Azusa to drop football

[ram_boy]

Sad to hear the news. I guess the best scenario would be to join the RMAC. Does anyone have any insight on how interested the RMAC is in expanding? The Frontier Conference might be their only other choice.

Simon Fraser I guess could go back to playing in a Canadian conference.

[tsull]

Azusa tuition and fees is $50,000 a year, Multiply by 100 football players and that's $5 million. Surprised APU wanted to flush $5M.

https://www.apu.edu/undergraduate-ad.../cost/tuition/

[APUFootballAlum]

Azusa tuition and fees is $50,000 a year, Multiply by 100 football players and that's $5 million. Surprised APU wanted to flush $5M.

https://www.apu.edu/undergraduate-ad.../cost/tuition/

True, but I can't help but look at the outrageous amount of financial aid that APU awards. The average financial aid award for the 2019 freshman class was $25,168 for those who had a financial aid need (78.7% of applicants). 19.8% of applicants did not have a need for financial aid, yet this group still received an average of $9,698. Here's a link to the source: https://www.collegedata.com/college/...file-money-tab

All this to say APU hands out financial aid like crazy - so I don't think we can reasonably assume that the program brings in roughly $5 million in revenues from its walk-on's tuitions. Honestly, I think the sticker price is absurdly high - especially that very few, if any, pay full price. However, as a side note, with a sticker price of roughly $53,000, APU probably couldn't justify the 36 scholarships either. I don't have a source for this, it is just my inclination from being an alum and supporter of the program. I think the school in general has been hurting financially for quite a while; the new president was brought in to right the financial ship. Your guess is as good as mine as to whether or not the plan actually succeeds in the future but it is quite obvious that APU is hurting from a financial perspective.

[Turbonium]

I hope they'll join the RMAC.

Not happening, that footprint would be stupid.

[tsull]

True, but I can't help but look at the outrageous amount of financial aid that APU awards. The average financial aid award for the 2019 freshman class was $25,168 for those who had a financial aid need (78.7% of applicants). 19.8% of applicants did not have a need for financial aid, yet this group still received an average of $9,698. Here's a link to the source: https://www.collegedata.com/college/...file-money-tab

All this to say APU hands out financial aid like crazy - so I don't think we can reasonably assume that the program brings in roughly $5 million in revenues from its walk-on's tuitions. Honestly, I think the sticker price is absurdly high - especially that very few, if any, pay full price. However, as a side note, with a sticker price of roughly $53,000, APU probably couldn't justify the 36 scholarships either. I don't have a source for this, it is just my inclination from being an alum and supporter of the program. I think the school in general has been hurting financially for quite a while; the new president was brought in to right the financial ship. Your guess is as good as mine as to whether or not the plan actually succeeds in the future but it is quite obvious that APU is hurting from a financial perspective.

Yeah but whether you get financial aid or not the money goes to the institution. The money isn't subtracted and given to the government, it still goes to the institution. So if a student gets $25,000 in aid Azusa Pacific is still getting all the money. When division one booster clubs raise money for scholarships, the money goes to the university when the kids are on a full ride or not. The money isn't disappearing into the stratosphere, it's going to the university.

[Wildcat Khan]

Not happening, that footprint would be stupid.

It is the closest conference geographically though. What other D2 options do you see other than all 3 schools going independent? Again this is making the Pacific Northwest feel like the red headed step child that nobody wants. Also, that footprint wouldn't be much different than the Pac-12 so is the Pac-12 footprint stupid?.

[Turbonium]

It is the closest conference geographically though. What other D2 options do you see other than all 3 schools going independent? Again this is making the Pacific Northwest feel like the red headed step child that nobody wants. Also, that footprint wouldn't be much different than the Pac-12 so is the Pac-12 footprint stupid?.

It is the closest, but for the RMAC it would be idiotic. I don't know what their options are but the RMAC shouldn't be one. It is unfortunate for those schools but it makes zero sense for the RMAC to at all entertain that idea.

Pac-12 schools don't bat an eye at the cost to fly teams several times a season, this isn't the Pac-12, these are schools that can't even come close to the D2 scholarship limit and certainly don't need to greatly increase their travel budgets with basically no real reward for doing so.

[tsull]

It is the closest, but for the RMAC it would be idiotic. I don't know what their options are but the RMAC shouldn't be one. It is unfortunate for those schools but it makes zero sense for the RMAC to at all entertain that idea.

