18th PSAC Member: Lackawanna College?

[EastStroud13]

Why, specifically, is it a serious error in judgment?

That's a serious question. I don't know too much about Lackawanna. Personally, I thought adding Seton Hill was a serious error in judgment. I had less trouble with the Erie schools.

Do you think they will encroach on ESU's territory in recruiting?

I think rushing into any add simply to have an even number of schools is an error in judgment, no matter who that school is. There is huge risk in adding members because it's not something you can just undo, as proven by Seton Hill's performance. We're stuck with them and I'm worried we'll be stuck with Lackawanna too, a school that we have no idea will even be a viable 4-year institution.

The right move was being patient and dealing with an odd number of teams for the time being.

[IUPNation]

I think rushing into any add simply to have an even number of schools is an error in judgment, no matter who that school is. There is huge risk in adding members because it's not something you can just undo, as proven by Seton Hill's performance. We're stuck with them and I'm worried we'll be stuck with Lackawanna too, a school that we have no idea will even be a viable 4-year institution.

The right move was being patient and dealing with an odd number of teams for the time being.

They want to end the issues with some teams having a full schedule and some having a bye week.

[TheBigCat2192]

I think rushing into any add simply to have an even number of schools is an error in judgment, no matter who that school is. There is huge risk in adding members because it's not something you can just undo, as proven by Seton Hill's performance. We're stuck with them and I'm worried we'll be stuck with Lackawanna too, a school that we have no idea will even be a viable 4-year institution.

The right move was being patient and dealing with an odd number of teams for the time being.

FWIW Murray said in that GUKnighted interview the invitee (whether it’s Lackawanna or not) had expressed interest to the PSAC about joining as far back as 2018 and that COVID had put a halt to consideration at that time. I don’t like the idea of adding a school transitioning from NJCAA to NCAA but the board presumably did initial research into whoever is joining at that time and I have to imagine that when Mercyhurst left they went about updating that research as they called around and talked to different schools. I’m not sure they’ve made a good decision but given the available information I don’t believe this is a rushed choice.

[IUPbigINDIANS]

I think rushing into any add simply to have an even number of schools is an error in judgment, no matter who that school is. There is huge risk in adding members because it's not something you can just undo, as proven by Seton Hill's performance. We're stuck with them and I'm worried we'll be stuck with Lackawanna too, a school that we have no idea will even be a viable 4-year institution.

The right move was being patient and dealing with an odd number of teams for the time being.

Seton Hill is a power in baseball and softball (and is usually strong in women's basketball).

Granted, those are sports rarely discussed on here.

SH also has strong academics.

They don't 'fit in' with us lowly state schoolers (in their mind) but overall they aren't that bad for the league.

[IUPbigINDIANS]

FWIW Murray said in that GUKnighted interview the invitee (whether it’s Lackawanna or not) had expressed interest to the PSAC about joining as far back as 2018 and that COVID had put a halt to consideration at that time. I don’t like the idea of adding a school transitioning from NJCAA to NCAA but the board presumably did initial research into whoever is joining at that time and I have to imagine that when Mercyhurst left they went about updating that research as they called around and talked to different schools. I’m not sure they’ve made a good decision but given the available information I don’t believe this is a rushed choice.

It's called 'settling'.

That's the PR-spin response to being unable to close the other deals.

We're essentially taking our 4th or 5th choice to the prom.

[Fightingscot82]

Seton Hill is a power in baseball and softball (and is usually strong in women's basketball).

Granted, those are sports rarely discussed on here.

SH also has strong academics.

They don't 'fit in' with us lowly state schoolers (in their mind) but overall they aren't that bad for the league.

Seton Hill does not have strong academics. They have average academics. The same level as any other PASSHE school.

[boatcapt]

I think rushing into any add simply to have an even number of schools is an error in judgment, no matter who that school is. There is huge risk in adding members because it's not something you can just undo, as proven by Seton Hill's performance. We're stuck with them and I'm worried we'll be stuck with Lackawanna too, a school that we have no idea will even be a viable 4-year institution.

The right move was being patient and dealing with an odd number of teams for the time being.

Doesn't seem they rushed into this addition to the PSAC. Rushing in would have been adding a school within months of a vacancy becoming available. By all accounts, they contacted many schools in the PSAC area but were rebuffed by most. Seems like all the existing DII's that are in conferences are happy just where they are. So after an extensive search, the PSAC was left with two options...Stand pat and hope something changes in the future to "free up" an existing DII OR bring in a Pennsylvania D3 or JUCO school looking to step-up to DII. After a year long search, the PSAC leaders chose the latter. I think you can question the school they chose but but you can hardly say the process was rushed.

[Fightingscot82]

Doesn't seem they rushed into this addition to the PSAC. Rushing in would have been adding a school within months of a vacancy becoming available. By all accounts, they contacted many schools in the PSAC area but were rebuffed by most. Seems like all the existing DII's that are in conferences are happy just where they are. So after an extensive search, the PSAC was left with two options...Stand pat and hope something changes in the future to "free up" an existing DII OR bring in a Pennsylvania D3 or JUCO school looking to step-up to DII. After a year long search, the PSAC leaders chose the latter. I think you can question the school they chose but but you can hardly say the process was rushed.

