NSIC Scores, Final Standings and Tournament Brackets (2/18)

[NSU4LIFE]

Re: NSIC Scores, Final Standings and Tournament Brackets (2/18)

Dapper is correct...Mankato was 5th in the NSIC with a 105.08 Defensive Rating (points allowed per 100 possessions). They did play with an average of 69 (nice) possessions per game, which was 11th or 12th in the league, so a slower pace aiding their top-ranked points per game allowed numbers.

Thanks for the laugh today...I didn't realize this account was ROB gronkowski

[WSUDieHard]

Re: NSIC Scores, Final Standings and Tournament Brackets (2/18)

You aint seen nothin yet. I'm seeing the next few years as an epic disasters.

Sorry...I did some editing for you if you don't mind

[MrAugustana]

Re: NSIC Scores, Final Standings and Tournament Brackets (2/18)

I can't see the coach surviving more than 1 more year. Just my 2 cents

I would bet there's a 0%-5% chance Eisner is fired in the next year, and still a minuscule chance he's fired anytime in the next 2-3 years.

Does nobody on this message board recognize the gravity of the Leaf situation and where the program was when Eisner took over? You're talking about a program that--less than what, 4 years prior?--had reached the Elite Eight and two years or so before that had just won its second National Championship in three years, yet their applicant pool for the position was...relatively unimpressive...to put it kindly. Especially compared to what the applicant pool would've looked like without the Leaf situation unfolding like it did.

As you could see from the finalists, the position wasn't exactly a highly-coveted and sought-after job the way WSU fans seem to want to think it was. If I remember correctly, it's not as if the WSU fans on here were jumping for joy about any of the candidates when the finalists' names were released. The program had a nationally-covered sex-related scandal hovering over its head, dwindling attendance numbers, and all kinds of internal issues. Any coach willing to take that job most likely had to do so with the assurance from the athletic department that he would have at least 4-5 years to try to get things turned around.

I absolutely, 100% recognize that the Warriors don't exactly look like they'll win the National Championship in the next year or two, but to think Eisner will be fired so quickly after inheriting a program that was a complete mess seems really unrealistic to me. If he's in year 4 or 5 and the wins column still isn't increasing, then yes, I'd say he'll be on a pretty short leash, but my guess is he has at least another season and a half, if not more, before that hot seat starts to warm up.

[DapperDan]

Re: NSIC Scores, Final Standings and Tournament Brackets (2/18)

I would bet there's a 0%-5% chance Eisner is fired in the next year, and still a minuscule chance he's fired anytime in the next 2-3 years.

Does nobody on this message board recognize the gravity of the Leaf situation and where the program was when Eisner took over? You're talking about a program that--less than what, 4 years prior?--had reached the Elite Eight and two years or so before that had just won its second National Championship in three years, yet their applicant pool for the position was...relatively unimpressive...to put it kindly. Especially compared to what the applicant pool would've looked like without the Leaf situation unfolding like it did.

As you could see from the finalists, the position wasn't exactly a highly-coveted and sought-after job the way WSU fans seem to want to think it was. If I remember correctly, it's not as if the WSU fans on here were jumping for joy about any of the candidates when the finalists' names were released. The program had a nationally-covered sex-related scandal hovering over its head, dwindling attendance numbers, and all kinds of internal issues. Any coach willing to take that job most likely had to do so with the assurance from the athletic department that he would have at least 4-5 years to try to get things turned around.

I absolutely, 100% recognize that the Warriors don't exactly look like they'll win the National Championship in the next year or two, but to think Eisner will be fired so quickly after inheriting a program that was a complete mess seems really unrealistic to me. If he's in year 4 or 5 and the wins column still isn't increasing, then yes, I'd say he'll be on a pretty short leash, but my guess is he has at least another season and a half, if not more, before that hot seat starts to warm up.

I tend to agree with that. Probably will give the guy a few years to turn things around before pulling the plug. He does have a history of success although at the NAIA level. I really don't know how that translates. I could see where Malvik could be more at risk in that he is a holdover that Eisner did not bring with him and he hasn't exactly shown a knack for getting top-flight recruits. Although in fairness again he is working out from under a real mess. I'm sure it hasn't been too hard for other coaches to undermine Winona when competing for recruits.

Stunning what one drunken pervert can do to a program.

[MrMustang]

Re: NSIC Scores, Final Standings and Tournament Brackets (2/18)

I would bet there's a 0%-5% chance Eisner is fired in the next year, and still a minuscule chance he's fired anytime in the next 2-3 years.

Does nobody on this message board recognize the gravity of the Leaf situation and where the program was when Eisner took over? You're talking about a program that--less than what, 4 years prior?--had reached the Elite Eight and two years or so before that had just won its second National Championship in three years, yet their applicant pool for the position was...relatively unimpressive...to put it kindly. Especially compared to what the applicant pool would've looked like without the Leaf situation unfolding like it did.

