2024 SMSU Mustangs: Year 3 of Underwood

[SW_Mustang]

correct - -- undetthrow and 4 Minot defenders could have picked it offbut for a great play by Maher.

Disappointing. At 1 PM the parking lots was laready full and people were excited and tailgaiting. what a great atmosphere and great crowd and such a letdown. People were really jazzed and excited to get the season off on the right foot.

Perfect weather too - just a clunker

IMO - game aside, this might have been the best pre-game atmosphere at SMSU I've ever seen. Maybe all Ag Bowls are like this, but the Round-Up was packed, people in the grass lot having fun. I don't recall ever seeing a tailgating situation like this. Walking up it felt like a genuine CFB atmosphere which is something we've desperately needed.

The weather was gorgeous which helped, but I can tell the efforts are paying off.

[Stanger86]

Klunder has the potential -- next 4 weeks will be huge - does he play in 1-3 of those games?

They gave him a jersey number this year...seems to at least be a possibility.

[SW_Mustang]

Does Minnesota West being ranked #2 nationally provide any benefit to us?

I've often wondered why we don't pick more guys up out of there.

Their volleyball team is ranked #5 nationally right now too.

[Stanger86]

Does Minnesota West being ranked #2 nationally provide any benefit to us?

I've often wondered why we don't pick more guys up out of there.

Their volleyball team is ranked #5 nationally right now too.

We actually have hit them up for transfers more under Underwood than we did in Sauter's time here.

Last year, we actually had three guys on the team. Only one of any real consequence though was Tate Gaul, who is also the only one of the three still on the team. Cowell played in seven games, but no stats.
Sauter had one transfer come from MWCTC - a linebacker who played two career games in 2015 and 2016 and didn't register any statistics.

Before that though, you have to go all the way back to 2008 to find someone on the roster who transferred in from Minnesota West.

I somewhat agree that it'd be nice to see. However, in most cases there's a clear size and speed difference.

[SW_Mustang]

We actually have hit them up for transfers more under Underwood than we did in Sauter's time here.

Last year, we actually had three guys on the team. Only one of any real consequence though was Tate Gaul, who is also the only one of the three still on the team. Cowell played in seven games, but no stats.
Sauter had one transfer come from MWCTC - a linebacker who played two career games in 2015 and 2016 and didn't register any statistics.

Before that though, you have to go all the way back to 2008 to find someone on the roster who transferred in from Minnesota West.

I somewhat agree that it'd be nice to see. However, in most cases there's a clear size and speed difference.

I'm not as connected to MNWest as I'd like to be, and don't know their athletic history that well - but they have sort of risen to prominence in the last couple years, albeit by NJCAA DIII standards. So it might not have been a viable resource previously but might be in the future. I guess we'll have to see. Rootin' for them though. And more eyes on SWMN volleyball is a good thing.

I forgot about Gaul. I had a professor with that name at SMSU who ironically now works at MNWest. I'm probably going to regret saying this I'm sure but she was head of the flag committee.

[vikingfaithful]

Question, I've never understood why SMSU has historically not won and has high turnover rates with the football program? For ten years I spent every Wednesday night in a hotel across the road from the S. end of the campus 86' thru 96. Bicycled with a fast riding group, often going out for beer afterwords. Personally, I thought Marshall was a great community. If BSU can win, why not the Mustangs? You have a beautiful stadium and better location for recruiting. Some winning needs to happen to get momentum.

Nice men's BB commitment from Brayson Boike. Texas Tom's staff started recruiting him 2 1/2 yrs. ago.

[SW_Mustang]

Question, I've never understood why SMSU has historically not won and has high turnover rates with the football program? For ten years I spent every Wednesday night in a hotel across the road from the S. end of the campus 86' thru 96. Bicycled with a fast riding group, often going out for beer afterwords. Personally, I thought Marshall was a great community. If BSU can win, why not the Mustangs? You have a beautiful stadium and better location for recruiting. Some winning needs to happen to get momentum.

Nice men's BB commitment from Brayson Boike. Texas Tom's staff started recruiting him 2 1/2 yrs. ago.

Short answer is the transfer portal mixed with instant gratification has created a "win now-or-leave" culture where the grass is always greener. I'm not one of those "darn kids" types, but we need a core of guys willing to invest and take bumps to build something bigger. Nobody wants to do that. If there were deeper issues going on we'd see it across all sports and we aren't.

Marshall is a very tough sell to your average 18 y/o. It's dull, it's flat, it's isolated, and the weather is awful. What makes for a great community for 55+ does not translate as well to the 18-25 crowd. We all desperately wanted out, frankly. Having a top rated pre-school (which is an actual argument I've heard) and a senior discount at the supper club is absolutely great, but it's of no benefit to a 20 y/o d-lineman from Nebraska. They should have built the campus in Redwood so we could have had some natural resources, but RWF loves education like I love the NDSU Bison so that was never gonna happen. The mayor and city council absolutely hate college kids and it's apparent they don't want them to come.

