Derek Redd reports Shepherd is leaving the MEC after next year

[Ram Tough]

Re: Derek Redd reports Shepherd is leaving the MEC after next year

I don't know how quickly NDC and Urbana will leave. I think it will likely take a few years, but I think the writing is on the wall.

[boatcapt]

Re: Derek Redd reports Shepherd is leaving the MEC after next year

As for NDC/Urbana and the G-MAC - I'm not sure you have your order of who is overturing who right. It is well documented that Ashland has a saved/held position in the G-MAC. It is believed that UIndy may have one as well. I've heard no such thing about NDC and Urbana. I have no doubt that the dialogue is open though, as both schools came from the G-MAC and have many ties to the G-MAC schools.

As for Urbana - I agree. You can look at them as either the smallest and most fragile MEC school, or as the largest intuition, one that offers doctorate degrees. Here are my thoughts from a month ago:

You are spot on about Urbana. But I think regardless of how people look at them (small school or small campus of a much larger school), it seem pretty clear that the move under Franklins operating budget (and control) has made them much more stable. While there is no public statement from Franklin about weather they are going to keep Urbana open, I would say the recent additions of athletic programs gives a good indication. Remember, Franklin is a for profit entity so every dollar they spend starting a program is a dollar off their bottom line. If they were intent, or even seriously thinking about, closing Urbana, they probably wouldn't be starting programs.

Concerning Ashland, I believe you when you say they have a standing invitation to the GMAC. But twice now they have refused to join most recently earlier this year saying the GMAC isn't a good fit for them at this time. Question I have is, what is the issue they have with the GMAC that is making them soooo hesitant? Side question is, would they have the same issue if approached by the MEC? Don't know the answer to either of those questions but given Shepherds departure and the alleged need to bring on another Ohio university, I think it is at least worth it for the MEC to ask. Worst they can do is say no outright...but they could say, were listening, tell us more.

[Sportsnut]

Re: Derek Redd reports Shepherd is leaving the MEC after next year

Be nice to pick up two northern Ohio schools along with Frostburg. It would make a tight geographic fit with only Concord being on an island by themselves.

[cneagle99]

Re: Derek Redd reports Shepherd is leaving the MEC after next year

Be nice to pick up two northern Ohio schools along with Frostburg. It would make a tight geographic fit with only Concord being on an island by themselves.

And the SAC said, "MMMMM, Concord......"


Just kidding Captain!

[boatcapt]

Re: Derek Redd reports Shepherd is leaving the MEC after next year

And the SAC said, "MMMMM, Concord......"


Just kidding Captain!

Hahaha...funny...NOT!!!!!

Just my opinion but I think the whole "travel savings" is just a canard foisted by Shepherd leadership to do what they wanted to do and that wasn't necessarily to join the PSAC. No what they REALLY wanted was to have that game against Shippensburg back on their schedule! Wim'ie LOVES him some Raiders and would do ANYTHING to play with them again!!!

[IUPbigINDIANS]

Re: Derek Redd reports Shepherd is leaving the MEC after next year

You are spot on about Urbana. But I think regardless of how people look at them (small school or small campus of a much larger school), it seem pretty clear that the move under Franklins operating budget (and control) has made them much more stable. While there is no public statement from Franklin about weather they are going to keep Urbana open, I would say the recent additions of athletic programs gives a good indication. Remember, Franklin is a for profit entity so every dollar they spend starting a program is a dollar off their bottom line. If they were intent, or even seriously thinking about, closing Urbana, they probably wouldn't be starting programs.

Concerning Ashland, I believe you when you say they have a standing invitation to the GMAC. But twice now they have refused to join most recently earlier this year saying the GMAC isn't a good fit for them at this time. Question I have is, what is the issue they have with the GMAC that is making them soooo hesitant? Side question is, would they have the same issue if approached by the MEC? Don't know the answer to either of those questions but given Shepherds departure and the alleged need to bring on another Ohio university, I think it is at least worth it for the MEC to ask. Worst they can do is say no outright...but they could say, were listening, tell us more.

Likely because they are in perhaps the top football conference in D2 (as well as a highly-regarded basketball conference which just won the national title). It could be as simple as a status thing. Ashland is a very, very good football program in a very, very good league.

[IUPbigINDIANS]

Re: Derek Redd reports Shepherd is leaving the MEC after next year

Hahaha...funny...NOT!!!!!

Just my opinion but I think the whole "travel savings" is just a canard foisted by Shepherd leadership to do what they wanted to do and that wasn't necessarily to join the PSAC. No what they REALLY wanted was to have that game against Shippensburg back on their schedule! Wim'ie LOVES him some Raiders and would do ANYTHING to play with them again!!!