As you could see from the finalists, the position wasn't exactly a highly-coveted and sought-after job the way WSU fans seem to want to think it was. If I remember correctly, it's not as if the WSU fans on here were jumping for joy about any of the candidates when the finalists' names were released. The program had a nationally-covered sex-related scandal hovering over its head, dwindling attendance numbers, and all kinds of internal issues. Any coach willing to take that job most likely had to do so with the assurance from the athletic department that he would have at least 4-5 years to try to get things turned around.

I absolutely, 100% recognize that the Warriors don't exactly look like they'll win the National Championship in the next year or two, but to think Eisner will be fired so quickly after inheriting a program that was a complete mess seems really unrealistic to me. If he's in year 4 or 5 and the wins column still isn't increasing, then yes, I'd say he'll be on a pretty short leash, but my guess is he has at least another season and a half, if not more, before that hot seat starts to warm up.

This is music to me ears. He was not a good hire regardless of the situation.

Winona could have hired one of their stud former players who knew the system and tradition and could have recruited the hell out of that place.

Winona being down is sure good for my school.

[MrAugustana]

Re: NSIC Scores, Final Standings and Tournament Brackets (2/18)

This is music to me ears. He was not a good hire regardless of the situation.

Winona could have hired one of their stud former players who knew the system and tradition and could have recruited the hell out of that place.

Winona being down is sure good for my school.

You do realize they were literally trying that and failing at it when Eisner was hired, right?

[MrMustang]

Re: NSIC Scores, Final Standings and Tournament Brackets (2/18)

I would bet there's a 0%-5% chance Eisner is fired in the next year, and still a minuscule chance he's fired anytime in the next 2-3 years.

Does nobody on this message board recognize the gravity of the Leaf situation and where the program was when Eisner took over? You're talking about a program that--less than what, 4 years prior?--had reached the Elite Eight and two years or so before that had just won its second National Championship in three years, yet their applicant pool for the position was...relatively unimpressive...to put it kindly. Especially compared to what the applicant pool would've looked like without the Leaf situation unfolding like it did.

As you could see from the finalists, the position wasn't exactly a highly-coveted and sought-after job the way WSU fans seem to want to think it was. If I remember correctly, it's not as if the WSU fans on here were jumping for joy about any of the candidates when the finalists' names were released. The program had a nationally-covered sex-related scandal hovering over its head, dwindling attendance numbers, and all kinds of internal issues. Any coach willing to take that job most likely had to do so with the assurance from the athletic department that he would have at least 4-5 years to try to get things turned around.

I absolutely, 100% recognize that the Warriors don't exactly look like they'll win the National Championship in the next year or two, but to think Eisner will be fired so quickly after inheriting a program that was a complete mess seems really unrealistic to me. If he's in year 4 or 5 and the wins column still isn't increasing, then yes, I'd say he'll be on a pretty short leash, but my guess is he has at least another season and a half, if not more, before that hot seat starts to warm up.

weren't Smith, Zellman, and Malvick -- or at least a couple of them interested? Like I said, they made a big mistake.

[MrAugustana]

Re: NSIC Scores, Final Standings and Tournament Brackets (2/18)

weren't Smith, Zellman, and Malvick -- or at least a couple of them interested? Like I said, they made a big mistake.

Winona fans, help me out here if I'm mistaken, but weren't Malvik and Smith were already on staff with Leaf? And then wasn't Malvik named interim head coach? And they had basically no next-level recruits committed during that time. Again, please correct me if I'm wrong, Warrior fans.

[MrMustang]

Re: NSIC Scores, Final Standings and Tournament Brackets (2/18)

You do realize they were literally trying that and failing at it when Eisner was hired, right?

You mean as interim I assume. Yep, and he would have been a better hire.

[MrMustang]

Re: NSIC Scores, Final Standings and Tournament Brackets (2/18)

Winona fans, help me out here if I'm mistaken, but weren't Malvik and Smith were already on staff with Leaf? And then wasn't Malvik named interim head coach? And they had basically no next-level recruits committed during that time. Again, please correct me if I'm wrong, Warrior fans.

I've been involved in a number of hiring committees and seen dozens of coaches come and go at SMSU in the last 20 years. The one thing you learn in time is that a bad hire is realized almost immediately. Like in year 1. A bad hire is much easier to sport that a good hire.

With a good hire, you get a good vibe, but you still need to see how it goes for say 2 years and evaulate.

With a bad hire, you know right away, in year 1, during the season, it isn't going to work out. You see in show in different ways for different coaches but it is there. You can recognize it over time that there is no way it will work .

sometimes you see it in the coaches' lack of committment in recruiting. sometimes you see they dread talking to boosters and fans. sometimes they just can't coach, but you learn to spot a "bust". believe me. i've seen it here at SMSU.

