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  • Hello

    Miss you guys. Hope all is well. NMSU fans in the other board are more annoying than any ACU poster that use to frequent this board. Even worse than the A&M Commerce fan on the Facebook Texas football history group.


    any who... hope all is well.

    Rat

  • #2
    Hey Rat........the LSC is not as much fun without you guys. Especially in men's BB. That's for sure. We had some great battles through the years. Lon held the upper hand for much of the last two decades. The tide has turned to WT's shore since Tom Brown's arrival at the Buff helm.

    What are your thoughts for WT, TAMC, and ASU's future vis a vis the D2 vs D1 FCS debate? Each and collectively?

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by BuffaloChip View Post
      Hey Rat........the LSC is not as much fun without you guys. Especially in men's BB. That's for sure. We had some great battles through the years. Lon held the upper hand for much of the last two decades. The tide has turned to WT's shore since Tom Brown's arrival at the Buff helm.

      What are your thoughts for WT, TAMC, and ASU's future vis a vis the D2 vs D1 FCS debate? Each and collectively?
      Hey Chip. I knew you were asking Rat but I think WT would be competitive right away in every sport but football. Most sports in the southland sans football would definitely be top 3-5. I would suspect WAC might be the same but not near the knowledge of their sports outside of the few teams that play football and basketball.

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by BuffaloChip View Post
        Hey Rat........the LSC is not as much fun without you guys. Especially in men's BB. That's for sure. We had some great battles through the years. Lon held the upper hand for much of the last two decades. The tide has turned to WT's shore since Tom Brown's arrival at the Buff helm.

        What are your thoughts for WT, TAMC, and ASU's future vis a vis the D2 vs D1 FCS debate? Each and collectively?
        Big rumors that WT is on the move to join Tarleton in the WAC. JUST RUMORS,. WAC is announcing a new member within a few weeks.

        Tarleton already has a plan and approval for $72 million multi-purpose event/convocation/arena. Also building a new state of the art Rodeo arena to be "the best program in the country." A&M system is projecting 25,000 students by 2030.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by wisdomgymrat View Post

          Big rumors that WT is on the move to join Tarleton in the WAC. JUST RUMORS,. WAC is announcing a new member within a few weeks.

          Tarleton already has a plan and approval for $72 million multi-purpose event/convocation/arena. Also building a new state of the art Rodeo arena to be "the best program in the country." A&M system is projecting 25,000 students by 2030.
          My wife's first cousin, Levi Garcia from Roy, New Mexico, graduated from Tarleton on a full ride rodeo scholarship. He spent about 10 years on the PBR bull-riding circuit.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by BuffaloChip View Post

            My wife's first cousin, Levi Garcia from Roy, New Mexico, graduated from Tarleton on a full ride rodeo scholarship. He spent about 10 years on the PBR bull-riding circuit.
            Buffalo Chip, what's your opinion on the WT D1 rumors?

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Vulpes88 View Post

              Buffalo Chip, what's your opinion on the WT D1 rumors?
              I have no idea what is happening behind closed doors. Any opinion I have is purely speculative and hypothetical. With that out of the way, I can either give you some stock market tips or my WT D1 opinion. My WT D1 opinion would surely outstrip any stock tips I could pass on. Which tells you it's not worth much. So, here goes.

              When I look at the D1 potential for WT (and when I say WT it is concurrent opinion included for TAMC and ASU), I have actually began to warm up to the idea. I fear that the "old" LSC has been co-opted by "new" LSC non-FB schools. Looking 5-10-20 years down the road, D1 / FCS must be in WT's sports future. The defection of Tarleton set the wheels in motion. It deepened intensity for it's sister LSC regional schools to look beyond the horizon and imagine new possibilities.

              When you look at the D1 / FCS beds, it boils down to the Southland and the WAC. I just don't see the Southland as welcoming or as aspirational for WT as the WAC. I believe Tarleton knew something. Today's WAC has 9 schools with NM State and Tarleton being the only FB players. The WAC seems to have committed to adding football schools to the conference. If, for instance, WT, TAMC, ASU, ACU, NColo, N Arizona, Augustana, and S Utah joined the WAC it would have 17 schools, 10 of which play FB. That's a 9 game conference schedule. It works for FB. All other sports could be split into East / West divisions. It works for the other sports.

              Would it work for WT (TAMC, ASU, ACU)? Yes. For the WAC? Yes!

              To be competitive, WT's athletic budget would have gradually increase to the $25M range. Scholarship costs would probably increase by @ $1.5M a year. Administration positions would increase. More paid coaching positions and higher salaries. Larger recruiting budgets. Travel costs would increase. Etc etc etc. FB recruiting would have to step up big time. Recruiting for the other sports would need to be enhanced, but they are all pretty much competitive right now.

