PSAC Women's Basketball (18-19)

[IUP24]

Add to that IUP had gone cold around that time and missed a couple open looks.

I agree about WBB being the best chance for a Nationals Championship in a marquee sport. For whatever reasons, the environment at IUP suits women's sports better -not fans, but the university and support systems. THink about the difference in how Appleby ended her career vs how Lenny Williams ended his. Of course there is always the success of the mens golf team.

[ironmaniup]

Re: PSAC Women's Basketball (18-19)

yes, but why ? Why can't tort out recruit Shepard or Rock. Why can't Joe Out recruit WLU or Hurst, to the same degree Tom Does. why do the male athletes have problems instead of thrive in the environment at IUP. I think it is because IUP is good for the female athletes, he can convince more to come here and they are happier after they get here. Or is he just a much better salesmen and judge of athletes than the other two.

[IUP24]

yes, but why ? Why can't tort out recruit Shepard or Rock. Why can't Joe Out recruit WLU or Hurst, to the same degree Tom Does. why do the male athletes have problems instead of thrive in the environment at IUP. I think it is because IUP is good for the female athletes, he can convince more to come here and they are happier after they get here. Or is he just a much better salesmen and judge of athletes than the other two.

[IUP24]

yes, but why ? Why can't tort out recruit Shepard or Rock. Why can't Joe Out recruit WLU or Hurst, to the same degree Tom Does. why do the male athletes have problems instead of thrive in the environment at IUP. I think it is because IUP is good for the female athletes, he can convince more to come here and they are happier after they get here. Or is he just a much better salesmen and judge of athletes than the other two.

[IUPbigINDIANS]

Re: PSAC Women's Basketball (18-19)

Joe will be a different coach post-Dante.

I'm not going to get in to they 'why' but he just will be. Dante Year 4 was very good. The first 3 years he was mainly good but was given a very long leash. More than others would have got? Being honest, certainly. Did it contribute to them missing two of those tournaments? Likely.

Joe has had depth issues. He likes the full ride approach with 9 guys. Typically one of them is redshirted.

Others are using more of the couple full rides and lots of half rides, etc. It's why ESU has like 12 solid guys and Joe always has 8 studs and a bench from Homer City. One injury and he has major problems.

That's just one item.

We also forget what this team would have been with Dom Keyes. His legal issue wasn't Joe's fault. This was a soft rebounding team for much of the season. Once he started playing Chucky more it improved. Keyes' specialty was everything they lacked inside -- legit muscle, shot blocking and fierce rebounding.

Mercyhurst was the one team I didn't want them to play in the NCAA. Joe would have been very hard for new teams to play. Mercyhurst knew them too well.

Going on two weeks it's still a tough pill to swallow. That 30-3 will always look fancy on the books. The ending is just still hard to take.

[Fightingscot82]

Re: PSAC Women's Basketball (18-19)

Any update on the Mercyhurst search?

[IUP Extra Mile]

Re: PSAC Women's Basketball (18-19)

If you recruit better people, that are talented of course, they have a better chance of thriving. As a team. Together.


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It's a gender stereotype, but I think the numbers would back it up...Women are LESS likely to be academic casualties and get in trouble with the law than men, EVERYWHERE, not just IUP...

[ironmaniup]

Re: PSAC Women's Basketball (18-19)

It's a gender stereotype, but I think the numbers would back it up...Women are LESS likely to be academic casualties and get in trouble with the law than men, EVERYWHERE, not just IUP...

Its not just that though, the PSAC seems to get higher level female athletes all around, the PSAC competes for and wins National Championships in a lot of different sports. When was the last mens National champion in the PSAC - other than things like Golf or tennis.

The higher quality male athletes probably go to place like the patriot league, or the CAA. The psac doesn't hav ewhat they want. But the women are perfectly happy to go here.

Male team National Champions Cheyney in 1978 BB, and WCU in Baseball 2012 and 2017 - there were also some Soccer Champs in the 60s and 70s.

Women has Cal in WBB, Field Hockey for the last 10 or so years, WCU laCrosse in 2008, Softball 2006 and 2009. Sure maybe football plays a part in hording the best male athletes, but the difference in competitiveness nationally is pretty stark.

[IUPbigINDIANS]

Re: PSAC Women's Basketball (18-19)

Its not just that though, the PSAC seems to get higher level female athletes all around, the PSAC competes for and wins National Championships in a lot of different sports. When was the last mens National champion in the PSAC - other than things like Golf or tennis.

The higher quality male athletes probably go to place like the patriot league, or the CAA. The psac doesn't hav ewhat they want. But the women are perfectly happy to go here.

I'm not following that in regard to IUP's men's basketball program. Joe has a big budget and doesn't need to recruit locals. Most of IUP's best players in the Joe era came from far-away lands -- Norfleet, Daddy, Cobo, Glover, etc.

There was just some key misses in the past five years. They didn't want Sleva despite him wanting to come here. A couple of the D1 transfers didn't perform up to their hype (Danielak and Hutton). Willem was mostly good but he never reached what I believe was his full potential. They chose to redshirt Keyes two years ago when they desperately needed him.

So, I don't buy in to the notion they can't win a title here. Literally everything is in place. Facilities. Campus. Money. Tradition. Everything.