The campus is also horrifically outdated. The new administration is fixing it *gasp* and growing enrollment *gasp* which is clearly making the community livid - but at least something is changing. I also think there's a big effort to change the fan culture and as we saw Saturday it is starting to pay off, so who knows.

[Purple Mav Man]

Short answer is the transfer portal mixed with instant gratification has created a "win now-or-leave" culture where the grass is always greener. I'm not one of those "darn kids" types, but we need a core of guys willing to invest and take bumps to build something bigger. Nobody wants to do that. If there were deeper issues going on we'd see it across all sports and we aren't.

Marshall is a very tough sell to your average 18 y/o. It's dull, it's flat, it's isolated, and the weather is awful. What makes for a great community for 55+ does not translate as well to the 18-25 crowd. We all desperately wanted out, frankly. Having a top rated pre-school (which is an actual argument I've heard) and a senior discount at the supper club is absolutely great, but it's of no benefit to a 20 y/o d-lineman from Nebraska. They should have built the campus in Redwood so we could have had some natural resources, but RWF loves education like I love the NDSU Bison so that was never gonna happen. The mayor and city council absolutely hate college kids and it's apparent they don't want them to come.

The campus is also horrifically outdated. The new administration is fixing it *gasp* and growing enrollment *gasp* which is clearly making the community livid - but at least something is changing. I also think there's a big effort to change the fan culture and as we saw Saturday it is starting to pay off, so who knows.

The transfer portal isn’t the answer. I realize people have been able to transfer for quite some time, but the penalty-free version is fairly recent.

The second part is likely much more accurate, and what most people do not want to admit. Combine that with losing much more than winning, and it has to be tough to build anything substantial.

[SW_Mustang]

The transfer portal isn’t the answer. I realize people have been able to transfer for quite some time, but the penalty-free version is fairly recent.

The second part is likely much more accurate, and what most people do not want to admit. Combine that with losing much more than winning, and it has to be tough to build anything substantial.

Maybe it's a consequence of the problem, but it's had a huge effect - I mean, we got the USF monkey off our back last season and everyone was gone by Sunday morning. Had that happened in a similar 2014 season, we'd have never bounced back the following year.

Anyway - I know it's blasphemous to say Marshall is anything other than 10 feet from Heaven's doorstep - but it's not a great town for a college. It's not a "bad" place by any means, but it's not necessarily a utopia perfect for all-comers either, as no place can be. Bemidji has the benefit of a great downtown (from what I remember), an arena that can host events, and the outdoor life - three things Marshall lacks. It might be great for people looking to settle in, but that doesn't translate well for younger people.

Part of the issue is - we only have so many resources and serve a wide variety of programs beyond just football, which is something a lot of SMSU fans don't really consider. Much of the campus infrastructure is vastly outdated and is being dealt with (slowly). I saw a lot of improvements on my walk through campus that I never thought I'd see and it gave me the most hope for our future I've ever had. The downside is, we can't go spend it on football if we're rehabbing our classrooms and green spaces. I know the idea of bolstering education is enough to make the locals seethe - but if we don't address the campus then it's just going to make the football problem worse (IMO).

Anyway - that's my Ted Talk. It's just my opinion and people are free to disagree with it. I know I can be ultra sarcastic and I tried to tone it back a bit.

[Purple Mav Man]

Maybe it's a consequence of the problem, but it's had a huge effect - I mean, we got the USF monkey off our back last season and everyone was gone by Sunday morning. Had that happened in a similar 2014 season, we'd have never bounced back the following year.

Anyway - I know it's blasphemous to say Marshall is anything other than 10 feet from Heaven's doorstep - but it's not a great town for a college. It's not a "bad" place by any means, but it's not necessarily a utopia perfect for all-comers either, as no place can be. Bemidji has the benefit of a great downtown (from what I remember), an arena that can host events, and the outdoor life - three things Marshall lacks. It might be great for people looking to settle in, but that doesn't translate well for younger people.

Part of the issue is - we only have so many resources and serve a wide variety of programs beyond just football, which is something a lot of SMSU fans don't really consider. Much of the campus infrastructure is vastly outdated and is being dealt with (slowly). I saw a lot of improvements on my walk through campus that I never thought I'd see and it gave me the most hope for our future I've ever had. The downside is, we can't go spend it on football if we're rehabbing our classrooms and green spaces. I know the idea of bolstering education is enough to make the locals seethe - but if we don't address the campus then it's just going to make the football problem worse (IMO).

Anyway - that's my Ted Talk. It's just my opinion and people are free to disagree with it. I know I can be ultra sarcastic and I tried to tone it back a bit.

The reason I don’t point towards the portal is because SMSU wasn’t winning in football prior to it, either. It didn’t change the direction of the program. It has certainly had an effect on it, as it has on all programs.

