MIAA to expand to 20???

[Boohaha]

Oh. NM. I see it in the article. The lsc has a bunch of schools I didn't know they had and or have never heard of.

LSC has 7 football schools, and essentially has become a Non football conference....I know alot of folks liked the addition of the heartland but without football the interests and direction of the conference will just migrate to other sports....

[Boohaha]

Savannah is the only real one ... D1 from 2000-18. Portland, UNC, UMES, & DU are all D1 and have been that way for almost 30 years. Same for WT, Augusta and LA; Winston was D1 for only 3 years (2007-10). D2 began in '73.

Are you certain about WT, D1 didn't come around till 1973 but they were part of the University Division since 1957 to D1A till 1982. D1AA 82-86.

Or are you saying all but Winston were legit D1 programs?

Only reason reasons having to deal with the WT old heads on the LSC forum talking about their D1 days and wanting to go back.

[the Northeasterner]

Yes but it's always better to have more teams than not enough. See the struggles of gulf south and lsc Honestly it doesn't matter who or doesn't play football when you make division for other sports. It's designed to reduce travel which this break down would . Pitt would be only one that it would be neutral either way.

[Try II]

Are you certain about WT, D1 didn't come around till 1973 but they were part of the University Division since 1957 to D1A till 1982. D1AA 82-86.

Or are you saying all but Winston were legit D1 programs?

Only reason reasons having to deal with the WT old heads on the LSC forum talking about their D1 days and wanting to go back.

No, but legit as in Modern Times (1990-forward). You go back to mid-'80's and that's a different era of everything ... I'm not even sure of D1 football had scholarship limits then. The Portland State's and Denver's that briefly were D2 went back to D1 and the schools like Cal State LA and WT that went to D2 are still D2. Winston and Savannah made the bold choice to go up, only to come back down.

I'm sure WT will go D1 again at some point ... too much ego at that place not too.

[D2Rover]

Yes but it's always better to have more teams than not enough. See the struggles of gulf south and lsc Honestly it doesn't matter who or doesn't play football when you make division for other sports. It's designed to reduce travel which this break down would . Pitt would be only one that it would be neutral either way.

If the teams in the North Division still have to go to Hays and Kearney every year, how do the divisions reduce travel? It adds occasional trips to Fort Smith and Bartlesville that replace what would have been consistent trips to Pitt and Joplin instead. Slightly farther and against teams that the average fan cares less about than an in-state or long-time rival. I get why 10 is a little unstable (although I doubt that the MIAA would actually fail to find a replacement for anybody that leaves), but I don't see any benefit in adding non-football schools beyond 12.

[the Northeasterner]

Rogers state is in Claremore not bartlesville. If you are not traveling say from Maryville to UCO northeastern Rogers and instead you're only traveling to half of those places you're going to save on travel. Hey this is not that far every person's going to have at least one trip that's a little bit more but there is a gap in southern Missouri and Southern Kansas between the schools on the i-70 line and north and the ones that are South with Pittsburgh kind of being the center point. Yes you lose something when you get bigger but you also add stability. This league has lost way too many teams in the last 20 years to not be smart enough to realize that making sure you have enough for a full conference schedule is important. Not only that you add extra markets for your product. Fort Smith is a city of 100,000 people. It is Big Arkansas razorback country but they do support uafs and uafs has a very good facility. uafs is a good addition in your non football sports. Adding Newman helped add some Wichita audience. Now Rogers state I don't know it was as big of an appeal but then they just won a national championship. So I think the other non football schools have t been a mistake just different. But schools aren't lining up to get in here who want to play football and be good at it. I think trading Lincoln for uafs is a good deal. It allows to have one non-conference football game and the other sports its beneficial. I don't think I would try to add OCC unless I got to and went to 16 especially somebody up north but I just don't see that happening when they can do better in the glvc

[D2Rover]

I generally agree that if we're expanding UAFS is a good choice (for reasons you explained well), and an upgrade from Lincoln. If this is the last move for a while, I have no real problem with it. But the stability returns diminish will pretty quickly once the conference already has enough teams to be stable.

[Predatory Primates]

UAFS and the other non football teams don't excite me in a positive or negative way.

I just keep checking here to see if the conference is going to add any football schools .

[Try II]

UAFS and the other non football teams don't excite me in a positive or negative way.

I just keep checking here to see if the conference is going to add any football schools .

The only really good options are Wayne, OK Baptist, Harding, Ark Tech, OBU and then maybe LSC (WT, Angelo) and RMAC schools (Pueblo, Mines). Some combo of that eventually and the footprint will be wide

[psugorilla]

The only really good options are Wayne, OK Baptist, Harding, Ark Tech, OBU and then maybe LSC (WT, Angelo) and RMAC schools (Pueblo, Mines). Some combo of that eventually and the footprint will be wide

I believe I read that OBU was joining the MIAA for some other sport (too lazy to look it up what) So maybe that could be a springboard to jump over to the MIAA? I think they would fit in well in the middle ranks of the conference. Harding would be a good, viable expansion to.

