GSC teams to join into the GAC?

[Bisonfan from FLA]

On the GAC forum was posted the following:

ETBU to the GAC?

05-02-2024, 12:20 AM
I'm not sure if anyone has followed the implosion of the American Southwest Conference (D3) that has seen 8 members move to other D3 conferences and abandoning East Texas Baptist, Howard Payne, Hardin Simmons, and Mary Hardin Baylor.

There simply isn't anywhere for the four to go in D3. There is a long shot of merging with a Southern California conference... but it just doesn't make $$ or geographic sense.

The poster wrote how of the four teams, ETBU is more physically aligned with the Oklahoma and Arkansas GAC members and could consider a move up to join the GAC. But that would mean a need for another team to join and also to make sure to keep the balance for the whole conference. I wrote the following response:

I wonder about what may be down the road for the Gulf South, specifically for Delta State and Mississippi College.It looks as if some of the GSC might be moving up to and out of D2 so where does that leave DSU and MC? They are physically close to the Arkansas teams and they may be needing a place to call home.

But that would create an imbalance on the Eastern side of the Arkansas/Oklahoma GAC footprint. To remedy that, what if NE Oklahoma or Central Oklahoma left from the MIAA and then ETBU came in to balance that Western side of the Arkansas/Oklahoma GAC footprint? Now the GAC covers four states, has 16 teams, can create a non-silo schedule and have a championship game between the two halves of the conference.

Thoughts?

Now I pass along to our friends in the GSC this information and thought . . . what might you think, being teams to our eastern footprint, of joining into the GAC should there be an equal joining of some teams on the western side or our conference?

[CalifOKRA]

It's crazy to think all the Arkansas schools ran from GSC competition but, a decade later, the GAC may be stronger than the GSC in football.
Seems like the Arkansas schools made a solid decision.

[Eagle74]

With the GAC having an exceptional Harding team this season, which ran roughshod through it's own conference, in no way elevates the GAC as a whole above the GSC.

Now that may be the case if the GSC is diluted as a stand along conference without making modifications and changes in the near future. The clock is rapidly ticking.

With the direction the GSC may be headed for survival, (and I wish them the best) I can fully understand DSU's possible need of cozying up to the GAC, while there's still a chance.

[BisonBones]

My understanding is that DSU would need to add a couple sports to be eligible for the GAC.

Of course, in one important aspect, DSU is unacceptably deficient to the GAC which should bar their addition.

We simply can't add the boring name of "statesmen" to a conference with Muleriders, Reddies, Wonder Boys, Boll Weevils, and Bison(s). They must formally change their name to the Fighting Okra before I would support their addition.

[baldereagle]

Just an opinion from a former player.....I would think West Alabama might be good fit for the GAC. We are less than two hours from Mississippi College.

[BisonBones]

Just an opinion from a former player.....I would think West Alabama might be good fit for the GAC. We are less than two hours from Mississippi College.

I agree, except I think that would be pushing the resources of a few of the Oklahoma schools with that travel. Although, having separate divisions would limit that travel to every few years.

Let me provide a pretty radical proposal. Splitting the Oklahoma and Arkansas schools of the GAC. Oklahoma schools form a new conference with NE Okla/OCU/etc. The Arkansas schools joint with DSU, Miss College, and UWA. Both conferences now are out of silo scheduling. All the Oklahoma schools are now much more competitive to be in the top of their conference and the Arkansas schools get better competition

[Finchwidget]

Let me provide a pretty radical proposal. Splitting the Oklahoma and Arkansas schools of the GAC. Oklahoma schools form a new conference with NE Okla/OCU/etc. The Arkansas schools joint with DSU, Miss College, and UWA. Both conferences now are out of silo scheduling. All the Oklahoma schools are now much more competitive to be in the top of their conference and the Arkansas schools get better competition

Wasn't the Oklahoma State Legislature trying to get this to happen pretty recently? I thought that didn't end up going anywhere

[Eagle74]

Just curious, with a definite change of wind in the air for The GSC, what would the Valdosta State Fans like to see happen, especially with their football program?

[CalifOKRA]

My understanding is that DSU would need to add a couple sports to be eligible for the GAC.

Of course, in one important aspect, DSU is unacceptably deficient to the GAC which should bar their addition.

We simply can't add the boring name of "statesmen" to a conference with Muleriders, Reddies, Wonder Boys, Boll Weevils, and Bison(s). They must formally change their name to the Fighting Okra before I would support their addition.

In all honesty, I'm for it. I wish we would change our official mascot to the Fightin' Okra. We're more known for our unofficial mascot than our official.

[CalifOKRA]

Just an opinion from a former player.....I would think West Alabama might be good fit for the GAC. We are less than two hours from Mississippi College.

If Delta leaves, I would prefer West Alabama comes along, regardless of the conference affiliation. We have played 70 games against each other since 1940. That is the most games Delta has played against any one opponent. West Alabama's football history page doesn't go back that far, but I have to assume 70 games played is up there with the most games played against an opponent.

- West Alabama = 70 games
* North Alabama = 61 games
- Mississippi College = 44 games
- Valdosta State = 43 games
* Troy University = 40 games

[athensblazer]

Just curious, with a definite change of wind in the air for The GSC, what would the Valdosta State Fans like to see happen, especially with their football program?

