G-MAC / GLIAC Updates

[Brandon]

Right. Geography is obviously not the only factor.

[boatcapt]

Geographically, A-B in the MEC is what makes sense.

Yep. Not saying that geography is not a factor just that it is not the only factor schools consider. I also think that sometimes we over estimate the geographic differences from one conference to another. Certanly geography can trump other factors if the difference is dramatic OR if the school is in severe financial difficulty, but neither appear to be present in the case of NDC and the MEC/GMAC. NDC is a really good fit in the MEC from a level of competition, school size, commitment to athletic and geographic standpoint. Beyond a relatively small geographic advantage, there really is no compelling reason for NDC to leave the MEC. Buuuuuttttt...Could say the same thing about NDC in the GMAC or possibly even the PSAC. As with a lot of teams in the PA/WV/OH/MD area, they would fit nicely in a number of conferences (Lincoln PA to the PSAC, Bowie to the MEC, Frostburg to the PSAC, Shepherd back to the MEC, etc).

[Brandon]

D&E didn't generally have bad blood with the MEC when the WVIAC split-up. I think D&E to the MEC was because of some sort of friendship relationship because they just don't meet any of the MEC expectations for it's members.

AB is a different story...one that has been covered in detail in the past on this board so I won't go into it again. Suffice to say that there was bad blood between the two. Took a pretty major shake-up at AB for the MEC to bring them in.

Geographically, A-B in the MEC is what makes sense.

[boatcapt]

And D&E going to the MEC, ultimately money generally wins out over bad blood.

D&E didn't generally have bad blood with the MEC when the WVIAC split-up. I think D&E to the MEC was because of some sort of friendship relationship because they just don't meet any of the MEC expectations for it's members.

AB is a different story...one that has been covered in detail in the past on this board so I won't go into it again. Suffice to say that there was bad blood between the two. Took a pretty major shake-up at AB for the MEC to bring them in.

[Brandon]

Exactly...You would think that a school that really really wanted to join a conference would take every opportunity to schedule them in OOC games. But that clearly doesn't happen. Couple that with the public statements that have come from NDC about how happy they are in the MEC and the insignifigant travel distance savings of jumping to the GMAC and it's pretty clear that there is not a compelling reason or desire to move.

After 9 years and counting, pretty obvious that the "NDC to the GMAC" is more a desire of some than it is a real thing.

NDC as part of the GMAC makes sense, but so does Hillsdale returning to the GLIAC and Kentucky Wesleyan returning to the GLVC. Tiffin and Findlay belong in the GLIAC as much as they belong in the GMAC, geographically.

[boatcapt]

Exactly. I'm sure at some point all can be forgiven.

Obviously, NDC left the G-MAC while it was still in its infancy. They also left their GLIAC affiliate memberships behind (football, soccer, some other sports) only one year after really pushing for membership. So, between the old time G-MAC schools and the former GLIAC/now G-MAC schools, I'm sure its possible that there is still some bad blood. As BoatCapt has pointed out, NDC doesn't appear on G-MAC out of conference schedules as much as you would think a down-the-road school should.

That said, presidents change and ADs change and time moves on. Before you know it, no one remembers why you were so mad.

Exactly...You would think that a school that really really wanted to join a conference would take every opportunity to schedule them in OOC games. But that clearly doesn't happen. Couple that with the public statements that have come from NDC about how happy they are in the MEC and the insignifigant travel distance savings of jumping to the GMAC and it's pretty clear that there is not a compelling reason or desire to move.

After 9 years and counting, pretty obvious that the "NDC to the GMAC" is more a desire of some than it is a real thing.

[Brandon]

Seconded, this is not an indictment of KWC and TNU. They are fine members and will be happy to have them as long as they stay. I am just saying if I was them, KWC to the GLVC and TNU to maybe the Peach Belt or something makes more sense.

The SAC would make the most sense for them, but the other conference has to have a want and a need for them to make it happen.

