Originally posted by WarriorVoice
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Originally posted by boatcapt View Post
So let's make you president, what would you do? Remember, what you do has to be constitutional and in accordance with the law. Can't just say, I'd order everyone to wear a mask without sighting what legal authority you had to issue that order and how you would legally enforce such an order. Going to give trillions to research? OK, were is that $ going to come from? What about protestors that are not wearing face masks and practicing social distancing? You going to arrest them?
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Originally posted by Turbonium View Post
Wait, the president needs to do things in accordance with the law? Has anyone told him this?
Soooo...are you advocating that the President send in the military to arrest people who are not wearing masks, possibly including protestors, and then deal with the courts after the fact?
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Originally posted by boatcapt View Post
Sure does. And if he violates the law, the courts say so.
Soooo...are you advocating that the President send in the military to arrest people who are not wearing masks, possibly including protestors, and then deal with the courts after the fact?
Am I advocating that? No. We are months too late for effective leadership from the top down to do anything. However, protestors are already being arrested by federal agents in unmarked vans so what's the difference?
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Originally posted by Turbonium View Post
Lol, sure they do...on paper. That's not reality.
Am I advocating that? No. We are months too late for effective leadership from the top down to do anything. However, protestors are already being arrested by federal agents in unmarked vans so what's the difference?
Weird how that works.
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Originally posted by Turbonium View Post
Lol, sure they do...on paper. That's not reality.
Am I advocating that? No. We are months too late for effective leadership from the top down to do anything. However, protestors are already being arrested by federal agents in unmarked vans so what's the difference?
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Originally posted by boatcapt View Post
Yea...Those protests in Portland sure seem peaceful. Is firebomb a building really peaceful???
Where the problem is in the United States (and now across the world), is the view of the protesters is not always being accurately portrayed. The media, which has long sought out being the news story, rather than reporting the news as it happens, only shows the most negative aspects of the protests. They show the rioters throwing firebombs into buildings by a few select individuals who should (in my opinion), be charged to the fullest extent of the law. They don't show the thousands of people simply standing on the side of the street chanting and holding signs. That would disrupt the media's goal of creating the news rather than reporting what is happening.
I personally have experience with a protest and being lumped in with the "no good group." During my junior year of high school, the school board was attempting to cut costs. Among the options was privatizing the custodial, bus service and food service staff within the district. The companies who were going to be contracted to do the work had made it clear that the pay would be $X, which was about 50% less than what the staff was making working for the district. Many of the people the students had grown up working with (custodians, lunch ladies, bus drivers) would be forced to stop working for the school system. These were the people the students knew, and the staff had come to rely on for years and years. As a result, the students in the high school (junior class, the seniors already checked out mentally by this point, granted most were never there to being with, they were not the brightest class), organized a walkout to protest the decision. News of the walkout at the high school spread to the middle school. At the appointed time, the students who were participating (roughly 50% of the high school students), walked out and protested in the parking lot. Our middle school was across the parking lot and the schools were in a residential area. During the protest, a couple middle school students decided it would be fun to sneak away and break into garages of homes in the area. They did about $10,000 dollars worth of damage to a home and the owners property in the process. The home owner attempted to sue each and every person who was involved in the protest (not just the kids who did the damage) plus the school district. Thankfully it never got to the point we had to go to court, but a few "protesters" ruined the reputation of the rest of us. We did however get the result we were looking for, temporarily. The district did not privatize at that time. Two years latter they did, but the contracts included an agreement that existing employees would be paid something like 85% of their previous pay. New employees would be hired at a lower wage. As a result many of those employees took the smaller pay cut and remained with the district. Some still work in the districts buildings more then 25 years after we graduated.
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Originally posted by SW_Mustang View Post
Protestors from those protests were arrested.
The folks protesting their constitutional right to haircut? Not so much.
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Originally posted by boatcapt View Post
Are you saying the protestors being arrested are not breaking the law or are you saying they should be immune from arrest for breaking the law? Why does it matter if the van is unmarked? Are you saying that federal agents can only arrest people if they are riding in marked vans?
"I am not interested in what you believe. I am interested in what you THINK!" IMHO, it is an unfortunate result of the world of tweets.
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Originally posted by boatcapt View Post
Are you saying the protestors being arrested are not breaking the law or are you saying they should be immune from arrest for breaking the law? Why does it matter if the van is unmarked? Are you saying that federal agents can only arrest people if they are riding in marked vans?
***Before anyone else jumps in here, I also had issues with several of Obama's policies at the time he was president. I feel like this is now a disclaimer that must be made before one is dismissed as being left or right. I'm neither.***
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Originally posted by Wildcat Khan View Post
And Oregon is upset about arresting the rioters. It is known here that there are 'professional rioters' that will travel through the Pacific Northwest and mix in with peaceful protests. A less controversial example is the WTO riots in the 90's where a lot of rioters had come up from Oregon and destroyed the message of many a peaceful protest. Local news interviewed those protesters and they were upset with the rioters and before the rioters showed up they were actually working with the police having gotten a legal permit who would keep traffic from going into the protest area.
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Originally posted by Wildcat Khan View Post
And Oregon is upset about arresting the rioters. It is known here that there are 'professional rioters' that will travel through the Pacific Northwest and mix in with peaceful protests. A less controversial example is the WTO riots in the 90's where a lot of rioters had come up from Oregon and destroyed the message of many a peaceful protest. Local news interviewed those protesters and they were upset with the rioters and before the rioters showed up they were actually working with the police having gotten a legal permit who would keep traffic from going into the protest area.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/institu.../#23856a6e600e
We believed the same thing in Minnesota. We're "too nice" to burn our own city. Even the Governor echoed the same sentiments on TV. I maintained the opposite - we are a very violent state with a very dark history, and we absolutely have the capability for that kind of destruction and believing otherwise was ludicrous. The morning after the Governor's comments, MPD/SPPD released the arrest records - and I really enjoyed hearing the Governor back track on his previous statements.
Oregon is a completely different place, so maybe "professional rioters" exist - but given the infrequency of the event, I doubt they are "professional" in the same sense a baseball player is. My guess is if anything like that does exist, they are just a bunch of college kids and criminals looking to break things. Simple as that. "Agent Provocateurs" are far more interesting and probable - but people don't like discussing the idea that police departments were the source of the damage. It kinda hurts their narratives.
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