Portal Movement in the NSIC

[Brandon]

Sorted....

01. California - 6,742,400
02. Texas - 5,669,000
03. Florida - 3,032,800
04. New York - 2,652,600
05. Illinois - 2,053,000
06. Georgia - 1,809,700
07. Pennsylvania - 1,772,200
08. North Carolina - 1,672,300
09. Ohio - 1,664,100
10. Michigan - 1,473,300
11. Virginia - 1,370,300
12. New Jersey - 1,297,200
13. Arizona - 1,295,500
14. Washington - 1,177,400
15. Tennessee - 1,081,100
16. Indiana - 1,009,500
17. Maryland - 969,000
18. Colorado - 954,000
19. Minnesota - 937,700
20. Missouri - 930,000
21. Massachusetts - 926,100
22. Wisconsin - 886,900
23. South Carolina - 770,600
24. Alabama - 712,800
25. Utah - 704,600
26. Oklahoma - 690,300
27. Louisiana - 686,300
28. Kentucky - 668,500
29. Oregon - 626,600
30. Nevada - 534,700
31. Connecticut - 533,500
32. Iowa - 501,500
33. Kansas - 499,300
34. Arkansas - 488,600
35. Mississippi - 458,600
36. New Mexico - 339,600
37. Nebraska - 316,400
38. Idaho - 314,000
39. West Virginia - 253,100
40. Maine - 187,200
41. New Hampshire - 186,400
42. Hawaii - 178,000
43. Alaska - 155,200
44. Montana - 146,800
45. Rhode Island - 144,700
46. Delaware - 140,100
47. South Dakota - 135,900
48. North Dakota - 107,800
49. District of Columbia - 69,600
50. Vermont - 91,200
51. Wyoming - 94,900

[Brandon]

All of these info-heavy posts continue to drive home the fact that ND doesn’t have enough D2 level football talent to field 3 teams with local guys.

What does "D2 level" mean to you?

I was curious on the number of football players in each state. I couldn't find the answers. The best thing I could find is number total students enrolled in public schools in every state for fall of 2023.

Alabama - 712,800
Alaska - 155,200
Arizona - 1,295,500
Arkansas - 488,600
California - 6,742,400
Colorado - 954,000
Connecticut - 533,500
Delaware - 140,100
District of Columbia - 69,600
Florida - 3,032,800
Georgia - 1,809,700
Hawaii - 178,000
Idaho - 314,000
Illinois - 2,053,000
Indiana - 1,009,500
Iowa - 501,500
Kansas - 499,300
Kentucky - 668,500
Louisiana - 686,300
Maine - 187,200
Maryland - 969,000
Massachusetts - 926,100
Michigan - 1,473,300
Minnesota - 937,700
Mississippi - 458,600
Missouri - 930,000
Montana - 146,800
Nebraska - 316,400
Nevada - 534,700
New Hampshire - 186,400
New Jersey - 1,297,200
New Mexico - 339,600
New York - 2,652,600
North Carolina - 1,672,300
North Dakota - 107,800
Ohio - 1,664,100
Oklahoma - 690,300
Oregon - 626,600
Pennsylvania - 1,772,200
Rhode Island - 144,700
South Carolina - 770,600
South Dakota - 135,900
Tennessee - 1,081,100
Texas - 5,669,000
Utah - 704,600
Vermont - 91,200
Virginia - 1,370,300
Washington - 1,177,400
West Virginia - 253,100
Wisconsin - 886,900
Wyoming - 94,900

[SW_Mustang]

7-on-7 not 7-man. The six skill players and a center versus a defense with no front.

Gotcha. I thought 7-man was a little odd, but like I said I know 3 schools beyond MN/SD.

Sounds interesting though.

[Brandon]

Link is broken.

Didn't realize 7-man was a thing. I'm a bit skeptical that it has a greater impact than the larger schools, but maybe it does. About the only schools I know outside of MN is IMG, Bishop O'Gorman, and Mater Dei.

7-on-7 not 7-man. The six skill players and a center versus a defense with no front.

[SW_Mustang]

At least in the South, 7 on 7 is the main recruiting tool. http://www.miamiherald.com/2013/04/0...-football.html

Link is broken.

