West Chester - walk ons?

[Horror Child]

West Chester has given out similar money to football players than the top West schools. The West schools call the money 'athletic scholarships'. West Chester hasn't put the money in that fund, but rather other area's.

In simplest terms ... if a 'full ride' is worth $20,000/year ... whether the player is getting $8,000/year under an 'athletic scholarship' or $8,000/year under a different category ... he's still getting $8,000/year.

That $8,000 isn't showing up in the scholarship dollars report ... thus making it appear WCU has built this highly competitive program on less 'athletic scholarships' than Clarion. So, call it creative accounting, or, whatever else.

Long ago the reports on scholarship numbers would come out and WCU would always be near the bottom despite having loaded rosters, etc. Hence the joke became they do really well with all those 'walk-ons'.

Fightingscot82 can explain the money division a bit better, but, that is the gist of the story and how the nickname came about.

Wouldn't that be the same situation at all of the PSAC schools then?

And no one has been able to provide a potential incentive for WCU to allegedly not accurately declaring their football scholarships.

[Horror Child]

I don't know why its this way, but...

Schools in the PSAC West have historically used real fundraised scholarship dollars to recruit students; schools in the PSAC East have historically used university fee waivers to recruit students. Since the fee waivers are available to all students and not restricted to just athletes, it doesn't count as athletic aid. So for example, if West Chester uses Aramark for food service and Aramark's contract says they'll donate 50 free meal plan waivers a year, West Chester may give Zwaan 20 meal plan waivers to offer students. While it has a real monetary value, its technically not a scholarship and technically doesn't count as athletic aid. Really the only fees getting waived are housing or meal plans. Its possible that a third party bookstore operator is providing a textbook allowance (Barnes & Noble would provide $50,000 a year for athlete books at RMU when I worked there).

Now that room & board is just as much if not more than tuition, those waivers go a long way. The benefit for real scholarship dollars is that when the athletes move off campus, those extra funds can be refunded to the student to help pay for an apartment or living costs.

Like in the west, where enrollment numbers are dwindling and they have empty dorm rooms, or even entire dorms, available, they issue those rooms to athletes and get those student athletes to pay full boat tuition, thus the claim that athletes boost enrollment and tuition revenue. Last I read, West Chester was at capacity for residence halls and don't have rooms for athletes, free or otherwise.

[ironmaniup]

Wouldn't that be the same situation at all of the PSAC schools then?

And no one has been able to provide a potential incentive for WCU to allegedly not accurately declaring their football scholarships.

The incentive might be on things like title ix, to equalize scholarships. Does WCU have the same low scholly count in the other sports ? The other incentive is to funnel money to the football team from the state or other sources, instead of fund raising specifically for sports. Of course this is just a guess, and it might be WCU is so nice and close to home for these players that they pay their own way, and the football perks are enough.

[Fightingscot82]

Like in the west, where enrollment numbers are dwindling and they have empty dorm rooms, or even entire dorms, available, they issue those rooms to athletes and get those student athletes to pay full boat tuition, thus the claim that athletes boost enrollment and tuition revenue. Last I read, West Chester was at capacity for residence halls and don't have rooms for athletes, free or otherwise.

Waivers aside, tuition scholarships are real dollars so all it does is change who covers that much of the student's bill. But the waivers are more like private school discounting so that paper "loss" is already budgeted for.

[IUPNation]

Like in the west, where enrollment numbers are dwindling and they have empty dorm rooms, or even entire dorms, available, they issue those rooms to athletes and get those student athletes to pay full boat tuition, thus the claim that athletes boost enrollment and tuition revenue. Last I read, West Chester was at capacity for residence halls and don't have rooms for athletes, free or otherwise.

[IUPNation]

Waivers aside, tuition scholarships are real dollars so all it does is change who covers that much of the student's bill. But the waivers are more like private school discounting so that paper "loss" is already budgeted for.

So basically Free Food U is being shady and having the taxpayers fund their players while the West is actually fundraising.

IUP needs to the ante..give out scholarships and have athletic housing where the fees are waived.

[Fightingscot82]

So basically Free Food U is being shady and having the taxpayers fund their players while the West is actually fundraising.

IUP needs to the ante..give out scholarships and have athletic housing where the fees are waived.

No they're having Aramark or Sodexho or whomever does their food service subsidize athletics. Edinboro, Clarion, Cal and Slippery Rock are all on the same food service contract with Aramark and all they got was a lousy free catering event for students. There may be some meal plan waivers in there but not for athletes.

[IUPbigINDIANS]

So basically Free Food U is being shady and having the taxpayers fund their players while the West is actually fundraising.

IUP needs to the ante..give out scholarships and have athletic housing where the fees are waived.

Well, with the way President Titanic has seen his enrollment go from 15,500 (his arrival) to (current) 7,900 ... he can just turn one of those fancy (empty / closed) 'dorms' in to a football house.

[Fightingscot82]

Well, with the way President Titanic has seen his enrollment go from 15,500 (his arrival) to (current) 7,900 ... he can just turn one of those fancy (empty / closed) 'dorms' in to a football house.

Yikes, Slimey is now 1,000 students larger than IUP.

[TheBigCat2192]

Well, with the way President Titanic has seen his enrollment go from 15,500 (his arrival) to (current) 7,900 ... he can just turn one of those fancy (empty / closed) 'dorms' in to a football house.

[IUPNation]

Well, with the way President Titanic has seen his enrollment go from 15,500 (his arrival) to (current) 7,900 ... he can just turn one of those fancy (empty / closed) 'dorms' in to a football house.

[Horror Child]

The incentive might be on things like title ix, to equalize scholarships. Does WCU have the same low scholly count in the other sports ?

Yes, except for swimming since they run camps and competitions all year long.

The other incentive is to funnel money to the football team from the state or other sources, instead of fund raising specifically for sports. Of course this is just a guess, and it might be WCU is so nice and close to home for these players that they pay their own way, and the football perks are enough.

Correct.

The academic year that West Chester first won the national championship in baseball - 2011-2012, they offered grant-in-aid equivalencies, which would account for the "waivers" discussion, of 8.60 for all men's sports other than football and basketball, with most of that going to swimming, but also a smattering to soccer, golf and tennis.

Also, if WCU was indeed performing creative accounting as so many on here allege, why has the PSAC or the NCAA not done something about it by now?

[iupgroundhog]

Yikes, Slimey is now 1,000 students larger than IUP.

I thought IUP was at 8900.

[Fightingscot82]

I thought IUP was at 8900.

Yeah I was responding to when someone said IUP was at 7,900. But SRU is at 8850 - closing in.

[IUPNation]

Yeah I was responding to when someone said IUP was at 7,900. But SRU is at 8850 - closing in.

Is there a need for 8850 gym teachers?

:-)