[Stanger86]

The reason I don’t point towards the portal is because SMSU wasn’t winning in football prior to it, either. It didn’t change the direction of the program. It has certainly had an effect on it, as it has on all programs.

I think what SW is referring to was ultimately the demise of the Sauter regime. The transfer portal creation along with the pandemic is what decimated the program which led to his firing and a multi-year rebuilding process for Underwood. I also think the coordinator roulette did no favors. I'm not talking about GAs, as that's an inevitability of the situation for a smaller school with less resources. But specifically the salaried positions, Sauter had a stretch with almost zero consistency or success. It's hard to recruit. It's hard to retain. This is also around when they put a greater emphasis on recruiting Arizona, California, Nevada.

However, I think you and VF are looking at the bigger picture of the program. I do think there has been a bit of an identity issue through my whole 20 years watching the program. We had something we could point to at QB for a long time, but then it all dissipated. I do think Underwood is trying to instill more of a team-wide identity here, but I think he's finding it to be difficult with the new transfer rules.

[Stanger86]

I think the big reason why other programs have won more than football is the coaching. That's why I hope the administration is patient with Underwood.

[Purple Mav Man]

I think what SW is referring to was ultimately the demise of the Sauter regime. The transfer portal creation along with the pandemic is what decimated the program which led to his firing and a multi-year rebuilding process for Underwood. I also think the coordinator roulette did no favors. I'm not talking about GAs, as that's an inevitability of the situation for a smaller school with less resources. But specifically the salaried positions, Sauter had a stretch with almost zero consistency or success. It's hard to recruit. It's hard to retain. This is also around when they put a greater emphasis on recruiting Arizona, California, Nevada.

However, I think you and VF are looking at the bigger picture of the program. I do think there has been a bit of an identity issue through my whole 20 years watching the program. We had something we could point to at QB for a long time, but then it all dissipated. I do think Underwood is trying to instill more of a team-wide identity here, but I think he's finding it to be difficult with the new transfer rules.

Correct, I was looking big picture as the initial ask referenced ‘historically’. They did have a nice run with an up-tempo offense that gave the QB an identity. But even then, they may have had an identity but weren’t piling up the wins outside of outlier years.

Sometimes it takes a shift in landscape, not just program. MSU was mediocre at absolute best in football (and borderline bad most years, REALLY bad in 04 or whenever they went 0-11). Then the Dakota schools split for D1 and the Mavs started scooping those players more often. Started winning and now it’s easier to get those players due to the recent history of success. Mankato has plenty going for it that Marshall doesn’t though, so I realize the difficulty any ball coach is going to have there.

[Stanger86]

Correct, I was looking big picture as the initial ask referenced ‘historically’. They did have a nice run with an up-tempo offense that gave the QB an identity. But even then, they may have had an identity but weren’t piling up the wins outside of outlier years.

Sometimes it takes a shift in landscape, not just program. MSU was mediocre at absolute best in football (and borderline bad most years, REALLY bad in 04 or whenever they went 0-11). Then the Dakota schools split for D1 and the Mavs started scooping those players more often. Started winning and now it’s easier to get those players due to the recent history of success. Mankato has plenty going for it that Marshall doesn’t though, so I realize the difficulty any ball coach is going to have there.

I will say this....I think building a year-in, year-out playoff contender is unrealistic at SMSU in the current makeup of Division II and the NSIC. I think our upside is what we're currently seeing at MSUM: on the fringe of that level, but ultimately a step below. We saw this in 2013 and 2015 here. It happening twice in three years increased the hopes for more within the fan base, but ultimately I think that's a best-case scenario. The key going forward is if we can eliminate the bottoming out in the lean years. In the middle of those two highs was 2014, where we went 3-8. 2014 and 2024 are bookending a 10-year stretch already with five seasons with 3 or fewer wins. That matches a 10-year stretch from 1994-2003. Another season hitting that low mark will bring the program back to the decade between 1975-1984.

[Juke]

I think what SW is referring to was ultimately the demise of the Sauter regime. The transfer portal creation along with the pandemic is what decimated the program which led to his firing and a multi-year rebuilding process for Underwood. I also think the coordinator roulette did no favors. I'm not talking about GAs, as that's an inevitability of the situation for a smaller school with less resources. But specifically the salaried positions, Sauter had a stretch with almost zero consistency or success. It's hard to recruit. It's hard to retain. This is also around when they put a greater emphasis on recruiting Arizona, California, Nevada.

However, I think you and VF are looking at the bigger picture of the program. I do think there has been a bit of an identity issue through my whole 20 years watching the program. We had something we could point to at QB for a long time, but then it all dissipated. I do think Underwood is trying to instill more of a team-wide identity here, but I think he's finding it to be difficult with the new transfer rules.

Sauter has the 2nd most wins in SMSU history, his demise was a result of poor administration that didn’t allow him to keep coaching staff, players and boosters. SMSU is well known for screwing up a good thing, ask Kelly Kruger.