I do think they need to get out of this fixation of a small rotation. I personally don't think they handled the stretch run real well despite winning so many of the games. The starting lineup needed changed. It was routinely putting them into a hole night after night. It did again in the fatal last game -- and they finally couldn't pull out of it. That's on Joe. We all saw it needed changed. Not sure how he didn't.

Hard to say what is up next. The West will be very strong next year. Edinboro and Cal will be dramatically better. UPJ is loaded. SRU has a lot back. Mercyhurst just reloads every year. Even the drama show in the Hammermill should be much better.

We know Joe has three signed already. These last 2-3, right now, are probably his most important in a long time. If he nails them, they will be very strong. If he misses on them, they could be a 18-12 type team. The right pieces are out there. One big. One guard. And, see what else you find for the third one. Next year will bring a lot of change to the program. Change is good, sometimes.

[IUPbigINDIANS]

Re: PSAC Women's Basketball (18-19)

It's a gender stereotype, but I think the numbers would back it up...Women are LESS likely to be academic casualties and get in trouble with the law than men, EVERYWHERE, not just IUP...

You guys are forgetting a key item here.

Why don't you check on Tom's budget compared to 80 percent of the Atlantic Region. That will help to explain a lot.

Anybody know how many women's teams in the Atlantic spend on par with IUP? Hint: Not very many.

Offering full rides to a school with IUP's facilities and history ... when mostly everybody else is offering partials and peanuts ... I'd call that a slight advantage.

[ironmaniup]

Re: PSAC Women's Basketball (18-19)

We know Joe has three signed already. These last 2-3, right now, are probably his most important in a long time. If he nails them, they will be very strong. If he misses on them, they could be a 18-12 type team. The right pieces are out there. One big. One guard. And, see what else you find for the third one. Next year will bring a lot of change to the program. Change is good, sometimes.

If . . . . he gets transfers that pan out. That's my point, if IUP was a more attractive place for the men, the transfers would always be of higher quality - they would almost always pan out. They wouldn't have to take someone with issues. There is enough money for both the men and women's team, but the women get athletes that are more at a nationally competitive level, and they develop more of these athletes here. That's true in women's sports all around the PSAC

[IUPbigINDIANS]

Re: PSAC Women's Basketball (18-19)

If . . . . he gets transfers that pan out. That's my point, if IUP was a more attractive place for the men, the transfers would always be of higher quality - they would almost always pan out. They wouldn't have to take someone with issues. There is enough money for both the men and women's team, but the women get athletes that are more at a nationally competitive level, and they develop more of these athletes here. That's true in women's sports all around the PSAC

No way. Transfers never 'always pan out' ... it's a dangerous game.

Who was the last transfer Joe took with issues? Danielak was a 4.0 student. Their issues have been a lack of talent -- not character.

Going back the past several transfers (with letter grades):

Willem - C
Hutton - D
Danielak - C/D
Marko - C/D
Tevin Hanner - B
Brandon Spain - B
Shawn Dyer - A
Norfleet - A
Glover Jr. - A
Daddy - A
Jeffers - B
Keyes - F so far
Chucky - He'll be a star next year
Ulrich - We'll see


He was on a great run of transfers there for several years (Dyer, Glover, Daddy, Norfleet, Spain, Hanner).

The past two years' worth, however, just weren't that good of players (Danielak, Hutton, Willem, Marko). Or, they just weren't used right. That's up for debate.

But, not a one on that list was at all a character issue off the court.

Let's not forget we also lost that kid from Eckerd in August of this past year.

[CALUPA69]

Re: PSAC Women's Basketball (18-19)

Its not just that though, the PSAC seems to get higher level female athletes all around, the PSAC competes for and wins National Championships in a lot of different sports. When was the last mens National champion in the PSAC - other than things like Golf or tennis.

The higher quality male athletes probably go to place like the patriot league, or the CAA. The psac doesn't hav ewhat they want. But the women are perfectly happy to go here.

Male team National Champions Cheyney in 1978 BB, and WCU in Baseball 2012 and 2017 - there were also some Soccer Champs in the 60s and 70s.

Women has Cal in WBB, Field Hockey for the last 10 or so years, WCU laCrosse in 2008, Softball 2006 and 2009. Sure maybe football plays a part in hording the best male athletes, but the difference in competitiveness nationally is pretty stark.

CAL WBB 2, SB 2 / WCU BSBL 2, WLX/ LHU SB 2, M SOC/ CLAR W SWMG 2/ BORO MCC 4/ UPJ WRES 2.
I'm sorry but with only 26 teams in D2 FH the best you should get is the Northeast Championship. All but 3 of the the 26 are in PA, NY and NE. It strikes me that you should have at least 50 teams to call someone a National Champion.

[Golden89]

Re: PSAC Women's Basketball (18-19)

Seven of the last 11 Atlantic Region champs hail from the PSAC West Cal (2), Gannon (2), IUP (2), Edinboro. Pretty impressive conference. Cal and IUP are best positioned for future success. Edinboro has a shot to unseat them; Gannon is a shell of their former selves.

For the record, the other four are from the CIAA (VUU and Shaw 2 each)

The PSAC East and the WVIAC/MEC haven't won the region in at least 11 years.

[IUPbigINDIANS]

Re: PSAC Women's Basketball (18-19)

Any update on the Mercyhurst search?

The former Edinboro coach, Stan Swank, is being mentioned from what I hear.