[boatcapt]

Yes, it seems well established that there is some sort of bad blood between the GMAC and NDC connected to why NDC left the conference at the beginning. My bet is that given the tighter budgets due to COVID and the nearly 10 years worth of time from the original problem (whatever it was) will push NDC past whatever feelings got hurt and go with the more cost effective option.

Well...The two "principles" that were in place when NDC left the GMAC are still in place...Scott Swain, AD at NDC and Tom Daeger, Comish of the GMAC. Clearly there was some friction between them and quite possibly still is. I would say that any move will not happen until one or both leave. Similar to AB not joining the MEC till the Crehans left.

I've compared driving distance (costs) and as currently configured, the advantage to the GMAC is not that great (If memory serves me, on the order of 40 miles average driving distance difference). And if you add UIndy to the equation, the driving distance advantage for the GMAC shrinks by almost 20 miles. The small distance difference and de minimis saving clearly is not enough to convince NDC that the "juice is worth the squeeze."

[BlueBlood]

Same thing happened with AB going to the MEC.

Exactly. I'm sure at some point all can be forgiven.

Obviously, NDC left the G-MAC while it was still in its infancy. They also left their GLIAC affiliate memberships behind (football, soccer, some other sports) only one year after really pushing for membership. So, between the old time G-MAC schools and the former GLIAC/now G-MAC schools, I'm sure its possible that there is still some bad blood. As BoatCapt has pointed out, NDC doesn't appear on G-MAC out of conference schedules as much as you would think a down-the-road school should.

That said, presidents change and ADs change and time moves on. Before you know it, no one remembers why you were so mad.

[Uindy18]

Same thing happened with AB going to the MEC.

And D&E going to the MEC, ultimately money generally wins out over bad blood.

[ESU Warrior]

Yes, it seems well established that there is some sort of bad blood between the GMAC and NDC connected to why NDC left the conference at the beginning. My bet is that given the tighter budgets due to COVID and the nearly 10 years worth of time from the original problem (whatever it was) will push NDC past whatever feelings got hurt and go with the more cost effective option.

Same thing happened with AB going to the MEC.

[Uindy18]

The discussion about "inviting" KW and TNU to move to a conference that better meets their needs is often part of the seemingly monthly recruing discussion about NDC joining the GMAC. As I've stated, the primary argument people make in favor of this move now is a travel distance one. But when you factor travel to KW and TNU into the average travel distance equation, the GMAC travel distance advantage for NDC largely evaporates.

There clearly is something stopping NDC from jumping conferences that travel distance, shared history, Ohio Centric, etc can't overcome.

Yes, it seems well established that there is some sort of bad blood between the GMAC and NDC connected to why NDC left the conference at the beginning. My bet is that given the tighter budgets due to COVID and the nearly 10 years worth of time from the original problem (whatever it was) will push NDC past whatever feelings got hurt and go with the more cost effective option.

[boatcapt]

I know. Another poster said that if the G-MAC doesn't kick them out they'll never leave (like they are a problem). They are not a problem.

The discussion about "inviting" KW and TNU to move to a conference that better meets their needs is often part of the seemingly monthly recruing discussion about NDC joining the GMAC. As I've stated, the primary argument people make in favor of this move now is a travel distance one. But when you factor travel to KW and TNU into the average travel distance equation, the GMAC travel distance advantage for NDC largely evaporates.

There clearly is something stopping NDC from jumping conferences that travel distance, shared history, Ohio Centric, etc can't overcome.

[Uindy18]

Agreed, I am not saying they should be booted. Simply that if I was AD at either one, I would want too explore my other options sooner rather than later.

Seconded, this is not an indictment of KWC and TNU. They are fine members and will be happy to have them as long as they stay. I am just saying if I was them, KWC to the GLVC and TNU to maybe the Peach Belt or something makes more sense.

[BlueBlood]

Agreed, I am not saying they should be booted. Simply that if I was AD at either one, I would want too explore my other options sooner rather than later.

I know. Another poster said that if the G-MAC doesn't kick them out they'll never leave (like they are a problem). They are not a problem.