              I betcha, all the parties previously mentioned, from the WAC on, are weighing the what ifs, mulling over the possibilities, and putting some bare feet in the water to test the temperature. I betcha!

              With strong leadership from the WT President, AD and the university (and moral support from Daddy university systems) such a move is possible. I imagine our AD, somewhere in his bag of tricks, has a 5 year plan to increase WT's athletic budget to $25M. It will require intensified outreach to alumni, business, and prominent bedrock corporate commitment. Enrollment would need to increase over that 5 year period to @ 15,000. It would be expected that enrollment would grow hand-in-hand with the move to D! / FCS.

              The tripwire for WT, TAMC, and / or ASU is any of them pulling the D! / FCS trigger. Do they move individually or collectively?
              Last edited by BuffaloChip; 10-10-2020, 12:41 PM.

              Comment


              • #8
                Good post Chip. The conference doesn’t seem to have any urgency to replace Tarleton with another football school as they have in the past. I have heard UT Dallas another non football school is interested in joining the LSC. I guess football may become a bit more diminished in this new merger Conference. It’s kind of disappointing.

                As far as WT moving up I have a few thoughts. No inside knowledge just what I see from the outside looking in. Tarleton always wanted into the Southland and to me it looked like a done deal except for the fact the SLC wasn’t ready or just didn’t want them. Who really knows. I personally think the SLC missed an opportunity and it could come back bite them.

                The WAC started talking to Tarleton. Then Dixie State joined the WAC. Tarleton with a push from Big Brother also joined. WAC must’ve told both they would be sponsoring a football conference. Now another school has joined I assume football school and will be announced in a few weeks. So, now you have 3 and you only need 6 for a conference and an automatic bid into playoffs.

                So, with three schools playing football why wouldn’t the WAC make a push for ACU for Tarleton and UIW for UTRGV. This would give you 5. Both schools would be immediately in line for a shot at a conference title. Unlike the bloated conference they now play in. Another aspect to look at is that there are more peer private universities in the WAC whereas the SLC is mostly regional public schools. Opportunity is knocking. Plus even with all the bad PR the WAC gets, it still Is more well known national brand than the SLC.

                So, that brings us back to WT. They would be in the geographical footprint for WAC football. I do believe Northern Colorado has to be looking hard at this as well. They have been miserable in the 13 team football Big Sky conference. WT has the resources and the backing and they will be able to compete when their probationary period is up.

                Not sure what timeline or even what schools are all involved. But as we have seen in the past with realignments it just takes one big rock to start the avalanche.



                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by BuffaloChip View Post

                  I have no idea what is happening behind closed doors. Any opinion I have is purely speculative and hypothetical. With that out of the way, I can either give you some stock market tips or my WT D1 opinion. My WT D1 opinion would surely outstrip any stock tips I could pass on. Which tells you it's not worth much. So, here goes.

                  When I look at the D1 potential for WT (and when I say WT it is concurrent opinion included for TAMC and ASU), I have actually began to warm up to the idea. I fear that the "old" LSC has been co-opted by "new" LSC non-FB schools. Looking 5-10-20 years down the road, D1 / FCS must be in WT's sports future. The defection of Tarleton set the wheels in motion. It deepened intensity for it's sister LSC egional schools to look beyond the horizon and imagine new possibilities.

                  When you look at the D1 / FCS beds, it boils down to the Southland and the WAC. I just don't see the Southland as welcoming or as aspirational for WT as the WAC. I believe Tarleton knew something. Today's WAC has 9 schools with NM State and Tarleton being the only FB players. The WAC seems to have committed to adding football schools to the conference. If, for instance, WT, TAMC, ASU, ACU, NC, N Arizona, Augustana, and S Utah joined the WAC it would have 17 schools, 10 of which play FB. That's a 9 game conference schedule. It works for FB. All other sports could be split into East / West divisions. It works for the other sports.

                  Would it work for WT (TAMC, ASU, ACU)? Yes. For the WAC? Yes!

                  To be competitive, WT's athletic budget would have gradually increase to the $25M range. Scholarship costs would probably increase by @ $1.5M a year. Administration positions would increase. More paid coaching positions and higher salaries. Larger recruiting budgets. Travel costs would increase. Etc etc etc. FB recruiting would have to step up big time. Recruiting for the other sports would need to be enhanced, but they are all pretty much competitive right now.

                  I betcha, all the parties previously mentioned, from the WAC on, are weighing the what ifs, mulling over the possibilities, and putting some bare feet in the water to test the temperature. I betcha!