[Predatory Primates]

I believe I read that OBU was joining the MIAA for some other sport (too lazy to look it up what) So maybe that could be a springboard to jump over to the MIAA? I think they would fit in well in the middle ranks of the conference. Harding would be a good, viable expansion to.

Can't have obu without Henderson.

[Inkblot]

Can't have obu without Henderson.

Maybe, but Henderson was in the GSC for 7 years before Ouachita joined.

[the Northeasterner]

Why in the world would any of those schools in Arkansas leave they have the perfect setup there are six schools all about the same size competing in the same events and being successful. Henderson a Ouachita and Harding have absolutely dominated GAC football and made the playoffs. Why would they come to the MIAA to not be successful. You have to really be unhappy where You Are in order to come to a conference where it is just brutal brutal. NSU hated the lone Star the travel was atrocious and they were wanting an extra bunch of money to start a network and apparently UCO felt the same way so we both left. We have to be real honest with ourselves here nobody's going to want to join MIAA football in fact over the last 20 years a whole bunch of people including the eastern half of Missouri haven't left that's why we have this problem. And it isn't an nsu or UCO issueor even A hays or unk issue.

[Predatory Primates]

Why in the world would any of those schools in Arkansas leave they have the perfect setup there are six schools all about the same size competing in the same events and being successful. Henderson a Ouachita and Harding have absolutely dominated GAC football and made the playoffs. Why would they come to the MIAA to not be successful. You have to really be unhappy where You Are in order to come to a conference where it is just brutal brutal. NSU hated the lone Star the travel was atrocious and they were wanting an extra bunch of money to start a network and apparently UCO felt the same way so we both left. We have to be real honest with ourselves here nobody's going to want to join MIAA football in fact over the last 20 years a whole bunch of people including the eastern half of Missouri haven't left that's why we have this problem. And it isn't an nsu or UCO issueor even A hays or unk issue.

IDK if this is the case,, but teams sometimes leave because the new conf. offers other sports that the current one doesn't. Ca

Also don't underestimate the value of status to university administrators. From what I've seen, they're a prideful bunch willing to get in over their heads for status. IDK if the MIAA offers a big enough status boost to make a move, though.

[UCObluejay]

IDK if this is the case,, but teams sometimes leave because the new conf. offers other sports that the current one doesn't. Ca

Also don't underestimate the value of status to university administrators. From what I've seen, they're a prideful bunch willing to get in over their heads for status. IDK if the MIAA offers a big enough status boost to make a move, though.

This ^^ One of the reasons that higher ed is in the state it is in is the keeping up with the Jones' mentality. X school has this, we need it too. Let's be honest though. Many students choose the name-brand state school because they think they will have a better chance to get higher-paying employment from those schools, accurate or not. Sure some of that institutional status seeking is (using a professional wrestling analogy) "talking them into the building." This is a bigger problem than athletics (although especiallly at the P5 level is where it is the most obvious.)

Can we honestly say that this posturing increases the value of education or the college experience? The students today pay far more than students 10, 20, 40 years ago. Even with inflationary and cost-of-living adjustments it is so much more difficult for students to graduate without student loans even while working. Yes, the cost of providing an education, maintaining buildings and grounds, updating facilities to code, buying access to databases, and making sure the campus is wired for high speed internet access have risen, However, it is not to the extent tuition has. Meanwhile, university bureaucrats create a new under VP for toothpick selection, another seemingly redundant office because the University of Our Neighboring State-Main Branch has one. Not to mention building more facilities despite declining enrollments. Someone needs to fit the bill, either now or after bond issues. Rubbing shoulders and the chess game of posturing "to grow the universities" stature also plays a role.

I find myself talking out of both sides of my mind because I also don't necessarily want UCO in the GAC so... (I honestly didn't know how small NWOSU was until I looked it up. I assumed they were the same size as SOSU, SWOSU, ECU... nope.) Why are so many on this board against teams that "can't compete?"

Why does the Sun Belt and C-USA have the same footprint, yet the teams move between conferences? Why are so many teams moving up to Division I when they shouldn't? There are a few small schools in D-II that should probably be D-III. Why is there conference realignment at the D-III level? Southwestern (TX) and Trinity (TX) are leaving the Texas based SCAC to the SAA which is based in the SEC region with no other teams in Texas or even Louisiana? Status. Status. Status. Many colleges will close in the upcoming decades, and academia will blame everyone else.