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NFL Draft is approaching! Any NSIC pro hopefuls this year?

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  • #31
    Nice work SW MUSTANG.

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    • #32
      Originally posted by vikingfaithful View Post
      Nice work SW MUSTANG.
      Thanks!

      I'd kinda always wondered what our NFL output was historically.

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      • #33
        Originally posted by SW_Mustang View Post

        Thanks!

        I'd kinda always wondered what our NFL output was historically.
        Hopefully the trend flips and we get some more prolonged successful NFL Careers!

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        • #34
          Originally posted by zimmy21 View Post

          Hopefully the trend flips and we get some more prolonged successful NFL Careers!
          USF has two alumni currently in the NFL.

          Dennis Gardick has been with the Arizona Cardinals for four seasons, and Trey Pipkins has been with the LA Chargers for three seasons.

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          • #35
            Originally posted by Tundra_Man View Post

            USF has two alumni currently in the NFL.

            Dennis Gardick has been with the Arizona Cardinals for four seasons, and Trey Pipkins has been with the LA Chargers for three seasons.
            That is great! Pipkins is from Apple Valley, MN iirc? It is always great exposure for the league to get these guys to hit the 2nd contract. So many people just assume they are training camp fodder, but this conference has some true ballplayers in it and it needs some recognition.

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            • #36
              Originally posted by zimmy21 View Post

              Hopefully the trend flips and we get some more prolonged successful NFL Careers!
              That's what I'm hoping for. Actually, let's do that too and compare - here's all of the NFL players post (and including) Adam Thielen to see game action:


              Augustana University

              CJ Ham, 2016-2020 (5)
              (Spent 2016 on practice squad)
              Brandon Zlystra, 2018-2020 (3)
              (Transferred to DIII Concordia-Moorhead)


              Bemidji State University

              Brian Leonhardt, 2013-2016 (4)
              (Spent 2016 on the practice squad of four teams)
              Gunner Olszewski, 2019-2020 (2)


              Concordia-St. Paul

              Zach Moore, 2014-2018 (4)


              University of Sioux Falls

              Dennis Gardeck, 2018-2020 (3)
              Trey Pipkins, 2019-2020 (2)


              Minnesota State University - Mankato

              Adam Thielen, 2013-2020 (8)
              (Spent 2013 on practice squad)
              Chris Reed, 2015-2020 (6)


              Comparisons

              tl;dr - This list isn't perfect, take it with a grain of salt.


              This isn't intended to be a super scientific comparison - PFR's listings are inconsistent at best, and most likely incomplete. For example, they list DJ Hackett as playing with Northern State before transferring to Colorado, which is incorrect. He played for CSU-Northridge, which is a bit different. I also believe there to be a handful more players than what they have listed, especially coming from the wild west era of professional football from the 1920's-1950's. It's still a great resource.

              PFR also only starts the clock when a player compiles stats (though they do list Fred Williams for SCSU in 2014). I chose to squeeze in Dominick Cruz for NSU by including his year on the practice squad, and I tried to do that for other players when I came across it, but this variable is definitely incomplete across the board. Just not enough time to fact check every little detail for this - though I wish I could. Maybe someday.

              There was also the issue of whether to include guys like Zylstra and Widseth - and even transfers like Mecklenburg/Falcon. That's just based on my own nitpickiness when it comes to collecting football cards, though. Zylstra and the latter two technically played for their respective current-day NSIC schools, but they weren't signed to the NFL out of them. Widseth technically played for Northwest School of Agriculture, which would later become UMC - but he didn't play for the four year institution football program.

              Lastly, I scrapped the three-season variable for the new list, simply because Olszewski and Pipkins haven't been in the NFL long enough to meet that standard, but they will do so more than likely this upcoming season. It just so happened that every player post-Thielen has been in the NFL for longer than 3 years. There are probably a couple dozen guys historically who saw game action, but I wanted to keep this to people with staying power, mostly in the interest of time.


              Here's the stats from my last list:

              Players: 26
              Years: 1923-2009
              Seasons: 86

              Adjusted for the two outliers listed before 1940:

              Players: 24
              Years: 1960-2009
              Seasons: 50

              And the stats from the current one:

              Players: 9
              Years: 2013-2020
              Seasons: 8

              My Personal Conclusion

              Despite the apples-to-oranges comparisons, arbitrary decisions on my part as to who to include, and the small sample size, I do think we are seeing a higher rate of players who are able to achieve some sort of career length in the NFL. We also introduced three guys this year who are very capable of making this list by this time next year by seeing some game action. I do think Adam Thielen is a big driver of NFL interest in the NSIC, which is why he was the cutoff point. It's obviously a lot more to it than one guy though.

