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  • northwest missouri state RE: GAC thread

    Originally posted by northwest missouri state View Post

    the biggest problem is the one dimensional nature of their offense aw alluded to

    lots of teams run option, nobody completes 27 passes in a season like hu did this yr playing them is like taking a trip back to the 70s.

    there will always be a "nwms" otw to the title who can stop it. kearney throws it a lot more than harding does, it's comparatively viable although i don't really like what they do either, still not enough balance.

    i liked your post, just needed something to reply to
    i decided to bring my response over here since its surely to bring in some fights with people i don't know or care to know lol. especially those fake football teams in southern Oklahoma.
    this is probably more than you'll ever want to know about the old double wing.

    i ran this offense personally for 11 seasons and it's easy to manipulate a defense just by taking a wing back and moving him in motion to the sidelines then you pop them for 4 yards with your bread-and-butter dive play. eventually, you'll get someone out of place enough that you hit a crease and manage to get 12 yards just by diverting the defenses attention. watching them in person 3 times, I'd be surprised if Harding has more than 10 plays run out of 6 or 7 formation variations.

    ​​​​In no way am i comparing college football to 7th grade school ball but, i used 4 plays and a bastardized pass play all season to go undefeated. dive, counter and pitch and when we couldn't get them to commit 9 to the box, we would run a wedge play as many times as needed to get them to commit 9 inside the tight ends. It was basically a qb sneak with a silent snap count centered on the nose guard and we would try to get 3 helmets on him, flat back him and stomp him into submission.
    We took a large city championship that season with those 4 plays. took that same team to Lubbock that year and won a 24-man tournament by using the same offense and adding a true pass play to make us a grand total of 5 plays. outside of the tournament, passed maybe 20 times in 11 games. I've personally used this O and have a good idea why GAC has problems stopping it. it seems to be the DCs lol. they get impatient and want to show how innovative they are and do something stupid like send a "run blitz" to stuff it and end up giving up a 25-yard run.

    the double wing double tight (DWDT) nature of the offense is to hammer the defense until that defense gives up its weakness and exploit it by using angles and contrarian approaches. one of those approaches FOR US, was to have every single snap look the same. always. same paths with one of the wing backs going in pre snap motion. confuses the linebackers by making them guess which of the 4 backs will be getting the ball. that may make them a SIGNLE step too slow to get to the point of attack and that could mean the difference between a 1-yard gain and a TD.
    anyway, pre snap motion, get the defense used to it and the sound of the QBs cadence. QB always takes the same steps. he reverses out either hand it for the dive, fake the dive hand to the counter or fake both of those and run off tackle. regardless of who he hands it to or fakes it to, he always runs to the sidelines like he is carrying the ball. that will keep that dend from diving down into the formation to stop the dive or counter. once the dened starts getting undisciplined, the QB takes it around the end.
    there are charts that double wing coaches have made up over the years that show you what plays to attack where the defenders aren't. you move people around inside the formation by using the same principles. the only "option" to this offense really is the play calling. the plays are predetermined based on where the defense is lined up or where the weakness is showing up. if the majority of the defense is lined up inside the box, you run outside tackles. if they have a majority of the help outside the box, you run in the middle. If the nose is being way aggressive with your center causing issues, crush him in a vice by hitting him with the wedge and stepping on his body with as many cleats as possible. once he backs off or is replaced, you go back to the dive. rinse and repeat. the best play our players loved was breaking a long run. the players knew to get to the line immediately we were running the QB sneak as soon as the ref moved off the ball. very confusing 15 seconds for a defense that just gave up a long one and a huge boot to the defenses motivation because even if they know its coming, they know theyre getting ready to be stomped on. The offense is extremely easy to diagnose too. depending on which defender shows up, you can tell who screwed up the play and you can correct on the spot.


