West Liberty Hilltopper Basketball

[Dirtybird]

Re: West Liberty Hilltopper Basketball

After Watson left there are 12 that dress and 2 red shirts, one that sits on the bench and one that is not allowed. 14 total, minus 5 seniors, plus 3 signed recruits equals 12 so far for next year. Is that correct?

[Columbuseer]

Re: West Liberty Hilltopper Basketball

We've got three already coming in who are supposed to be top notch. With them we have 12 players under "contract" for next year and Ben has gone with 14 or 15 in his two years so it wouldn't surprise me if a couple more come in. Maybe a long term D1 transfer and/or a last minute decomit from another team.

Have watched hazelbaker and Conley several times in person. Both have high motors and high basketball iqs and complete games. Play unselfishly even though they are best player on team. Imho both may redshirt to get stronger for college game. But they could very well surprise in open gym.

[Columbuseer]

Re: West Liberty Hilltopper Basketball

Good post! Do we sign another recruit or two?

[Topper912]

Re: West Liberty Hilltopper Basketball

I think winning tomorrow would be huge for future success. Getting the younger guys experience playing in the Elite 8 would be HUGE.

[Sportsnut]

Re: West Liberty Hilltopper Basketball

OK, let me see if I have this correct.

15 were on team (counting Boswell)
-1 (Watson) left team ?
-5 seniors (Allen, Arnold, Primmer, French, and Meininger)
+3 recruits committed (Hazelbaker 6-7, Butler 6-4 and Conley 6-0)
-------
12 Remaining. Usually always has the full 13 plus one or two redshirted. That would possibly leave 1-3 more that could be signed. In addition
someone like Saban who get very little playing time might transfer if history repeats itself. Maybe 4 more recruits is possible.
Does this sound right?

[boatcapt]

Re: West Liberty Hilltopper Basketball

Good post! Do we sign another recruit or two?

We've got three already coming in who are supposed to be top notch. With them we have 12 players under "contract" for next year and Ben has gone with 14 or 15 in his two years so it wouldn't surprise me if a couple more come in. Maybe a long term D1 transfer and/or a last minute decomit from another team.

[Sportsnut]

Re: West Liberty Hilltopper Basketball

Good post! Do we sign another recruit or two?

[Columbuseer]

Re: West Liberty Hilltopper Basketball

So here we sit in the Regional Final again looking for our sixth Regional Title and trip to the Elite 8 in the last 10 years. Still plenty of basketball to be played Tuesday night vs a team that is the polar opposite of WLU in Mercyhurst. Hope the team is not thinking beyond Hurst because that could cost them big time! But as a fan, I can think beyond!!

So what do make of this years WLU team? The first thought that comes to mind is young...second thought is "house money." We've talked about it several times over the year, but this years Topper squad is young as grass and as such, they were really built to make runs starting next season. The conventional wisdom heading into this season, at least for me, was that we would be a 7-8 loss team that would probably be a 7 or 8 seed. I wouldn't have been happy with that but given the youth on the team, I wouldn't have been disappointed either. As the season went by and the team started racking up impressive wins, I stated to recalibrate my expectations but still did not see them playing for a Regional Title. I started looking at them as a 4/5 or MAYBE a #3 seed who won a first round game but bowed out the next night.

So what do I mean by "house money?" As I said, this team is really built to compete starting next year and then the year after that. This year was supposed to be a season when our young's learned how to play the college game and the team learned how to play together. Any success they had this year was unexpected and I think unplanned (well...unplanned by us fans). In that respect they are playing with house money. Problem with house money is eventually the house stops giving it to you! Will that be Tuesday night? Maybe. Will it be after they win the National Championship? Don't know!!

So where does this years team fall in the pantheon of Topper teams? I'd put them on par with the 09/10 Toppers that finished as the Regional runner up. This was the year that future stars Faulk, Morrow and Hausfield got experience that resulted in a string of three Regional Titles.

