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  • #16
    12th straight loss to Pueblo. Mostly non-competitive losses especially after the first 2-3 years during this run.

    More bad coaching. Chadron up 3-0 in 1st quarter, Chadron has 4th and 6 from Pueblo 29 yardline. Go for 1st down right? Nope, they kick 46 year FG into a very stiff wind and the ball lands on the endline under goal post.

    The 3rd quarter was a disaster. Three turnovers in 3 straight plays. The first two turnovers were Holst interceptions. The third turnover was a fumble on around Chadron's own 15 yardline after the Chadron rb was stopped in the backfield and his forward progress was clearly stopped and he was falling backwards and the ball comes out. This was clearly a very bad call, and the coach didn't even challenge the refs. Obviously, you are not going to get them to overturn the call, but the coach didn't even show any fire, nothing, and the team knew this, so they quit. Next possession, Chadron has 4th and 1 and still hasn't got a 1st down in the 2nd half, and they punt. Defense already quit at this point and Pueblo promptly gets another touchdown in just a few plays.

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    • #17
      Hiring Smith as an OC was not a good decision either. long is losing control and the culture at Chadron is suffering. I wanted Jay to succeed there but it is clearly time for a change.

      Comment


      • #18
        Originally posted by sportsvine View Post
        They really should consider making a change. Jay Long has lost total control of his team. Numerous personal foul penalties, and frankly, it don't look like they are even playing hard anymore.
        Considering why I created this thread last year, I figured this thread needed a bump.

        Comment


        • #19
          As a CSC alumni who attended Chadron during the run of Brad Smith and OB, I agree. The program keeps sinking further and further into irrelevancy. Jay is a nice guy, but it’s clear as a coach he’s mediocre and sliding toward bad.

          Comment


          • #20
            Tons of parity in the RMAC this year. It seems like there is Colorado Mines, and then 7 more teams (in any order), then Chadron and Fort Lewis bring up the rear. With Western beating Pueblo and SD Mines beating Mesa, it just seems like this is the way it is.

            However, Chadron isn't even part of the parity, as they are so bad.

            Comment


            • #21
              Originally posted by sportsvine View Post
              Tons of parity in the RMAC this year. It seems like there is Colorado Mines, and then 7 more teams (in any order), then Chadron and Fort Lewis bring up the rear. With Western beating Pueblo and SD Mines beating Mesa, it just seems like this is the way it is.

              However, Chadron isn't even part of the parity, as they are so bad.
              Hey Sportsvine, I'm trying to reply to both threads here since I think it fits this thread better. I think you're right there's some parity this year. Looked to be like CSC did lose a lot from a year ago. With that I don't think this all of a sudden is the end for Chadron. A few things though that have definitely changed for CSC.

              1. There's another liberal arts school 2 hours away that can compete with the scholarship offers Chadron offers in BH. CSC can no longer use the NAIA D2 argument to lure kids to Chadron. Even after losing last night CSC still can tout their strong following over BHSU and historical dominance. Winning generates that of course. Losing hurts it.

              2. Kearney is seeming to find some traction in the MIAA. Again making it harder to recruit local kids.

              3. I think there is an extreme issue in the Nebraska, South Dakota and Wyomings area producing D2 caliber kids. I remember the good Chadron teams they were full of local players. I'm not as certain on Chadrons classes but BH is hurting for local recruits.

              4. Western States improvement I would think again shrinks the ability for CSC to go to Colorado and get the kids they want.

              ​​​Feel free to add to the list. Most of this is just my initial thoughts on the topic and trying to contribute to the conversation.
              ​​​​​​
              I don't expect BH football to take a huge leap into dominance or anything. But, I don't think that CSC should feel horrible losing. BHSU is a school really pushing to compete as an athletic department. I'm not sure what has changed in Gunnison, other than they have coaches with lots of accolades as coaches and players at CSC. I'm sure they have brought that same culture there.

              Comment


              • #22
                Originally posted by BHer View Post

                Hey Sportsvine, I'm trying to reply to both threads here since I think it fits this thread better. I think you're right there's some parity this year. Looked to be like CSC did lose a lot from a year ago. With that I don't think this all of a sudden is the end for Chadron. A few things though that have definitely changed for CSC.