                  With strong leadership from the President, AD and the university (and moral support from Daddy university systems) such a move be possible. I imagine our AD, somewhere in his bag of tricks, has a 5 year plan to increase WT's athletic budget to $25M. It will require intensified outreach to alumni, business, and prominent bedrock corporate commitment. Enrollment would need to increase over that 5 year period to @ 15,000. It would be expected that enrollment would grow hand-in-hand with the move to D! / FCS.

                  The trigger for WT, TAMC, and ASU is any of them pulling the D! / FCS trigger. Do they move individually or collectively?
                  Good post. Just wanted to know what a WTAMU fan/alumnus was thinking.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Techster88 View Post
                    Good post Chip. The conference doesn’t seem to have any urgency to replace Tarleton with another football school as they have in the past. I have heard UT Dallas another non football school is interested in joining the LSC. I guess football may become a bit more diminished in this new merger Conference. It’s kind of disappointing.

                    As far as WT moving up I have a few thoughts. No inside knowledge just what I see from the outside looking in. Tarleton always wanted into the Southland and to me it looked like a done deal except for the fact the SLC wasn’t ready or just didn’t want them. Who really knows. I personally think the SLC missed an opportunity and it could come back bite them.

                    The WAC started talking to Tarleton. Then Dixie State joined the WAC. Tarleton with a push from Big Brother also joined. WAC must’ve told both they would be sponsoring a football conference. Now another school has joined I assume football school and will be announced in a few weeks. So, now you have 3 and you only need 6 for a conference and an automatic bid into playoffs.

                    So, with three schools playing football why wouldn’t the WAC make a push for ACU for Tarleton and UIW for UTRGV. This would give you 5. Both schools would be immediately in line for a shot at a conference title. Unlike the bloated conference they now play in. Another aspect to look at is that there are more peer private universities in the WAC whereas the SLC is mostly regional public schools. Opportunity is knocking. Plus even with all the bad PR the WAC gets, it still Is more well known national brand than the SLC.

                    So, that brings us back to WT. They would be in the geographical footprint for WAC football. I do believe Northern Colorado has to be looking hard at this as well. They have been miserable in the 13 team football Big Sky conference. WT has the resources and the backing and they will be able to compete when their probationary period is up.

                    Not sure what timeline or even what schools are all involved. But as we have seen in the past with realignments it just takes one big rock to start the avalanche.


                    UNC has been miserable in football only and only due to being terrible. Are you suggesting that going to a joke of a football conference would fix their woes?

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Turbonium View Post

                      UNC has been miserable in football only and only due to being terrible. Are you suggesting that going to a joke of a football conference would fix their woes?
                      Yes, it could give them a chance to regroup in a 6 team fledging conference where they won't be competing against established larger budget schools. I am sure that there are those at UNC that are thinking the same thing. Plus, if there are Texas schools it could help them recruit here as well. It is just me thinking out loud. I have no idea which teams will be in the start up conference or even when it will get off the ground. But, it appears they may be half way to 6 before Dixie or Tarleton has played one game.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        New member for the WAC is Southern Utah out of Cedar City. WAC football conference is going to happen. More schools to follow.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Techster88 View Post

                          Yes, it could give them a chance to regroup in a 6 team fledging conference where they won't be competing against established larger budget schools. I am sure that there are those at UNC that are thinking the same thing. Plus, if there are Texas schools it could help them recruit here as well. It is just me thinking out loud. I have no idea which teams will be in the start up conference or even when it will get off the ground. But, it appears they may be half way to 6 before Dixie or Tarleton has played one game.
                          If they're doing fine in several other sports I don't see them going to a conference that could easily fail soon. The WAC used to be solid, now...not so much. I don't see UNC making that change just due to football right after having hired a big name coach.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Turbonium View Post

                            If they're doing fine in several other sports I don't see them going to a conference that could easily fail soon. The WAC used to be solid, now...not so much. I don't see UNC making that change just due to football right after having hired a big name coach.
                            You have a valid point when talking other sports. My thinking is football because that’s all I really watch and keep up with. As far as the WAC failing, if it hasn’t already failed my guess is from this point forward it only gets stronger especially if football schools keep joinIng whether D2 move ups or FCS crossovers. So that scenario is not likely. Hiring a former NFL guy might be a big name but not a big name Coach. Big difference.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Techster88 View Post

                              You have a valid point when talking other sports. My thinking is football because that’s all I really watch and keep up with. As far as the WAC failing, if it hasn’t already failed my guess is from this point forward it only gets stronger especially if football schools keep joinIng whether D2 move ups or FCS crossovers. So that scenario is not likely. Hiring a former NFL guy might be a big name but not a big name Coach. Big difference.
                              Not in CO it's not a big difference. This is an all in hire that's expected to get results and not by moving to a weak conference.

                              Comment

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