It would probably be one Northwest trip every year for each school, I sort of figured it out. The GNAC's would have to make two trips each to RMAC country.

There's more incentive for the GNAC than the RMAC. The Lone Star has helped keep GNAC football alive, perhaps buddy up with the people who support you. The RMAC has so many football members, there might not be a need. Collegiate athletics is pretty dog eat dog, I don't see a lot of conferences helping others out. If D2 eventually dies out they can only blame themselves.

[Turbonium]

It would probably be one Northwest trip every year for each school, I sort of figured it out. The GNAC's would have to make two trips each to RMAC country.

There's more incentive for the GNAC than the RMAC. The Lone Star has helped keep GNAC football alive, perhaps buddy up with the people who support you. The RMAC has so many football members, there might not be a need. Collegiate athletics is pretty dog eat dog, I don't see a lot of conferences helping others out. If D2 eventually dies out they can only blame themselves.

I'm not sure it is up to the RMAC to take a financial hit to save other schools when they already financially struggle as is. Your scenario is all well and good for the GNAC teams but doesn't make any sense for a conference champion overall. I don't know the solution and I really hope the 3 schools find one, just don't think the RMAC has any reason to pursue it.

[Brandon]

If D2 eventually dies out they can only blame themselves.

This is exactly right. Administrators and coaches mostly care about what is right in front of their noses and dismiss much else. They never look at the big picture.

[tsull]

I'm not sure it is up to the RMAC to take a financial hit to save other schools when they already financially struggle as is. Your scenario is all well and good for the GNAC teams but doesn't make any sense for a conference champion overall. I don't know the solution and I really hope the 3 schools find one, just don't think the RMAC has any reason to pursue it.

I think you're right. If the RMAC had six schools, this alliance would work quite well; they have I believe 10 football-playing schools. They can basically play almost an entire season of league-only play. I just don't see an incentive for the RMAC to do it. A lot of the schools would have to bus to Denver and then catch a plan. It's tough.

Small college football is tough in the West, schools are really far apart from each other. The D3 league in the Northwest -- formerly a fine NAIA league with all the state schools -- has several quick trips, five Oregon schools all within in an hour or less drive of each other.

GNAC, RMAC, NAIA Frontier? It's tough, travel is the big obstacle ... well, that and cowardly administrators.

[Wildcat Khan]

I'm not sure it is up to the RMAC to take a financial hit to save other schools when they already financially struggle as is. Your scenario is all well and good for the GNAC teams but doesn't make any sense for a conference champion overall. I don't know the solution and I really hope the 3 schools find one, just don't think the RMAC has any reason to pursue it.

I'm not sure if you are aware, but CWU used to be in the RMAC for wrestling. That was when I was a student at CWU and we voted for a fee to save the program (which now has been cut along with swimming). I know wrestling teams are smaller than football teams for travel though, but it worked backed then.

[crixus]

I'm not sure if you are aware, but CWU used to be in the RMAC for wrestling. That was when I was a student at CWU and we voted for a fee to save the program (which now has been cut along with swimming). I know wrestling teams are smaller than football teams for travel though, but it worked backed then.

Thanks for sharing that information. I noticed CWU only has 6 men's and 7's women's sports listed on their athletics website. Hope you don't lose anymore.

[Goods]

I'm not sure if you are aware, but CWU used to be in the RMAC for wrestling. That was when I was a student at CWU and we voted for a fee to save the program (which now has been cut along with swimming).

I vividly remember voting for that fee. I had plenty of swimming and wrestling friends when I went to CWU in the late 90s. Those teams were nationally relevant every year.

[Turbonium]

I'm not sure if you are aware, but CWU used to be in the RMAC for wrestling. That was when I was a student at CWU and we voted for a fee to save the program (which now has been cut along with swimming). I know wrestling teams are smaller than football teams for travel though, but it worked backed then.

I was not aware but yes, football travel costs would be quite a bit more. This on top of the fact that schools are going to be struggling to rebound from the impacts of the pandemic as is, adding travel costs just doesn't seem feasible. If I'm a fan of a team funding well under the scholarship limit I would want money to go towards that, not traveling even more. That's a 20+ hour bus trip from Pueblo to Ellensburg, I'd rather see the top RMAC teams join the LSC if they're going to be making trips like that.