                1. There's another liberal arts school 2 hours away that can compete with the scholarship offers Chadron offers in BH. CSC can no longer use the NAIA D2 argument to lure kids to Chadron. Even after losing last night CSC still can tout their strong following over BHSU and historical dominance. Winning generates that of course. Losing hurts it.

                2. Kearney is seeming to find some traction in the MIAA. Again making it harder to recruit local kids.

                3. I think there is an extreme issue in the Nebraska, South Dakota and Wyomings area producing D2 caliber kids. I remember the good Chadron teams they were full of local players. I'm not as certain on Chadrons classes but BH is hurting for local recruits.

                4. Western States improvement I would think again shrinks the ability for CSC to go to Colorado and get the kids they want.

                ​​​Feel free to add to the list. Most of this is just my initial thoughts on the topic and trying to contribute to the conversation.
                ​​​​​​
                I don't expect BH football to take a huge leap into dominance or anything. But, I don't think that CSC should feel horrible losing. BHSU is a school really pushing to compete as an athletic department. I'm not sure what has changed in Gunnison, other than they have coaches with lots of accolades as coaches and players at CSC. I'm sure they have brought that same culture there.

                Mostly correct. Chadron doesn’t recruit like they used to during the hay days either. They think they need all the speed from the south and don’t have the buy in they did a few years ago. Kids come from the south and spend one winter in Chaddy and leave a lot. It’s definitely time for a reboot!

                Comment


                • #23
                  Originally posted by BHer View Post

                  Hey Sportsvine, I'm trying to reply to both threads here since I think it fits this thread better. I think you're right there's some parity this year. Looked to be like CSC did lose a lot from a year ago. With that I don't think this all of a sudden is the end for Chadron. A few things though that have definitely changed for CSC.

                  1. There's another liberal arts school 2 hours away that can compete with the scholarship offers Chadron offers in BH. CSC can no longer use the NAIA D2 argument to lure kids to Chadron. Even after losing last night CSC still can tout their strong following over BHSU and historical dominance. Winning generates that of course. Losing hurts it.

                  2. Kearney is seeming to find some traction in the MIAA. Again making it harder to recruit local kids.

                  3. I think there is an extreme issue in the Nebraska, South Dakota and Wyomings area producing D2 caliber kids. I remember the good Chadron teams they were full of local players. I'm not as certain on Chadrons classes but BH is hurting for local recruits.

                  4. Western States improvement I would think again shrinks the ability for CSC to go to Colorado and get the kids they want.

                  ​​​Feel free to add to the list. Most of this is just my initial thoughts on the topic and trying to contribute to the conversation.
                  ​​​​​​
                  I don't expect BH football to take a huge leap into dominance or anything. But, I don't think that CSC should feel horrible losing. BHSU is a school really pushing to compete as an athletic department. I'm not sure what has changed in Gunnison, other than they have coaches with lots of accolades as coaches and players at CSC. I'm sure they have brought that same culture there.

                  You make many points that make sense, and I hadn't thought of before. Points 1 and 2 make total sense. Chadron used to have a recruiting advantage over BHSU due to Chadron being D2 and BHSU being NAIA. That is no longer the case. Kearney, when they moved to the MIAA was a doormat for years, now UNK is a national top 25 team. So, Chadron no longer has a recruiting advantage over Kearney in that it is now Kearney as a winning program and Chadron no longer has the dominance they once had. Of course, CSUP was more of a draw for Colorado recruits, but this is going to apply to the rest of the Colorado schools, in fact, I would think that Colorado has too many D2 schools for Colorado high schools to be sufficiently drawn from.

                  Then there is SD Mines, but SD Mines, I would not think, has to compete with Chadron and BHSU for recruits as they have higher academic requirements, but I would think that SD MInes very much has to compete with Colorado Mines for recruits and CO Mines will forever have an advantage as I would think that CO Mines proximity to Denver is more of a draw than SD Mines being located in Rapid City.

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Originally posted by Eagles Fly View Post

                    Mostly correct. Chadron doesn’t recruit like they used to during the hay days either. They think they need all the speed from the south and don’t have the buy in they did a few years ago. Kids come from the south and spend one winter in Chaddy and leave a lot. It’s definitely time for a reboot!
                    Yeah, I would think that if most of the top regional area talent is now going to BHSU, UNK, and Colorado schools, I would think that Chadron would have no choice but to recruit from the big populated states. I would think that Chadron should concentrate on the Pacific Coast, however, as the western United States lacks many D2 football programs to compete with for recruiting considering the high populations of those areas. I imagine the numerous FCS schools probably recruit heavily from the Pacfic Coast, and D2 programs like Chadron can grab what's left after FCS schools get their choosings. Actually I just looked it up, there are 12 Big Sky teams and 6 WAC teams as those are the only FCS teams west of the Great Plains. It seems there should be plenty of D2 level talent that might be attracted to Chadron as I just said there are very few D2 teams west of the Rocky Mountains.