[boatcapt]

Re: West Liberty Hilltopper Basketball

So here we sit in the Regional Final again looking for our sixth Regional Title and trip to the Elite 8 in the last 10 years. Still plenty of basketball to be played Tuesday night vs a team that is the polar opposite of WLU in Mercyhurst. Hope the team is not thinking beyond Hurst because that could cost them big time! But as a fan, I can think beyond!!

So what do make of this years WLU team? The first thought that comes to mind is young...second thought is "house money." We've talked about it several times over the year, but this years Topper squad is young as grass and as such, they were really built to make runs starting next season. The conventional wisdom heading into this season, at least for me, was that we would be a 7-8 loss team that would probably be a 7 or 8 seed. I wouldn't have been happy with that but given the youth on the team, I wouldn't have been disappointed either. As the season went by and the team started racking up impressive wins, I stated to recalibrate my expectations but still did not see them playing for a Regional Title. I started looking at them as a 4/5 or MAYBE a #3 seed who won a first round game but bowed out the next night.

So what do I mean by "house money?" As I said, this team is really built to compete starting next year and then the year after that. This year was supposed to be a season when our young's learned how to play the college game and the team learned how to play together. Any success they had this year was unexpected and I think unplanned (well...unplanned by us fans). In that respect they are playing with house money. Problem with house money is eventually the house stops giving it to you! Will that be Tuesday night? Maybe. Will it be after they win the National Championship? Don't know!!

So where does this years team fall in the pantheon of Topper teams? I'd put them on par with the 09/10 Toppers that finished as the Regional runner up. This was the year that future stars Faulk, Morrow and Hausfield got experience that resulted in a string of three Regional Titles.

[boatcapt]

Re: West Liberty Hilltopper Basketball

So True. Another issue with AAU seems to be there is little regard for committing turnovers. Extrapolating based on his minutes played, if Ariel had played 40 minutes he would have committed over 8 turnovers and committed 5.5 fouls!. I saw him throw a long pass downcourt into double coverage with a small window to Nate Allen that was Tom Brady-esque. Should never have been thrown. Nate only caught it because if the opposing guard had gone for the intercept, the collision with a man the size of Nate would have put him in the ER!

There is a guy in Columbus who got MVP of the 270 Hoops league this fall. Unstoppable in a playground AAU game, averaging over 30 pts. I went to see him play a high school team, thinking that I would see a complete player dominate in a structured game. He was totally ineffective in a team offense and his defense was non-existent. Bad passes, turnovers. A much less talented team had their way with them.

AAU is killing USA basketball (Kobe Bryant happens to agree. He thinks Euro players are superior now)

Players LOVE them some scoring! Funny thing is that you CAN have it both ways. Just look at WLU...High scoring were every player is free to take an open shot (but is expected to pass the ball if the shot is not open) but is expected to play D. Counter pose how WLU plays against Glenville, a team that seems to really embrace the AAU "style" (jack up a lot of shots and play almost no defense). They can sure score at times but when faced with a team that can "score more" because they play smartly, not even close...WLU is 52 points better than Glenville.

[Columbuseer]

Re: West Liberty Hilltopper Basketball

Three little letters...A A U. Seems like their mantra is "Can't spell NBA with defense!"

So True. Another issue with AAU seems to be there is little regard for committing turnovers. Extrapolating based on his minutes played, if Ariel had played 40 minutes he would have committed over 8 turnovers and committed 5.5 fouls!. I saw him throw a long pass downcourt into double coverage with a small window to Nate Allen that was Tom Brady-esque. Should never have been thrown. Nate only caught it because if the opposing guard had gone for the intercept, the collision with a man the size of Nate would have put him in the ER!

There is a guy in Columbus who got MVP of the 270 Hoops league this fall. Unstoppable in a playground AAU game, averaging over 30 pts. I went to see him play a high school team, thinking that I would see a complete player dominate in a structured game. He was totally ineffective in a team offense and his defense was non-existent. Bad passes, turnovers. A much less talented team had their way with them.