I can remember when we hired Curt Stasheim for football 15 years ago. halfway through season 1 you knew it was a mess, terrible mistake etc. There have been others too. but we all instinctively know this.

[DapperDan]

Re: NSIC Scores, Final Standings and Tournament Brackets (2/18)

Winona fans, help me out here if I'm mistaken, but weren't Malvik and Smith were already on staff with Leaf? And then wasn't Malvik named interim head coach? And they had basically no next-level recruits committed during that time. Again, please correct me if I'm wrong, Warrior fans.

Malvik and Smith were assistants to Leaf. After the Leaf fiasco Smith got cross-ways with administration and was shown the door. Malvik was interim coach for a time. I don't know what recruits he had lined up before Eisner was hired. I have heard on this board that Sam Baker was his recruit and Eisner wasn't that thrilled with him. He didn't last through the Fall. Hiring a former player wasn't an option as I understand it as the AD required a new coach have head coaching experience. What they really needed to do was entice Brown and Gove to come back but seeing as neither had head coaching experience that wasn't an option even though they had more to do with building the successful program than Leaf did. Sharp move.

I don't see hiring a former player as a particularly smart move. Just because someone is a good player doesn't make them a good coach, especially not having much coaching experience. Malvik was Leaf's assistant for one year. I think Smith may have been a graduate assistant under Leaf for one year. Before that he was helping out at Lewiston High School. Not exactly a stellar resume. The only other former player from the glory years in coaching that I am aware of is Quincy Henderson. Last I knew he was an assistant at an NAIA school.

[NSU4LIFE]

Re: NSIC Scores, Final Standings and Tournament Brackets (2/18)

I've been involved in a number of hiring committees and seen dozens of coaches come and go at SMSU in the last 20 years. The one thing you learn in time is that a bad hire is realized almost immediately. Like in year 1. A bad hire is much easier to sport that a good hire.

With a good hire, you get a good vibe, but you still need to see how it goes for say 2 years and evaulate.

With a bad hire, you know right away, in year 1, during the season, it isn't going to work out. You see in show in different ways for different coaches but it is there. You can recognize it over time that there is no way it will work .

sometimes you see it in the coaches' lack of committment in recruiting. sometimes you see they dread talking to boosters and fans. sometimes they just can't coach, but you learn to spot a "bust". believe me. i've seen it here at SMSU.

I can remember when we hired Curt Stasheim for football 15 years ago. halfway through season 1 you knew it was a mess, terrible mistake etc. There have been others too. but we all instinctively know this.

That seems nuts...then Coach Meyer would have been a bad hire I guess...

[CoachSalscheider]

Re: NSIC Scores, Final Standings and Tournament Brackets (2/18)

I can't see the coach surviving more than 1 more year. Just my 2 cents

Historically, MnSCU (excuse me, MN State) contracts are 4 years for level 1 head coaches. I presume that is the case unless someone else has updated information. If that is the case, I would presume it unlikely that contract would be broken for not winning enough or whatever Winona's goals and objectives are.

[DapperDan]

Re: NSIC Scores, Final Standings and Tournament Brackets (2/18)

Historically, MnSCU (excuse me, MN State) contracts are 4 years for level 1 head coaches. I presume that is the case unless someone else has updated information. If that is the case, I would presume it unlikely that contract would be broken for not winning enough or whatever Winona's goals and objectives are.

I guess at this level paying an exorbitant buyout for failure is not an option.

[WSUDieHard]

Re: NSIC Scores, Final Standings and Tournament Brackets (2/18)

Malvik and Smith were assistants to Leaf. After the Leaf fiasco Smith got cross-ways with administration and was shown the door. Malvik was interim coach for a time. I don't know what recruits he had lined up before Eisner was hired. I have heard on this board that Sam Baker was his recruit and Eisner wasn't that thrilled with him. He didn't last through the Fall. Hiring a former player wasn't an option as I understand it as the AD required a new coach have head coaching experience. What they really needed to do was entice Brown and Gove to come back but seeing as neither had head coaching experience that wasn't an option even though they had more to do with building the successful program than Leaf did. Sharp move.

I don't see hiring a former player as a particularly smart move. Just because someone is a good player doesn't make them a good coach, especially not having much coaching experience. Malvik was Leaf's assistant for one year. I think Smith may have been a graduate assistant under Leaf for one year. Before that he was helping out at Lewiston High School. Not exactly a stellar resume. The only other former player from the glory years in coaching that I am aware of is Quincy Henderson. Last I knew he was an assistant at an NAIA school.

Quincy is down at...wait for it, West Texas with Brown & Gove...tearing it up after rebuilding a program that was awful. I think they were ranked as high as #12 this year. Former WSU player Dan Kratz, who didn't play much, is also on staff down there. In my eyes, they are never coming back to WSU.