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Originally posted by sportsvine View Post

                      You make many points that make sense, and I hadn't thought of before. Points 1 and 2 make total sense. Chadron used to have a recruiting advantage over BHSU due to Chadron being D2 and BHSU being NAIA. That is no longer the case. Kearney, when they moved to the MIAA was a doormat for years, now UNK is a national top 25 team. So, Chadron no longer has a recruiting advantage over Kearney in that it is now Kearney as a winning program and Chadron no longer has the dominance they once had. Of course, CSUP was more of a draw for Colorado recruits, but this is going to apply to the rest of the Colorado schools, in fact, I would think that Colorado has too many D2 schools for Colorado high schools to be sufficiently drawn from.

                      Then there is SD Mines, but SD Mines, I would not think, has to compete with Chadron and BHSU for recruits as they have higher academic requirements, but I would think that SD MInes very much has to compete with Colorado Mines for recruits and CO Mines will forever have an advantage as I would think that CO Mines proximity to Denver is more of a draw than SD Mines being located in Rapid City.
                      Agreed, to clarify I'm not leaving out teams like mesa or csup as competitors recruiting. I'm more trying to point out things that have changed in the last ten years.

                      As far as local recruits CSC went in and took a couple kids out of Spearfish High so the way i see it they currently are still asserting their local dominance in recruiting. But may level out some which hurts Chadron.

                      As far as SD mines I think your right. And it pains me to say they are doing good things there too. Took Zac Alcorns son right out of Chadron last year. I'm sure both BH and CSC wanted him. *For the non area people Zac played at both CSC and BH, and played in the NFL at TE*. They lived in Rapid City for a long time so that may feel like home.

                      ​​​

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Originally posted by sportsvine View Post


                        Then there is SD Mines, but SD Mines, I would not think, has to compete with Chadron and BHSU for recruits as they have higher academic requirements, but I would think that SD MInes very much has to compete with Colorado Mines for recruits and CO Mines will forever have an advantage as I would think that CO Mines proximity to Denver is more of a draw than SD Mines being located in Rapid City.
                        A very large advantage CSM has over SDSM in regard to recruiting prospective engineering students is the world renown Petroleum Engineering department. This makes CSM a very attractive program to quality players from Texas, a golden goose of high school talent. Look at the CSM roster and notice how many are from the Lone Star State, the most high profile being QB John Matocha...

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Originally posted by sportsvine View Post

                          You make many points that make sense, and I hadn't thought of before. Points 1 and 2 make total sense. Chadron used to have a recruiting advantage over BHSU due to Chadron being D2 and BHSU being NAIA. That is no longer the case. Kearney, when they moved to the MIAA was a doormat for years, now UNK is a national top 25 team. So, Chadron no longer has a recruiting advantage over Kearney in that it is now Kearney as a winning program and Chadron no longer has the dominance they once had. Of course, CSUP was more of a draw for Colorado recruits, but this is going to apply to the rest of the Colorado schools, in fact, I would think that Colorado has too many D2 schools for Colorado high schools to be sufficiently drawn from.

                          Then there is SD Mines, but SD Mines, I would not think, has to compete with Chadron and BHSU for recruits as they have higher academic requirements, but I would think that SD MInes very much has to compete with Colorado Mines for recruits and CO Mines will forever have an advantage as I would think that CO Mines proximity to Denver is more of a draw than SD Mines being located in Rapid City.
                          The Denver advantage is quite big for CO Mines. The one very big saving grace that SD Mines has though is total cost. With scholarship limits, very few players are getting full rides. Students from any state that borders SD plus CO get in state tuition making SD mines VASTLY cheaper than CO Mines. That’s why we’ve had pretty good success in raiding Colorado for recruits. We don’t have the petroleum engineering major as was mentioned, so the Texas recruits are definitely fewer. I know one big recruiting ground for us is Arizona. There are cheap direct flights from Rapid to Phoenix on Allegiant plus AZ has no D2 teams in the entire state. We’ve been able to get a lot of talent from there in the past. The new HC has also been able to get into more Midwest recruiting through old ties at Northwest MO.