    Now, you add 10 years to the players, mix those plays to an ability to pass the ball and roll a QB out and run with him....you have UNKs offense. with that x factor, you have instantly added about 5 plays to that playbook just off the top of my head. RPO being the deadliest of those 5. they have many more plays than Harding has with the traditional DWDT offense. i suspect that is out of necessity because good traditional type coaches are going to have defense that will combat the Harding approach and not just throw out a "run blitz". had one of the GAC coaches tell us on a recruiting visit that was the plan against Harding. they were going to throw run blitzes at them until they changed to a passing attack. give you a hint, it didn't work.

    Double Wing coaches use the phrase "football in a phone booth" because they attack the defense with more blockers in a gap than they can stack defenders. that's why the formation is soooo compact.

    the secret to winning against normal football teams is taking advantage of the lack of preparations for the defenses. they don't see the offense enough to have experience with it and it's hard to take a scout offense and have them effectively simulate a double wing attack. defensive coaches with the desire to read the old school football cookbooks will find the key to slowing down the DWDT attack and simply keep scoring against their defense.

    anyway, going to be a long offseason. bummer.
    Last edited by jimbo slice; 11-30-2022, 12:33 PM.

  • #2
    The school I work at runs a single wing but it doesn't look like it. It has an insane set of motions pre and snap shifts. It does throw in some of the run concepts that 49ers do with slot backs,TE,WR, running counter to flow back toward center and attacking the A gap. Also lots of wr jet sweeps. Reverses. All that eye candy sits on a foundation of a single wing. The passing game depends on the strength and skills of the QB. This year QB is x good runner has a real snap in his a bit throws a little flat on his arc. So they threw in wide receiver screens, and quick throw outs. That spreads defense wide do the can't play a stack 4-3 defense. Most of defenses we play are 3-4 fronts and they just can't hang. And we have been successful with it because it does not rely on a good QB. Six district titles in a row, a state championship,and play off semi finals five of those 6 years. And most importantly the games are done before 930 pm with a 7. Pm start. There advantages of being the odd duck out when everyone else is running same stuff. And let's be honest defenses are catching up to spread offense. But it usually takes small fast players. Those types of players aren't fond of a physical beat down for 4 quarters.

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by jimbo slice View Post

      i decided to bring my response over here since its surely to bring in some fights with people i don't know or care to know lol. especially those fake football teams in southern Oklahoma.
      this is probably more than you'll ever want to know about the old double wing.

      i ran this offense personally for 11 seasons and it's easy to manipulate a defense just by taking a wing back and moving him in motion to the sidelines then you pop them for 4 yards with your bread-and-butter dive play. eventually, you'll get someone out of place enough that you hit a crease and manage to get 12 yards just by diverting the defenses attention. watching them in person 3 times, I'd be surprised if Harding has more than 10 plays run out of 6 or 7 formation variations.

      ​​​​In no way am i comparing college football to 7th grade school ball but, i used 4 plays and a bastardized pass play all season to go undefeated. dive, counter and pitch and when we couldn't get them to commit 9 to the box, we would run a wedge play as many times as needed to get them to commit 9 inside the tight ends. It was basically a qb sneak with a silent snap count centered on the nose guard and we would try to get 3 helmets on him, flat back him and stomp him into submission.
      We took a large city championship that season with those 4 plays. took that same team to Lubbock that year and won a 24-man tournament by using the same offense and adding a true pass play to make us a grand total of 5 plays. outside of the tournament, passed maybe 20 times in 11 games. I've personally used this O and have a good idea why GAC has problems stopping it. it seems to be the DCs lol. they get impatient and want to show how innovative they are and do something stupid like send a "run blitz" to stuff it and end up giving up a 25-yard run.