              That being said, the key thing I wanted to look at here was longevity - and if we don't account for that, the previous list would probably more than double. Lots of guys saw game action for 1-2 seasons, and lots more spent time on practice squads. I think this can be attributed to various things - like cutting the draft down, and better scouting techniques/technology.

              One other thing to note - of those 9 players, Adam Thielen and CJ Ham are Pro-Bowlers, Gunner Olszewski is a First-Team All-Pro, and Trey Pipkins is a Day 2 draft selection.

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              • #37
                Originally posted by Tundra_Man View Post

                USF has two alumni currently in the NFL.

                Dennis Gardick has been with the Arizona Cardinals for four seasons, and Trey Pipkins has been with the LA Chargers for three seasons.
                I was bored towards the end of the NFL season so I did a little project where I wrote to a handful of NSIC alums. I think I accidentally sent Pipkins' letter to Qualcomm Stadium (d'oh!), but Gardeck responded with a signed football card.

                It was one of these - it was really nice of him given that it was his own personal copy:



                He had a good 2020 season. Maybe we can add him to the list of Pro-Bowlers in the next few seasons?

                Chris Reed wrote me a full page letter, and CJ Ham signed a couple of index cards for me. Olszewski was the only one I didn't get a response from - but that could be for a number of reasons not related to him. I didn't write to Thielen or Zylstra, I'll try them next season.

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                • #38
                  Originally posted by SW_Mustang View Post

                  I was bored towards the end of the NFL season so I did a little project where I wrote to a handful of NSIC alums. I think I accidentally sent Pipkins' letter to Qualcomm Stadium (d'oh!), but Gardeck responded with a signed football card.

                  It was one of these - it was really nice of him given that it was his own personal copy:



                  He had a good 2020 season. Maybe we can add him to the list of Pro-Bowlers in the next few seasons?

                  Chris Reed wrote me a full page letter, and CJ Ham signed a couple of index cards for me. Olszewski was the only one I didn't get a response from - but that could be for a number of reasons not related to him. I didn't write to Thielen or Zylstra, I'll try them next season.
                  Great work SW!
                  That is really cool about the responses from the NSIC Alums. I totally agree with the Thielen take. He was the catalyst that propelled the NSIC territory being given some more looks. Happy for anyone that makes the NFL out of this conference, the longevity would be my biggest concern as well. Lot's of guys get invites, but often don't make a 2nd camp. That 2nd contract really tells you what the team thinks about them

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                  • #39
                    Originally posted by zimmy21 View Post

                    Great work SW!
                    That is really cool about the responses from the NSIC Alums. I totally agree with the Thielen take. He was the catalyst that propelled the NSIC territory being given some more looks. Happy for anyone that makes the NFL out of this conference, the longevity would be my biggest concern as well. Lot's of guys get invites, but often don't make a 2nd camp. That 2nd contract really tells you what the team thinks about them
                    Thanks!

                    I think teams in the '70s and '80s were a little more willing to throw at the wall and see what sticks - taking all kinds of random players. But the draft was cut down from 12 rounds to 8 in 1992, and 7 in 1993. Between 1992 and 2012 (20 years), 8 players started their NFL careers and lasted three or more seasons (all but one of those coming before 2004). Between 2013-2020, there were 9. Granted, most were UDFA guys, but still...

                    To illustrate my point, I just explained in the SMSU thread about a WR of ours who went in the 10th Round of the 1991 Draft to the Falcons - the problem was, he was ineligible to legally play football. The Falcons knew this, but took him anyway because he was fast. I don't think teams are so willing to do stuff like that now that they can't take as many players. Kind of an oddball example, but I think it highlights my point.

                    It seems like now, NFL teams are willing to put more effort on fewer players - and it must be paying off given the longevity we're seeing is pretty unprecedented for this many guys in this short of a timespan. Thielen is definitely the catalyst, as are your standard things like technology/social media making these guys more visible. But I also think that D2 as a whole has closed the talent gap ever so slightly to FCS/FBS. That's not to say we can compete with those schools, but we're not as far behind athletically as we used to be. Facilities are better, equipment is better, the coaches are better... the players turn down FCS bench offers for D2 starting ones... all kinds of stuff fueling the change.

                    As for the NSIC alums - it was a neat little project. I'm hoping to add the "other" Zylstra this season, as well as Heim and Garrett depending on where they end up after camps. CJ Ham is the only one of the group I've also met personally, he was doing an appearance for the Vikings in Marshall - I (quietly) asked him to sign with "Go Augie!" on the cards they were handing out. He seems like a very reserved guy - but very cool nonetheless.

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                    • #40
                      Also, this photo is pretty dang awesome. Cardinals at Vikings, 2018:

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