                          As for Chadron and BH, the drop off in Western SD high school football talent has hit them hard. Mines is always only going to get a couple in state kids us being nerds and all. The only big program to really maintain talent from what I’ve seen is Winner much to my chagrin. The evil blue empire I played for in high school is a shadow of what it used to be. Additionally, BH and CSC have to compete with Northern and their brand new facility for SD recruits. To be fair though, I’m not exactly sad about either of those teams falling off. Chadron having to eat some humble pie for a few years would do them good.

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Originally posted by HardRockin'Nerd View Post

                            The Denver advantage is quite big for CO Mines. The one very big saving grace that SD Mines has though is total cost. With scholarship limits, very few players are getting full rides. Students from any state that borders SD plus CO get in state tuition making SD mines VASTLY cheaper than CO Mines. That’s why we’ve had pretty good success in raiding Colorado for recruits. We don’t have the petroleum engineering major as was mentioned, so the Texas recruits are definitely fewer. I know one big recruiting ground for us is Arizona. There are cheap direct flights from Rapid to Phoenix on Allegiant plus AZ has no D2 teams in the entire state. We’ve been able to get a lot of talent from there in the past. The new HC has also been able to get into more Midwest recruiting through old ties at Northwest MO.

                            As for Chadron and BH, the drop off in Western SD high school football talent has hit them hard. Mines is always only going to get a couple in state kids us being nerds and all. The only big program to really maintain talent from what I’ve seen is Winner much to my chagrin. The evil blue empire I played for in high school is a shadow of what it used to be. Additionally, BH and CSC have to compete with Northern and their brand new facility for SD recruits. To be fair though, I’m not exactly sad about either of those teams falling off. Chadron having to eat some humble pie for a few years would do them good.
                            I wouldn't count chickens just yet. Lots of football to play and I saw plenty of good players on CSCs team. BHSU probably has a better team than they've had in quite a few years so I don't think they've "fallen off". As far as eastern SD there's a lot more teams than Northern State. You have the entire Northern Sun conference to deal with and a long trip down I90 to get west River.

                            Winner has been a good program. However I don't think that's been a place either school has recruited much. It's schools like Harding County, Hot Springs, Spearfish, Sturgis, the Rapid City schools, Chadron and the other Western Nebraska schools. And Wyoming schools like Douglas, Gillette, Casper, etc. These towns have produced many good players. Yet lately there has not been the quantity or quality that there has been in the past at least in my view.

                            ​​​​​

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Originally posted by CSM alum 1993 View Post

                              A very large advantage CSM has over SDSM in regard to recruiting prospective engineering students is the world renown Petroleum Engineering department. This makes CSM a very attractive program to quality players from Texas, a golden goose of high school talent. Look at the CSM roster and notice how many are from the Lone Star State, the most high profile being QB John Matocha...
                              I didn't know that on the petroleum department. Definitely a good way to get Texas kids!

                              As far as SD Mines I know years ago they added sports medicine to attract more athletic minded students. At one point in think 75 percent of the football team had that as their major.

                              Looking at the roster I also saw some "Business Management in Technology" majors. Which tells me they added a normal business degree to attract more kids just like sports medicine. Add technology to the end of the degree I guess makes it fit a tech school... Adding these majors has made it easier for them to get kids that don't want to be engineers.

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Originally posted by BHer View Post

                                I didn't know that on the petroleum department. Definitely a good way to get Texas kids!

                                As far as SD Mines I know years ago they added sports medicine to attract more athletic minded students. At one point in think 75 percent of the football team had that as their major.

                                Looking at the roster I also saw some "Business Management in Technology" majors. Which tells me they added a normal business degree to attract more kids just like sports medicine. Add technology to the end of the degree I guess makes it fit a tech school... Adding these majors has made it easier for them to get kids that don't want to be engineers.
                                Interesting... I confess I've never looked at the SDSM curriculum. CSM did add a "Mineral Economics" degree sometime after I graduated. I'm not sure what the difference is between that and a traditional economics curriculum... I do like that both CSM and SDSM are diversifying since the university creates a broader appeal. Once upon a time a niche offering might have made sense, but likely not anymore.

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