      the double wing double tight (DWDT) nature of the offense is to hammer the defense until that defense gives up its weakness and exploit it by using angles and contrarian approaches. one of those approaches FOR US, was to have every single snap look the same. always. same paths with one of the wing backs going in pre snap motion. confuses the linebackers by making them guess which of the 4 backs will be getting the ball. that may make them a SIGNLE step too slow to get to the point of attack and that could mean the difference between a 1-yard gain and a TD.
      anyway, pre snap motion, get the defense used to it and the sound of the QBs cadence. QB always takes the same steps. he reverses out either hand it for the dive, fake the dive hand to the counter or fake both of those and run off tackle. regardless of who he hands it to or fakes it to, he always runs to the sidelines like he is carrying the ball. that will keep that dend from diving down into the formation to stop the dive or counter. once the dened starts getting undisciplined, the QB takes it around the end.
      there are charts that double wing coaches have made up over the years that show you what plays to attack where the defenders aren't. you move people around inside the formation by using the same principles. the only "option" to this offense really is the play calling. the plays are predetermined based on where the defense is lined up or where the weakness is showing up. if the majority of the defense is lined up inside the box, you run outside tackles. if they have a majority of the help outside the box, you run in the middle. If the nose is being way aggressive with your center causing issues, crush him in a vice by hitting him with the wedge and stepping on his body with as many cleats as possible. once he backs off or is replaced, you go back to the dive. rinse and repeat. the best play our players loved was breaking a long run. the players knew to get to the line immediately we were running the QB sneak as soon as the ref moved off the ball. very confusing 15 seconds for a defense that just gave up a long one and a huge boot to the defenses motivation because even if they know its coming, they know theyre getting ready to be stomped on. The offense is extremely easy to diagnose too. depending on which defender shows up, you can tell who screwed up the play and you can correct on the spot.


      Now, you add 10 years to the players, mix those plays to an ability to pass the ball and roll a QB out and run with him....you have UNKs offense. with that x factor, you have instantly added about 5 plays to that playbook just off the top of my head. RPO being the deadliest of those 5. they have many more plays than Harding has with the traditional DWDT offense. i suspect that is out of necessity because good traditional type coaches are going to have defense that will combat the Harding approach and not just throw out a "run blitz". had one of the GAC coaches tell us on a recruiting visit that was the plan against Harding. they were going to throw run blitzes at them until they changed to a passing attack. give you a hint, it didn't work.

      Double Wing coaches use the phrase "football in a phone booth" because they attack the defense with more blockers in a gap than they can stack defenders. that's why the formation is soooo compact.

      the secret to winning against normal football teams is taking advantage of the lack of preparations for the defenses. they don't see the offense enough to have experience with it and it's hard to take a scout offense and have them effectively simulate a double wing attack. defensive coaches with the desire to read the old school football cookbooks will find the key to slowing down the DWDT attack and simply keep scoring against their defense.

      anyway, going to be a long offseason. bummer.
      You are not wrong about DC coaching being the issue with GAC schools. You would think people would be bright enough to copy defensive schemes that actually have worked against Harding in the past. I remember a first year DC at SWOSU deciding we were going to run 3 down linemen against Harding, and then got upset when they hung 50+ on us lol. Almost nobody in D2 have the defense NW MO has, but at least try to scheme up something similar to what they do, because it obviously works.

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by BulldogLB View Post

        You are not wrong about DC coaching being the issue with GAC schools. You would think people would be bright enough to copy defensive schemes that actually have worked against Harding in the past. I remember a first year DC at SWOSU deciding we were going to run 3 down linemen against Harding, and then got upset when they hung 50+ on us lol. Almost nobody in D2 have the defense NW MO has, but at least try to scheme up something similar to what they do, because it obviously works.
        exactly. i was told by several old school coaches there is nothing new in 100+ years of football and the best coaches are the best thieves. I've always heard football is always about two things. blocking and tackling. this is the down and dirty of football right here. who you block and how well and how you get to the ball and how well can you tackle when you get there.
        there have been a lot of teams that have beaten double wing teams. you have to find the formula for YOUR team to do so.

        warning, this is long.