AAU is killing USA basketball (Kobe Bryant happens to agree. He thinks Euro players are superior now)

[Columbuseer]

Re: West Liberty Hilltopper Basketball

WLU doesn't bring in many JUCO's (Watson is the only one that comes to mind but there could be one or two others). Just my take is that with JUCO's, you get what you get. They don't seem to be very interested in being coached up.

WLU does favor bring in HS players they can mold. Red shirting is not uncommon but they will give a true freshman the opportunity to start if they come in capable (Dave Dennis started as a TF and this year Yaehl Hill starts as a TF). WLU has also started relatively recently to bring in an occasional transfer...typically those are multi year guys but occasionally they are the one and done variety if there is a particular need.

Heck, maybe Joe will bring him in. You guys seem to be in the market for WLU cast offs (Dyer and Humphreies)!! Given how WLU players perform when they leave WLU, that's not a bad recruiting strategy!!

Good Points. Many players also need time to adapt to the level of effort that is required. It is a shock even for D1 transfers who thought they were playing hard to realize that they are not even close to playing with the level of effort that WL expects. Some never adjust enough to get major minutes.

[boatcapt]

Re: West Liberty Hilltopper Basketball

I agree that he will probably land somewhere. IMHO, if he wants to play in Europe, he has to work on his understanding of team fundamentals as well as defense. I hope he will work on these skills at the next stop for him. A redshirt would have been great for him, but I wonder if his pride would not allow it.
As I said before, I liked the guy and was hoping that he would quickly address the deficiencies in his game. Had he done so, he would have gotten major minutes in 1st or 2nd platoon.
What puzzles me is how could such a player have been coached all these years without being taught a lick of defense? I mean, everything from his stance to his positioning on the court was worse than a middle school player.

Three little letters...A A U. Seems like their mantra is "Can't spell NBA with defense!"

[Columbuseer]

Re: West Liberty Hilltopper Basketball

WL is very systematic. JUCO imports are 'typically' more playground types. WL also loves to redshirt players and let them slowly work in to their roles. There's not always time to do that with transfers. Joe Lombardi is one of the only coaches I know who can convince incoming junior transfers to routinely redshirt. If you tell most they are going to redshirt they will just go somewhere else. Tossing a JUCO scorer in to the WL system is a big ask for most of those guys. JUCO ball is essentially AAU style.

He obviously has some talent, size and speed. Sounds like it just wasn't a good fit from both ends. He won't have trouble finding a home somewhere. The quiting in late FEB part, however, is a big red flag (if that's indeed how it went down).

I agree that he will probably land somewhere. IMHO, if he wants to play in Europe, he has to work on his understanding of team fundamentals as well as defense. I hope he will work on these skills at the next stop for him. A redshirt would have been great for him, but I wonder if his pride would not allow it.
As I said before, I liked the guy and was hoping that he would quickly address the deficiencies in his game. Had he done so, he would have gotten major minutes in 1st or 2nd platoon.
What puzzles me is how could such a player have been coached all these years without being taught a lick of defense? I mean, everything from his stance to his positioning on the court was worse than a middle school player.

[boatcapt]

Re: West Liberty Hilltopper Basketball

WLU doesn't bring in many JUCO's (Watson is the only one that comes to mind but there could be one or two others). Just my take is that with JUCO's, you get what you get. They don't seem to be very interested in being coached up.

WLU does favor bring in HS players they can mold. Red shirting is not uncommon but they will give a true freshman the opportunity to start if they come in capable (Dave Dennis started as a TF and this year Yaehl Hill starts as a TF). WLU has also started relatively recently to bring in an occasional transfer...typically those are multi year guys but occasionally they are the one and done variety if there is a particular need.

Heck, maybe Joe will bring him in. You guys seem to be in the market for WLU cast offs (Dyer and Humphreies)!! Given how WLU players perform when they leave WLU, that's not a bad recruiting strategy!!