Who cares why they left? They left. Their choice.

[boatcapt]

Re: Derek Redd reports Shepherd is leaving the MEC after next year

Likely because they are in perhaps the top football conference in D2 (as well as a highly-regarded basketball conference which just won the national title). It could be as simple as a status thing. Ashland is a very, very good football program in a very, very good league.

That's the argument for them to stay in the GLIAC. If they are waiting for the GMAC to become the GLIAC, they probably are going to be waiting for a while!

[IUPbigINDIANS]

Re: Derek Redd reports Shepherd is leaving the MEC after next year

That's the argument for them to stay in the GLIAC. If they are waiting for the GMAC to become the GLIAC, they probably are going to be waiting for a while!

Exactly. That's why I think they are not jumping to the GMAC. If you're SEC football ... not going to jump at the chance to join the Big East.

[cneagle99]

Re: Derek Redd reports Shepherd is leaving the MEC after next year

You are spot on about Urbana. But I think regardless of how people look at them (small school or small campus of a much larger school), it seem pretty clear that the move under Franklins operating budget (and control) has made them much more stable. While there is no public statement from Franklin about weather they are going to keep Urbana open, I would say the recent additions of athletic programs gives a good indication. Remember, Franklin is a for profit entity so every dollar they spend starting a program is a dollar off their bottom line. If they were intent, or even seriously thinking about, closing Urbana, they probably wouldn't be starting programs.

Concerning Ashland, I believe you when you say they have a standing invitation to the GMAC. But twice now they have refused to join most recently earlier this year saying the GMAC isn't a good fit for them at this time. Question I have is, what is the issue they have with the GMAC that is making them soooo hesitant? Side question is, would they have the same issue if approached by the MEC? Don't know the answer to either of those questions but given Shepherds departure and the alleged need to bring on another Ohio university, I think it is at least worth it for the MEC to ask. Worst they can do is say no outright...but they could say, were listening, tell us more.

I think Ashland to the the GMAC is a question of when, not if. My read of the interaction was that they (Ashland) was interested, but the timing was not right. To me, that means they are waiting for something to shake out with the GMAC, which could mean a few things:

1. They want to move with another school and they need to line both schools up....(Indianapolis?)
2. They are waiting to see if schools leave the GMAC...(TNU, KWU, WV schools), thus making the GMAC more enticing. Dropping the 7 hour plus trip to Nashville can't be a bad thing in their eyes for example.
3. They may just be waiting to see how the young conference plays out before committing and more specifically, how the integration of the GLIAC schools (particularly Hillsdale and Findlay) works.

Ashland knows that they are a "get" for the GMAC so they can play the waiting game. But, I also don't see them moving to the MEC. If the GMAC, made up of similar and closer schools, couldn't get them, the MEC won't be able to either.

To me the waiting game now is on AB. Which conference do they want to be in? Are there still hurt feelings? I assume the MEC would take them in a heartbeat at this point--as they would appear to be the best out there (along with Frostburg) to replace either Shepherd or Wise. It would seem that AB now will have to choose between the two conferences.

If AB goes MEC, what then becomes of D&E and Ohio Valley? My gut is they will hang on for a while, but eventually go NAIA or D3. Moving either together or with D&E going NAIA and OVU D3. Eventually, being in the bottom of the standings and the travel (for D&E) will force a move--a la Brevard in the SAC.

If the above happens, I think it speeds up Ashland's transition to the GMAC.

More long term would be TNU eventually moving to the Gulf South. Really don't see KWU going anywhere.

**This is all just speculation, I have no firm info other than a few high placed alums at a GMAC school.

[BlueBlood]

Re: Derek Redd reports Shepherd is leaving the MEC after next year

Concerning Ashland, I believe you when you say they have a standing invitation to the GMAC. But twice now they have refused to join most recently earlier this year saying the GMAC isn't a good fit for them at this time. Question I have is, what is the issue they have with the GMAC that is making them soooo hesitant?

Side question is, would they have the same issue if approached by the MEC?