        small things to look at is the gaps. are the gaps at zero splits? they are coming right at your throat. gaps at 6inch or so?...going for the off tackle etc. whites of their knuckles? coming right at you full speed ahead. no white, watch for pulling and the pull will almost always take you to the ball.
        another small key to possibly neutralizing that attack for one play at a time is being quicker and more aggressive off the line. if you get on hudl and look at Harding's lineman, i bet you will see they are as far off the ball as possible. like possibly helmets at the hip of the center depth. that's gives them at least 2 extra steps so they can get a running start at your dline. and that's very effective because they know the snap and as soon as they launch and get that second foot in the ground, their momentum is already carrying them to the hit by the time that dlineman is out of his stance (especially if Hes even slightly gassed) a "thing" in line circles is when lineman is on board drills or whatever, the lineman with his second step in the ground first will almost always win.

        a 3-4 defense is as good as 4 yards a carry to this type of offense. if you can't get your linebackers in on the hit at the line of scrimmage, with a head full of steam the fullbacks could fall forward for 4 yards. and that doesnt even count an outside speedy wing back. every single dlineman is double teamed off the snap and then 3 of those slip off to take out 3 of the 4 linebackers. it's just not a smart thought process. on the speed toss to the wing back, if your three onside backers are blocked, you are leaving a corner or safety to take on a bruiser that is trained to take punishment for 40-60 snaps per game. that's what i was talking about earlier when a team is trying to prepare for such an attack. they just don't see it enough to be able to prepare.

        example for a 3-4 team. this will be the power and almost every DW team will have a play similar to this and it absolutely is their bread and butter. they will know it against a 6-man front. a 5-man front. a 3-4 4-4 you get the point...

        the main play i called was even power

        even: to the even side of the ball
        power: simply meaning pulling guard.

        working the line from left to right.....
        tight end chips DE and goes to the safety.
        backside tackle chips and slows DE and climbs to the linebacker.
        i pull the backside guard to the right to attack outside of the play side tight end and straight up field... that's your lead block.
        center slows the nose and chips to the MLB.
        onside guard hits and slows the nose pursuit and chips to the backside DE if needed to slow his as well. (this will be a key for the boot)
        onside tackle will take the DE and make sure he is neutralized and moving somewhere out of the play.
        the full back takes the fake dive and initiates contact with the MLB.
        the onside TE will double the DT until the tackle has him moving away from the play and then the TE climbs to the closest unblocked linebacker.
        onside wing is to take the OLB closest to him. doesn't have to whip him just push him where the LB naturally wants to go. let the ball carrier make the cut off that block.
        back gets behind that pulling guard and rides him until he needs to make a cut....
        meanwhile, while all of this above is going on, you have the backside wing (the target of this play) going in motion, after he grabs the handoff, his target is between the sidelines and the last man on the LOS...if all goes well, he will initially have to make a cut away from the flowing OLB next one should be cutting off of the guards lead block.
        so, snap going off, qb hands off to the motioning wing and boots to the left of the play keeping the corner and DE and safety at least slowing down to make sure the QB doesn't have the ball. qb as usual is the biggest threat on this offense (see UNK QB) if you don't respect his boot and try to cheat on this play, the keeper will be one of the next plays coming.

        that's it. every play called in that offense is based off of what the defense does in response to that play. that play right there i ran 25-30 times a practice. mine was a little slower but our high school coaches had the 1s do it, they'd sprint off the field and the 2s sprint on and then they ran it and so forth and so on. they ran it at a fast tempo so no need for sprints after practice and any running and any of that BS. the 1st and 2nd string could run it like clockwork and could plug and play dang near anyone. every back knows each other's job etc they could run 25 of those plays on the 1st and 2nd string in 14 minutes if perfect.
        off of that one play you can call:

        even superpower: pulls the tackle AND guard for slow playing backside DEs and backside OLBs
        even counter: aggressive backside DEs and OLBs (look for hitting the qb every play)
        even boot: aggressive DEs trying to chase down the play from the backside
        wedge/QB sneak/ dive teams loading the outside of the box (from the OT out) see: 3-4 defense lol
        pass play we called check and the fire at the line of scrimmage for everyone to play the same plays but all eligible would run a pass route....happened 2 or 3 times a game but would usually get us a first when we needed it.
        thats it. ran those 5 plays.
        if you want 10 plays, simply add "odd" to the names and run it the other way lol
        as you can tell, those same 5 plays can be ran out of MULTIPLE formations so it appears to be dozens and dozens of plays.
        i have messed around with a team that had a great run defense team in a tournament in st louis. they shut down nealry every team they faced. ran these very same plays out of a "spread" formation. and lost to them but scored 33 on them which was more in that game than they game up in the rest of the tournament combined,



        i always beat it into my backs heads. every day for everyone of them...

        if you dont block, you dont get the rock
        if you fumble, you will sit that series and the rest of the half. you fumble it two times in the game, you don't carry it the next game.
        better take more than one hit or tackler to bring you down.
        above all else, GET YOUR THREE YARDS no matter what it takes!

        this type of offense simply cant survive turnovers and it absolutely cant play from behind. it must control the ball and play disciplined.

        to ensure this, we did 20 minutes of my ball drills everyday. just practicing punching the ball out from all angles and the ball carriers holding onto the ball while running. loser doing 20 yard bear crawls for everyone they lost. backs with that kind of mentality is not the guys you want hitting your corners or safeties regularly they will win most of the time.
        Last edited by jimbo slice; 12-01-2022, 11:34 AM.

        Comment


        • #5
          1908 Northwest Normal School FB team with my Grandfather at Fullback. What would you call this formation?

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by NW Normal View Post
            1908 Northwest Normal School FB team with my Grandfather at Fullback. What would you call this formation?
            Cool pic.
            That’s just gotta be Saint Mel standing up back there...

            Comment


            • #7
              I would call that the old "T- formation" ! We ran this in high school in the early 60's. Move one back to either right or left wing and then it would be a wing T. The only difference was in our formations, both TE's were in a 3 point stance.
              Last edited by Thepeman; 12-01-2022, 01:35 PM.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Thepeman View Post
                I would call that the old "T- formation" ! We ran this in high school in the early 60's. Move one back to either right or left wing and then it would be a wing T. The only difference was in our formations, both TE's were in a 3 point stance.
                right. i would agree with the wing T.

                very cool pic too!

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Thepeman View Post
                  I would call that the old "T- formation" ! We ran this in high school in the early 60's. Move one back to either right or left wing and then it would be a wing T. The only difference was in our formations, both TE's were in a 3 point stance.
                  What did you call the game then since "football" was invented sometime around 1994 by Mel...

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    .beta testing in the wilderness for 90 years waiting for messiah
                    bud elliotts affinity for locusts and wild honey should have been a clue but we were blind
                    Go Bearcats!
                    M-I-Z-Z-O-U!

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by jimbo slice View Post

                      exactly. i was told by several old school coaches there is nothing new in 100+ years of football and the best coaches are the best thieves. I've always heard football is always about two things. blocking and tackling. this is the down and dirty of football right here. who you block and how well and how you get to the ball and how well can you tackle when you get there.
                      there have been a lot of teams that have beaten double wing teams. you have to find the formula for YOUR team to do so.

                      warning, this is long.

