSU will have when it is all said and done.

On another note, I saw the AD at Ferris mentioned who they are playing in 2026 in their non-conference games. Pitt State, Bentley, and Central Washington. Oh, and an NAIA opponent he mentioned but didn't name.

[MrsThortonMelon]

You are right - this is a big reason why Saban left - how do you coach and build a team when you aren't ever sure who is going to be there - you count on a part of your team being good and lets recruit to our needs but then guys leave creating new holes - if he thought it was hard at Alabama how is it at D2 and at the upper level teams in D2 where full rides get dangled at underclassman that typically don't have them at the D2 level PLUS the possibility of some cash - we need to all switch to the Harding model where you are taking undersize guys anyway that can't ever move up and run an option giving more money to top defensive guys - not knocking Harding so don't anyone get in an uproar, they have a nice system that allows them to recruit undersize guys for o-line and rb's because that option system works excellently with that player, it does not require big o-line for pass blocking - CN under their former great coach did the same thing and were successful for decades with it and we see NMU making strides with the same thought process - I'm very familiar with it in that I played in that same system in the 70's - anyway I agree, something needs to be done to tighten up the NIL/Portal situation for NCAA football - thoughts?

Which Harding team did you watch, the starting Oline was 295, 295, 305, etc...these are NOT little guys. GVSU line is way smaller than that. And get real Harding has a support plan for their guys that is hard to beat...

[MrsThortonMelon]

The biggest issue is the unregulated "agents/handlers" that are out there. Most of them are just in it to make money and have 0% of the player's best interest in mind. They are promising some wild things and for a few of the players they are able to come through but for most it falls way short of what was promised. Many of the players are listening to the bad advice by what these "agents" are selling. I'm not against kids moving up who have a real legitimate shot, they absolutely deserve to if they want, but unfortunately a large percentage are moving up on false pretences or flat out lies. Way too many players are ending up in bad situations at new schools or not ending up anywhere at all.

When the agent makes 20-25%B compared to an NFL agent that makes 3.5% I think we know where the real issue is. Follow the money.

[GLIAC2MAC]

You could always use Wheatley's system of making kids smaller in the program and on-line. Then you can discredit your better players, not promote them at all and hope they decide to stay after the season.

[Predatory Primates]

Which Harding team did you watch, the starting Oline was 295, 295, 305, etc...these are NOT little guys. GVSU line is way smaller than that. And get real Harding has a support plan for their guys that is hard to beat...

In D1, height and the wingspan/frame type that come with it is valued pretty highly. Harding, and a lot of other D2 teams have a lot more of the 6-0 to 6-2 linemen that may not get D1 looks, no matter how good they are.

D1 schools just aren't out there trying to woo 6-0 295 lb guys away from their D2 teams. Now 6-5, 275, they figure they can build up and work with.

[champgymusa]

When the agent makes 20-25%B compared to an NFL agent that makes 3.5% I think we know where the real issue is. Follow the money.

There is the real issue....these agents tell these kids anything to get them to go with them. Most are not lawyers or have any real background in contract law

[Searcy]

I admit, the Harding model is a bit of a mystery. But I think there is more there then what we see on the surface. Not implying cheating, but more resources are there than what we see. A D2 program MIGHT find a way to keep one guy.. but even then it's doubtful I don't have the solution. But it doesn't mean I can support the current system.

The Harding model seems like a mystery, but it's actually pretty simple. They take kids who are undervalued for some reason or other and bring them in and actually treat them like a giant family. They go on mission trips together working with underprivileged youth, they volunteer in their community, and really they do everything from a deeply Christian perspective while demonstrating that they care more about the players as people and children of God than as players.

Young men who came for nothing but a chance to play football leave having dedicated themselves to Christ and having been adopted into the best family in the world. They do all this and they're completely sincere about it. They're one of the few schools I can think of that (in the 21st century) still had the audacity to suspend an all-American quarterback (back in 2008 when they still ran a pass happy offense) because he broke school rules about boys and girls spending the night in each other's apartment.

The model of turning your team into a family that nobody wants to leave could only work in an environment where the coaches, the administrators, and the rest of the student body buys into that same mindset. Does everyone buy in completely? Of course not, but the overwhelming majority do.

As an aside, I have been friends with a number of Harding students, players, coaches, faculty, and staff over the years. There's something different about the environment there, and it's not complicated, but it wouldn't be easy to copy elsewhere, because it all flows from the Christian worldview that drives the University as a whole.

[KleShreen]

Lynn Wyche-El now in the portal for GV.

[DawgUp]

The Harding model seems like a mystery, but it's actually pretty simple. They take kids who are undervalued for some reason or other and bring them in and actually treat them like a giant family. They go on mission trips together working with underprivileged youth, they volunteer in their community, and really they do everything from a deeply Christian perspective while demonstrating that they care more about the players as people and children of God than as players.

Young men who came for nothing but a chance to play football leave having dedicated themselves to Christ and having been adopted into the best family in the world. They do all this and they're completely sincere about it. They're one of the few schools I can think of that (in the 21st century) still had the audacity to suspend an all-American quarterback (back in 2008 when they still ran a pass happy offense) because he broke school rules about boys and girls spending the night in each other's apartment.

The model of turning your team into a family that nobody wants to leave could only work in an environment where the coaches, the administrators, and the rest of the student body buys into that same mindset. Does everyone buy in completely? Of course not, but the overwhelming majority do.

As an aside, I have been friends with a number of Harding students, players, coaches, faculty, and staff over the years. There's something different about the environment there, and it's not complicated, but it wouldn't be easy to copy elsewhere, because it all flows from the Christian worldview that drives the University as a whole.

I agree with all of this. But offer one of those kids a full ride to Arkansas and 250k a year, he'll be going to church in Fayetteville.

[LakerDad]

The Harding model seems like a mystery, but it's actually pretty simple. They take kids who are undervalued for some reason or other and bring them in and actually treat them like a giant family. They go on mission trips together working with underprivileged youth, they volunteer in their community, and really they do everything from a deeply Christian perspective while demonstrating that they care more about the players as people and children of God than as players.

Young men who came for nothing but a chance to play football leave having dedicated themselves to Christ and having been adopted into the best family in the world. They do all this and they're completely sincere about it. They're one of the few schools I can think of that (in the 21st century) still had the audacity to suspend an all-American quarterback (back in 2008 when they still ran a pass happy offense) because he broke school rules about boys and girls spending the night in each other's apartment.

The model of turning your team into a family that nobody wants to leave could only work in an environment where the coaches, the administrators, and the rest of the student body buys into that same mindset. Does everyone buy in completely? Of course not, but the overwhelming majority do.

As an aside, I have been friends with a number of Harding students, players, coaches, faculty, and staff over the years. There's something different about the environment there, and it's not complicated, but it wouldn't be easy to copy elsewhere, because it all flows from the Christian worldview that drives the University as a whole.

About 2 years ago when all of the NIL/portal stuff really became a thing, I speculated that a only a couple school "types" would not be as affected as others - 1) the engineering schools like Colorado School of Mines or Michigan Tech where most kids go for their engineering degrees, and 2) schools like Harding where the Christian culture is more important to many of the students.

[WayneStatesman]

you could always use wheatley's system of making kids smaller in the program and on-line. Then you can discredit your better players, not promote them at all and hope they decide to stay after the season.

FIRE Wheatley!