Didn't realize 7-man was a thing. I'm a bit skeptical that it has a greater impact than the larger schools, but maybe it does. About the only schools I know outside of MN is IMG, Bishop O'Gorman, and Mater Dei.

[debergfan]

I don't pay much attention to anything under Class AAAA in MN. Are colleges really recruiting kids from non-MHS high schools in the area?

I mean, I'm sure there are some - especially from Pipestone, but I never hear of any. SMSU lands a guy from my HS about once every 3 years and he usually leaves the roster after a season on scout team.

Genuine question to any SWMNers on the board.

At least in the South, 7 on 7 is the main recruiting tool. http://www.miamiherald.com/2013/04/0...-football.html

[Purple Mav Man]

All of these info-heavy posts continue to drive home the fact that ND doesn’t have enough D2 level football talent to field 3 teams with local guys. Meaning they have to go outside the region in order to fill their rosters. Which, as history has shown, leads to transient rosters and very little success. It’s also a money/resource burn.

There are many factors why the vast majority of rosters are area players. One of the main ones being cost. It’s great that Minot has an airport. Do they have a bottomless budget to fly coaches and recruits all over the country? If so, they’ve been severely mismanaging their cash thus far.

The Midwest as a whole has a ton of high quality FCS and D2 level football talent. But it also has a lot of competition for that talent. And in a state like North Dakota, with two successful FCS programs, they are going to suck the local talent in like a vacuum. Including many of those diamonds in the rough. Almost all would rather walk on at the big D1 school than the unknown D2 school.

Building and sustaining a program is difficult. And it’s even more difficult at some schools/locations, where access to quality talent is minimal.

[WBChargerDad]

I am familiar with ND and SD. I'm also familiar with D2. I do know that northern teams that try to build a winning roster with players from warm weather locations fail around 100% of the time. It's not a way to win.

Augustana's Roster:
31 - South Dakota
17 - Minnesota
13 - Wisconsin
12- Nebraska
12- Iowa
6 - Arizona
5 - Illinois
5 - Texas
4 - Colorado
3 - California
3 - Nevada
2 - Washington
1- Maryland
1- Indiana
1- Missouri

The core of Augustana is local.

Bemidji State's Roster:

51 - Minnesota
21 - Wisconsin
13 - Illinois
10 - Iowa
2 - North Dakota
2 - Arizona
2 - Washington
1 - Nebraska

The core of Bemidji is local.

Minnesota State's Roster:

32 - Minnesota
15 - Iowa
15 - Illinois
15 - Wisconsin
4 - California
4 - South Dakota
4 - Nebraska
2 - Georgia
2 - Texas
1 - Indiana
1 - Missouri
1 - Oklahoma
1 - Florida
1 - Idaho
1 - Mississippi
1 - Kentucky

The core of MSU's roster is local.

These are the three best teams in the NSIC.

I think you have it absolutely inverted. The marquee players may come from outside the region, but the core of the team has to come from the region.

The flight considerations may help land a good quarterback from California, but it doesn't help form core of a winning program.

I will take a look at the last sentence in your post in a different reply.

Extending your roster counts to teams that have been at or near the top of the NSIC recently, and to further emphasis that the successful teams in the NSIC by and large get the core of their roster regionally. You look at Northern State and SMSU, they are similar, though Northern a little more spread out, CSP mostly MN/WI. Mary and Minot are really the glaring exceptions in the conference of teams that don't get their talent regionaly, and they are in spots where recruiting regionally is challenging. There isn't as much talent regionally, and their response has been to go south. Mary has 17 ND players, 13 MN players, 3 SD players and 1 WI player on their roster. Minot has 5 ND players, 8 MN players, 3 SD players, and no WI players. I think they need to go east rather than south, but there is a lot of competition from MN schools as you go east so that isn't so easy either.