                      small things to look at is the gaps. are the gaps at zero splits? they are coming right at your throat. gaps at 6inch or so?...going for the off tackle etc. whites of their knuckles? coming right at you full speed ahead. no white, watch for pulling and the pull will almost always take you to the ball.
                      another small key to possibly neutralizing that attack for one play at a time is being quicker and more aggressive off the line. if you get on hudl and look at Harding's lineman, i bet you will see they are as far off the ball as possible. like possibly helmets at the hip of the center depth. that's gives them at least 2 extra steps so they can get a running start at your dline. and that's very effective because they know the snap and as soon as they launch and get that second foot in the ground, their momentum is already carrying them to the hit by the time that dlineman is out of his stance (especially if Hes even slightly gassed) a "thing" in line circles is when lineman is on board drills or whatever, the lineman with his second step in the ground first will almost always win.

                      a 3-4 defense is as good as 4 yards a carry to this type of offense. if you can't get your linebackers in on the hit at the line of scrimmage, with a head full of steam the fullbacks could fall forward for 4 yards. and that doesnt even count an outside speedy wing back. every single dlineman is double teamed off the snap and then 3 of those slip off to take out 3 of the 4 linebackers. it's just not a smart thought process. on the speed toss to the wing back, if your three onside backers are blocked, you are leaving a corner or safety to take on a bruiser that is trained to take punishment for 40-60 snaps per game. that's what i was talking about earlier when a team is trying to prepare for such an attack. they just don't see it enough to be able to prepare.

                      example for a 3-4 team. this will be the power and almost every DW team will have a play similar to this and it absolutely is their bread and butter. they will know it against a 6-man front. a 5-man front. a 3-4 4-4 you get the point...

                      the main play i called was even power

                      even: to the even side of the ball
                      power: simply meaning pulling guard.

                      working the line from left to right.....
                      tight end chips DE and goes to the safety.
                      backside tackle chips and slows DE and climbs to the linebacker.
                      i pull the backside guard to the right to attack outside of the play side tight end and straight up field... that's your lead block.
                      center slows the nose and chips to the MLB.
                      onside guard hits and slows the nose pursuit and chips to the backside DE if needed to slow his as well. (this will be a key for the boot)
                      onside tackle will take the DE and make sure he is neutralized and moving somewhere out of the play.
                      the full back takes the fake dive and initiates contact with the MLB.
                      the onside TE will double the DT until the tackle has him moving away from the play and then the TE climbs to the closest unblocked linebacker.
                      onside wing is to take the OLB closest to him. doesn't have to whip him just push him where the LB naturally wants to go. let the ball carrier make the cut off that block.
                      back gets behind that pulling guard and rides him until he needs to make a cut....
                      meanwhile, while all of this above is going on, you have the backside wing (the target of this play) going in motion, after he grabs the handoff, his target is between the sidelines and the last man on the LOS...if all goes well, he will initially have to make a cut away from the flowing OLB next one should be cutting off of the guards lead block.
                      so, snap going off, qb hands off to the motioning wing and boots to the left of the play keeping the corner and DE and safety at least slowing down to make sure the QB doesn't have the ball. qb as usual is the biggest threat on this offense (see UNK QB) if you don't respect his boot and try to cheat on this play, the keeper will be one of the next plays coming.

                      that's it. every play called in that offense is based off of what the defense does in response to that play. that play right there i ran 25-30 times a practice. mine was a little slower but our high school coaches had the 1s do it, they'd sprint off the field and the 2s sprint on and then they ran it and so forth and so on. they ran it at a fast tempo so no need for sprints after practice and any running and any of that BS. the 1st and 2nd string could run it like clockwork and could plug and play dang near anyone. every back knows each other's job etc they could run 25 of those plays on the 1st and 2nd string in 14 minutes if perfect.
                      off of that one play you can call:

                      even superpower: pulls the tackle AND guard for slow playing backside DEs and backside OLBs
                      even counter: aggressive backside DEs and OLBs (look for hitting the qb every play)
                      even boot: aggressive DEs trying to chase down the play from the backside
                      wedge/QB sneak/ dive teams loading the outside of the box (from the OT out) see: 3-4 defense lol
                      pass play we called check and the fire at the line of scrimmage for everyone to play the same plays but all eligible would run a pass route....happened 2 or 3 times a game but would usually get us a first when we needed it.
                      thats it. ran those 5 plays.
                      if you want 10 plays, simply add "odd" to the names and run it the other way lol
                      as you can tell, those same 5 plays can be ran out of MULTIPLE formations so it appears to be dozens and dozens of plays.
                      i have messed around with a team that had a great run defense team in a tournament in st louis. they shut down nealry every team they faced. ran these very same plays out of a "spread" formation. and lost to them but scored 33 on them which was more in that game than they game up in the rest of the tournament combined,



                      i always beat it into my backs heads. every day for everyone of them...

                      if you dont block, you dont get the rock
                      if you fumble, you will sit that series and the rest of the half. you fumble it two times in the game, you don't carry it the next game.
                      better take more than one hit or tackler to bring you down.
                      above all else, GET YOUR THREE YARDS no matter what it takes!

                      this type of offense simply cant survive turnovers and it absolutely cant play from behind. it must control the ball and play disciplined.

                      to ensure this, we did 20 minutes of my ball drills everyday. just practicing punching the ball out from all angles and the ball carriers holding onto the ball while running. loser doing 20 yard bear crawls for everyone they lost. backs with that kind of mentality is not the guys you want hitting your corners or safeties regularly they will win most of the time.
                      and there it is to bring it back home but i don’t really want to both of your posts itt are tip top. it is beautiful offense to watch when run well.
                      Go Bearcats!
                      M-I-Z-Z-O-U!

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        https://vault.si.com/vault/1998/10/0...-seek-converts

                        I had the opportunity to talk to Norris Patterson many times when I was working in Liberty and the conversations were never dull, especially after I found out he was a good friend of my grandpa. He was a William Jewell legend and my dad talked about how hard the single wing was to defend when he was playing at NW.



                        Typical Single Wing set. Note the unbalanced line. "C" will snap the ball, even though he is not strictly in the center. This diagram uses the modern terms. In the original single wing, the primary ball handler was called the "tailback" and "quarterback" was used as a blocking back.
                        Last edited by CatFan88; 12-03-2022, 05:59 AM.
                        Go Hounds!
                        B-E-A-R-C-A-T-S
                        Cyclone Power
                        ERAU Eagles Soar

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by CatFan88 View Post
                          https://vault.si.com/vault/1998/10/0...-seek-converts

                          I had the opportunity to talk to Norris Patterson many times when I was working in Liberty and the conversations were never dull, especially after I found out he was a good friend of my grandpa. He was a William Jewell legend and my dad talked about how hard the single wing was to defend when he was playing at NW.



                          Typical Single Wing set. Note the unbalanced line. "C" will snap the ball, even though he is not strictly in the center. This diagram uses the modern terms. In the original single wing, the primary ball handler was called the "tailback" and "quarterback" was used as a blocking back.
                          In 1962, this is what we ran at NW under head coach Earl Baker. The fullback was called a spinner back.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Thepeman View Post

                            In 1962, this is what we ran at NW under head coach Earl Baker. The fullback was called a spinner back.
                            My dad was spinner back for Ryland Milner 1951-55 I believe. Norris Patterson was the single wing guru.


                            Go Hounds!
                            B-E-A-R-C-A-T-S
                            Cyclone Power
                            ERAU Eagles Soar

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by CatFan88 View Post

                              My dad was spinner back for Ryland Milner 1951-55 I believe. Norris Patterson was the single wing guru.

                              love hearing the stories about the single and double wing teams. i played a team that had the "snapper" play on the ball and ALL the rest of the lineman played to the right of the snapper. only did it for a series but went about 80 yards in 5 or 6 plays. the direct snap to the "wild cat" was unstoppable.

                              we were losing to them big time anyway so they didnt need to do it again. it was the coolest and most frustrating thing i had seen at that point. realized the QB was just too fast and if you didnt have that type of back, that formation was dead.

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