Lots of instability at Frostburg, who I assume was the top target.

[boatcapt]

Lots of instability at Frostburg, who I assume was the top target.

"Lots of instability"...They would have fit right in!

Presumably they asked but Frostburg said no.

[EastStroud13]

Doesn't seem they rushed into this addition to the PSAC. Rushing in would have been adding a school within months of a vacancy becoming available. By all accounts, they contacted many schools in the PSAC area but were rebuffed by most. Seems like all the existing DII's that are in conferences are happy just where they are. So after an extensive search, the PSAC was left with two options...Stand pat and hope something changes in the future to "free up" an existing DII OR bring in a Pennsylvania D3 or JUCO school looking to step-up to DII. After a year long search, the PSAC leaders chose the latter. I think you can question the school they chose but but you can hardly say the process was rushed.

It has been just 14 months since Mercyhurst announced they were leaving. If you think that's enough time to commit to making a risky decision, for the sole purpose of getting to an even number of schools, then you are just as impatient as the PSAC administrators.

Patience in this case looks like 3+ years of deliberation. Wait for when the timing is best. The Patriot League is an excellent example of this, they had only 7 teams for over two decades, biding their time, and now they've added three excellent programs in Richmond, William & Mary, and Villanova. The PSAC could learn a lot from that.

[boatcapt]

It has been just 14 months since Mercyhurst announced they were leaving. If you think that's enough time to commit to making a risky decision, for the sole purpose of getting to an even number of schools, then you are just as impatient as the PSAC administrators.

Patience in this case looks like 3+ years of deliberation. Wait for when the timing is best. The Patriot League is an excellent example of this, they had only 7 teams for over two decades, biding their time, and now they've added three excellent programs in Richmond, William & Mary, and Villanova. The PSAC could learn a lot from that.

PSAC's previous expansions/moves to replace departed members were conducted over the course of weeks SOOOOO 14 months is a patient, deliberative process for them. Maybe next time they can wait 3+ years.

[EastStroud13]

PSAC's previous expansions/moves to replace departed members were conducted over the course of weeks SOOOOO 14 months is a patient, deliberative process for them. Maybe next time they can wait 3+ years.

No need to wait if there was a slam dunk candidate like Shepherd available. But the PSAC certainly should have done more due diligence when it came to SHU and UPJ.

[boatcapt]

No need to wait if there was a slam dunk candidate like Shepherd available. But the PSAC certainly should have done more due diligence when it came to SHU and UPJ.

I don't disagree with you. But my point was that compared to the PSACs history, one year is a slow and deliberate process.

As for SHU and UPJ, you touched them, they are YOURs!!!

[IUPbigINDIANS]

I don't disagree with you. But my point was that compared to the PSACs history, one year is a slow and deliberate process.

As for SHU and UPJ, you touched them, they are YOURs!!!

Seton Hill isn't that bad. They have top-notch programs in baseball and softball. Women's hoops is strong.

More (most) importantly for the West, they make for a real easy road trip.

They also have football, which fills a spot.

People yap because they play in a high school stadium. News flash ... that high school stadium is nicer than most PSAC stadiums. No track. Historic. Nice views of downtown Greensburg. In fairness parking is a total nightmare (even with their tiny crowds).

Granted, their basketball gym is a claustrophobic shoebox straight out of Hoosiers.

Do I like Seton Hill? No. It has an attitude of being superior to the PSAC schools. Do they fit in? Not really. But, it works.

UPJ's lack of football is a killer. But, the geography isn't terrible (aside from some winter trips).

Most sports not named Wrestling at UPJ are average or below. Their men's hoops team is pretty good every year. Not great but competitive.

I don't think UPJ has developed any rivalries. Due to closeness I assume they think IUP is a rival.

UPJ is a different vibe than all the state schools.

[IUPNation]

Seton Hill isn't that bad. They have top-notch programs in baseball and softball. Women's hoops is strong.

More (most) importantly for the West, they make for a real easy road trip.

They also have football, which fills a spot.

People yap because they play in a high school stadium. News flash ... that high school stadium is nicer than most PSAC stadiums. No track. Historic. Nice views of downtown Greensburg. In fairness parking is a total nightmare (even with their tiny crowds).

Granted, their basketball gym is a claustrophobic shoebox straight out of Hoosiers.

Do I like Seton Hill? No. It has an attitude of being superior to the PSAC schools. Do they fit in? Not really. But, it works.

UPJ's lack of football is a killer. But, the geography isn't terrible (aside from some winter trips).

Most sports not named Wrestling at UPJ are average or below. Their men's hoops team is pretty good every year. Not great but competitive.

I don't think UPJ has developed any rivalries. Due to closeness I assume they think IUP is a rival.

UPJ is a different vibe than all the state schools.

I do not understand why the mothership in Oakland doesn’t let the branch campus have a foosball team.