As a VSU alum and Blazer fan, I would like to see Valdosta State make the move to the ASUN or Southern Conference. We just do not have the rivalries, excitement, or vibrancy on campus for most current GSC opponents in most sports. The GSC WAS great for VSU - when UNA, UWG, Troy, Jacksonville were the competition. In that GSC era even our out-of-conference football opponents - GA Southern, UCF, FAU, UTEP - were higher profile - and that drove interest. Would certainly miss Delta St and West Florida, but otherwise we need to join more comparable institutions in athletics to engage the alumni that I talk to. VSU is a natural fit for ASUN with so much history with their current schools - and we would immediately bring competitive programs in a number of sports. I also think that the Southern Conference would benefit from having another large regional state university in their conference to join UT Chat, WCU, and ETSU in football.

Our recently retired AD always presented to move to I-AA as "we would be competing against Alabama and Georgia across all sports for championships", and while this is technically correct, VSU has missed out on so much opportunity to drive interest in basketball and baseball/softball (where we have solid programs) because a DI conference championship allows a school to punch a ticket to the big dance - and then who knows. GA Southern, UCF, Troy - and now UNA - have enjoyed great interest due to their evolution and maintaining pace with their peers.

VSU leadership needs to get after it. There have been many times that VSU has filled Bazemore to 10K and that there has been excitement in Valdosta and across Georgia for the Blazers - but not against Keiser or North Greenville, or other small independent schools. If VSU would at least schedule stronger out-of-conference there would be an increase in interest (regardless of what it does to playoff rankings). The titles are great, but I would be far more interested if we scheduled (and beat) UNA, West GA, Kennesaw St, Mercer, WCU, etc.

[Eagle74]

There have been many times that VSU has filled Bazemore to 10K and that there has been excitement in Valdosta and across Georgia for the Blazers .

I like VSU and the Blazers had a very good record last season, but the fact is that they only averaged far less than 5,000 in attendance per home game, and only topped 5K once with 5,396 ironically against NGU. Not exactly higher division numbers.

[athensblazer]

I like VSU and the Blazers had a very good record last season, but the fact is that they only averaged far less than 5,000 in attendance per home game, and only topped 5K once with 5,396 ironically against NGU. Not exactly higher division numbers.

You are making my point very well - that a schedule filled with smaller, lower profile independent schools results in little interest. The 5,396 attending on Family Day was by far the largest crowd that NGU played in front of last year, including at D1 Charleston Southern. In the past VSU has drawn better in football against higher profile opponents. This is not to disrespect smaller colleges, as we ourselves are a smaller university compared to others - but over the past several years our schedule and now our GSC is almost exclusively smaller, lower profile schools. It is a challenge to get up a big tail gate for the Keiser or Edward Waters games.

The original question posed was, what would VSU like to see. As for this Blazer, and some of my friends, we would like to see VSU play more schools that are in our category and the ASUN or SoCon would seem to be the way to do that. I really don't care about the division number or conference name as much as competing against peer schools. I would rather compete against UTC or Mercer for a SoCon championship and ticket to CFP, or against North Alabama or West GA for a chance to the bball dance than I would to play Ohio Dominican in a D2 playoff run - not because the school or competition is inadequate, but because there is little interest all around - on campus, with/for the opponent, from TV, etc.

Thirty years ago VSU had less than 8,000 students and averaged 5,000 - 7,500 in football game attendance, when the GSC had higher profile schools. VSU was one of two comprehensive, and six total universities in the University system.

Today VSU has over 10,000 students and is averaging 3,500 - 5,000 in football game attendance. There is little buzz. I believe the opponents - conference affiliation - has something to do with that.

Thirty years ago VSU was one of the top five or six universities in the University system - and emerging. Today, despite the otherwise growth of the institution, VSU's status has slipped - and I think the athletic profile has something to do with that.

[CalifOKRA]

VSU and UWF should absolutely move up. The GSC is a shell of its former self, and it's getting worse. Heck, Delta State University may not even be around in 3-5 years.

[athensblazer]

VSU and UWF should absolutely move up. The GSC is a shell of its former self, and it's getting worse. Heck, Delta State University may not even be around in 3-5 years.

I have always enjoyed visiting Cleveland and Greenville - food and people are great, and Delta State has a beautiful camps. Would hate to see anything happen with Delta State.

It is challenging on many fronts for any institution that is not super G5. NIL, NCAA lawsuits, conference realignment - and the enrollment cliff - must make it tough to be an AD.

In Georgia, consolidating institutions has had mixed success. It worked well for U of North Georgia and Middle Georgia State. I could see Valdosta merging with nearby SGA St campuses in Douglas and Waycross to become University of South Georgia (or stay Valdosta State) - would lose some history, but the regional focus, and combined enrollment and fee boost could really help create some efficiency with degree delivery. Would really help the institution brand and athletics. It feels like GROW OR DIE right now.

Delta State would benefit from some consolidation perhaps - wish you had a partner where Delta would be the lead institution because it is a great school in a unique area.