What I think the possible reasons are:

1) The desire to play in a powerhouse conference / The perception of leaving a powerhouse conference.
2) History. Ashland was in the GLIAC before the other OH schools joined, and has a longer history with those schools. They left the MOC/AMC NAIA conference way before the other OH schools did. In fact, many of the OH schools came into the MOC/AMC after Ashland had already left, so they never played together.
3) History part 2. To my knowledge, Ashland was never involved in the plans to create an OH D2 conference. All of the other OH schools were (LEC not at the onset, but got on board). They have been happy in the GLIAC
4) The G-MAC footprint is still a bit far-flung and unsettled. Huge concentration of schools in OH, then there are schools spread out in WV, TN and KY. At some point, the G-MAC kind of needs to pick a direction to expand into and solidify that territory. Unfortunately, that comes at the expense of "the other side of the footprint". I have a hunch that Ashland wants that straightened out before they consider coming aboard.

I really don't think the MEC has a chance at Ashland.

[IUPbigINDIANS]

Re: Derek Redd reports Shepherd is leaving the MEC after next year

It would seem that AB now will have to choose between the two conferences.


Tell me that's not some irony.

[Ram Tough]

Re: Derek Redd reports Shepherd is leaving the MEC after next year

Hahaha...funny...NOT!!!!!

Just my opinion but I think the whole "travel savings" is just a canard foisted by Shepherd leadership to do what they wanted to do and that wasn't necessarily to join the PSAC. No what they REALLY wanted was to have that game against Shippensburg back on their schedule! Wim'ie LOVES him some Raiders and would do ANYTHING to play with them again!!!

You're just jealous that you don't have a football rival who gives a damn about WLU. In fact, no one else in the MEC has a remotely similar rival.

[BlueBlood]

Re: Derek Redd reports Shepherd is leaving the MEC after next year

1. They want to move with another school and they need to line both schools up....(Indianapolis?)
2. They are waiting to see if schools leave the GMAC...(TNU, KWU, WV schools), thus making the GMAC more enticing. Dropping the 7 hour plus trip to Nashville can't be a bad thing in their eyes for example.
3. They may just be waiting to see how the young conference plays out before committing and more specifically, how the integration of the GLIAC schools (particularly Hillsdale and Findlay) works.

Ashland knows that they are a "get" for the GMAC so they can play the waiting game. But, I also don't see them moving to the MEC. If the GMAC, made up of similar and closer schools, couldn't get them, the MEC won't be able to either.

To me the waiting game now is on AB.

Agree

[boatcapt]

Re: Derek Redd reports Shepherd is leaving the MEC after next year

I think Ashland to the the GMAC is a question of when, not if. My read of the interaction was that they (Ashland) was interested, but the timing was not right. To me, that means they are waiting for something to shake out with the GMAC, which could mean a few things:

1. They want to move with another school and they need to line both schools up....(Indianapolis?)
2. They are waiting to see if schools leave the GMAC...(TNU, KWU, WV schools), thus making the GMAC more enticing. Dropping the 7 hour plus trip to Nashville can't be a bad thing in their eyes for example.
3. They may just be waiting to see how the young conference plays out before committing and more specifically, how the integration of the GLIAC schools (particularly Hillsdale and Findlay) works.

Ashland knows that they are a "get" for the GMAC so they can play the waiting game. But, I also don't see them moving to the MEC. If the GMAC, made up of similar and closer schools, couldn't get them, the MEC won't be able to either.

To me the waiting game now is on AB. Which conference do they want to be in? Are there still hurt feelings? I assume the MEC would take them in a heartbeat at this point--as they would appear to be the best out there (along with Frostburg) to replace either Shepherd or Wise. It would seem that AB now will have to choose between the two conferences.

If AB goes MEC, what then becomes of D&E and Ohio Valley? My gut is they will hang on for a while, but eventually go NAIA or D3. Moving either together or with D&E going NAIA and OVU D3. Eventually, being in the bottom of the standings and the travel (for D&E) will force a move--a la Brevard in the SAC.

If the above happens, I think it speeds up Ashland's transition to the GMAC.

More long term would be TNU eventually moving to the Gulf South. Really don't see KWU going anywhere.

**This is all just speculation, I have no firm info other than a few high placed alums at a GMAC school.

The whole thing about D&E/Ohio Valley eventually going NAIA/D3 I think is our projecting what is "best" for them. Doesn't seem like either is particularly concerned about how good their programs are as they have generally been bad for a very, very long time so the chance to be "better" as an NAIA/D3 program doesn't seem to be something that would move them (at least it hasn't yet). Likewise scholly costs probably wouldn't move them as there is no minimum number of schollys a DII must offer so conceivably they could offer zero. Their travel is primarily through Ohio and WV...think it would be pretty much a wash with NAIA/D3 travel if they dropped down. Not saying they shouldn't leave DII or even that they won't...there just doesn't seem to be any motivation for them to do it and if I've seen anything with these two schools, if they aren't motivated to do something, they won't do it.