Minnesota-Duluth

44 - Minnesota
33 - Wisconsin
10 - Nevada
5 - Illinois
3 - California
1 - Alaska
1 - Indiana
1 - Florida
1 - Michigan

Moorhead

59 - Minnesota
26 - North Dakota
12 - Wisconsin
4 - South Dakota
2 - Iowa
2 - Nebraska
1 - Florida
1 - Nevada
1 - Illinois

Winona

45 - Minnesota
43 - Wisconsin
15 - Illinois
8 - Iowa
3 - Texas
1 - Georgia

Wayne State

66 - Nebraska
11 - Iowa
8 - California
7 - South Dakota
6 - Lousiana
5 - Florida
2 - Illinois
2 - Nevada
2 - Texas

Sioux Falls

14 - Wisconsin
13 - Iowa
10 - South Dakota
6 - Nebraska
6 - Arizona
6 - Illinois
3 - California
2 - Colorado
1 - Alabama
1 - Wyoming

[debergfan]

Where did you hear that? PM me if it needs to be private.

Nothing to hide and WF is following the rules. Simple math. I'm guessing based on their tuition rates. https://uwf.edu/admissions/undergrad...ial-aid/costs/

36 scholarships limit

FL - 6360+5888=12248
Non-FL - 19260+5888=25148

If they offered housing plus tuition that .48 per Florida kid, 75 full ride kids. Doesn't include grad students

Ferris St https://www.ferris.edu/administratio...tion-rates.htm
Undergraduate Tuition - Freshman/Sophomore
U.S. RESIDENTS AND CANADIANS
$13,524 per year
($483 per credit hour)

INTERNATIONAL
$22,400 per yearI
($800 per credit hour)

Undergraduate Tuition - Junior/Senior
U.S. RESIDENTS AND CANADIANS
$14,728 per year
($526 per credit hour)

INTERNATIONAL
$23,800 per year
($850 per credit hour)

Ferris has 43 Jrs/SRs, 110 underclassmen

If US/Can kid costs .60 and 36 scholarship limit, you can get 60 full tuition scholarships out of their football team. A lot of assumptions, 94 don't have any money, housing, academic aid, etc.

[SW_Mustang]

I don't know the Minnesota classification system. I was referring to the geography.

Great players come from small schools, too.

Right - we had that discussion in the thread already. There are definitely diamonds in the rough out there, but with limited time/resources, the consistency is going to come from the bigger schools with better resources and competition.

That's what makes guys like Trey Lance and Koi Perich so interesting is that they came from the bottom half of the HS football ladder where a lot of talent isn't to be found.

[NSU4LIFE]

I don't know the Minnesota classification system. I was referring to the geography.

Great players come from small schools, too.

Unless you live in metropolis cities on the east or west cost of the US, you are in nomads land and worthless, so better find folks that don't know any of us exist or you will never be successful

[Brandon]

West Florida allegedly had a whole team of full scholarships.

Where did you hear that? PM me if it needs to be private.

[Brandon]

Point, I'm making the schools with the flexible tuition rates, the teams have been most successful. Schools with flat tuition rates Mary, Minot have not been. If you want to win at D2, you need different tuition rates. West Florida allegedly had a whole team of full scholarships.

Harding - https://www.harding.edu/administrative/finaid/coa
Harding does not have flat tuition rates.

Nova SE - look at their cost rates https://undergrad.nova.edu/funding/tuition-fees.html

Mary and Minot charge the same for out of state/in state kids?

Or are you suggesting that schools base the tuition rates on the major as it seems that Harding is doing?

[debergfan]

Private schools have flat tuition rates.

Otherwise, it varies per school.

I guess I don't understand the point you're trying to make.

Point, I'm making the schools with the flexible tuition rates, the teams have been most successful. Schools with flat tuition rates Mary, Minot have not been. If you want to win at D2, you need different tuition rates. West Florida allegedly had a whole team of full scholarships.

Harding - https://www.harding.edu/administrative/finaid/coa
Harding does not have flat tuition rates.

Nova SE - look at their cost rates https://undergrad.nova.edu/funding/tuition-fees.html

[Brandon]

I don't pay much attention to anything under Class AAAA in MN. Are colleges really recruiting kids from non-MHS high schools in the area?

I mean, I'm sure there are some - especially from Pipestone, but I never hear of any. SMSU lands a guy from my HS about once every 3 years and he usually leaves the roster after a season on scout team.

Genuine question to any SWMNers on the board.

I don't know the Minnesota classification system. I was referring to the geography.

Great players come from small schools, too.