ETBU to the GAC?

[Mulerider]

Geographically they are significantly closer to the schools in the GAC than they are almost all of the schools in the LSC.

Not even close….. LSC would double travel costs compared to the GAC.

It depends if the GAC wants to accept any more members. Accepting any more would have changes on Football scheduling (which I would gladly take a non-conference game or two.)

[UCObluejay]

Why mess up a good thing? The only real issue is the SILO.

[crixus]

In my opinion...a school the size of ETBU (aprox 2,000) has the best opportunity to flourish in athletics in D3. But it's clear that there simply isn't a conference availible in D3 that makes geographical sense.

The only real D3 option is a merger with 5-6 California schools, which is a travel nightmare.

I don't look down on the NAIA....there are some really good athletes and programs there...but it simply doesn't have the appeal of the NCAA.

That leaves D2....which basically means the Lone Star Conference or the GAC.


The LSC is mostly made up of schools all significatly larger than ETBU:

UT Dallas 31,570
Texas Women's (Denton) 12,465
Angelo State (San Angelo) 10,447
West Texas A&M (Canyon) 10,169
A&M Kingsville 8,783
UT Permian (Odessa) 7,628
Midwestern State (Whichita Falls) 6,093
Eastern New Mexico (Portales) 5,574
St. Edwards (Austin) 5,500
Cameron (Lawton)- 5,449
Dallas Baptist- 5,500
UT Tyler 5,300
St. Mary's (San Antonio) 4,500
Texas A&M International (Loredo) 4,298
Western New Mexico (Silver City) 3,820
Oklahoma Christian (OKC) 2,479
Lubbock Christian 2,100
Sul Ross (Alpine) 2,070
ETBU 2,031

Most of the GAC is larger too....but to a lesser degree.

Arkansas Tech: 12,000
Harding: 6,000
SW Oklahoma: 5,100
Southern Arkansas: 4,100
UA Monticello: 3,600
Henderson State: 3,500
Oklahoma Baptist: 2,000
ETBU: 1,900
Ouachita Baptist: 1,500

Not to mention the travel in the LSC would be SIGNIFICATLY more in the LSC than the GAC. Most of the LSC is centered west of the metroplex.....more towards Abilene/Midland/Odessa than all the way down into south Texas. Almost all of the schools in the LSC are 7 or more hours or more away from ETBU.

Meanwhile...most of the GAC is within 5 hours or less.

Another thing to think about is recruiting. Most of the LSC is located in larger cities of 100,000 or more. Abilene, Odessa, San Angelo, Lubbck, Austin, San Antonio, Denton, Tyler.

Marshall has a population of 25,000 and is more rural.

But with the GAC..... the cities they are located in are more similar to Marshall. Arkadelphia, Russellville, Ada, Searcy, etc....all similar in size. Definately levels the recruiting field tremendously.

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I have no idea if ETBU has aspirations of D2. I don't see how they couldn't at this point. But if they do...... the GAC is definitely an attractive choice on many levels. Just hope ETBU is attractive to the GAC and its membership.

Yes, there are 6 football teams in the SCIAC (Southern California Intercollegiate Athletic Conference) and it would definitely be a travel nightmare. I don't see a merger happening. They've lost two football teams (Occidental and Whittier) in the past few years so they're playing some of the conference teams twice during the season. Hopefully they won't lose anymore teams, the 6 they have left seem to be in good shape...for now. I live in SoCal and follow Redlands of the SCIAC.

[ctrabs74]

I have no idea if ETBU has aspirations of D2. I don't see how they couldn't at this point. But if they do...... the GAC is definitely an attractive choice on many levels. Just hope ETBU is attractive to the GAC and its membership.

The only way I could see ETBU moving to D2 is (1) adding another school to get to 14 (Read: Northeastern State) and (2) if ETBU is even interested in making move.

[huntnfish]

Geographically they are significantly closer to the schools in the GAC than they are almost all of the schools in the LSC.

Not even really close….. LSC would double travel costs compared to the GAC.

Your right I forget about those trips the LSC teams have to take out to the West Coast. The LSC would be smart to pick up a ETBU and get rid of the two West Coast teams

[Mavchamp]

The only way I could see ETBU moving to D2 is (1) adding another school to get to 14 (Read: Northeastern State) and (2) if ETBU is even interested in making move.

1. ETBU, Hardin Simmons, Howard Payne, and Mary Hardin Baylor may all be looking. However...I think HSU and UMHB would all prefer the LSC geographically. HPU I think is likely headed to the NAIA and the Sooner Conference.

2. Unless something drastic changes (like an invite to the SCAC) to keep them in D3........ETBU basically has two choices: Go D2 or join the NAIA. I don't think there's much interest in going NAIA after the millions of dollars they have invested in top-notch facilities.

If I was a gambling man....I'd guess LSC or GAC. One makes a lot more sense than the other....but since when has common sense driven these types of decisions lately?

[Mavchamp]

Youre right I forget about those trips the LSC teams have to take out to the West Coast. The LSC would be smart to pick up a ETBU and get rid of the two West Coast teams

True....but even IN-STATE LSC schools in Abilene, Odessa, Kingsville, San Angelo, Lubbock, Whichita Falls, San Antonio, Laredo, Canyon...... are all 8-9 hour drives..... which is still twice as far as most of the GAC schools are from ETBU.

Unless you're west of the Dallas metroplex....... all of the LSC schools are far and remote drives.

I have no idea what ETBU ends up doing....but IF they choose to go D2..... I'm hoping they choose the GAC....and I hope the GAC welcomes them.

Seems like a much better fit.

Not to mention Arkansas is 1000X prettier than west Texas.

[OldBison]

Ok. I’ll play along. Here’s one possible scenario:

GAC East
Harding
Ouachita Baptist
Henderson State
SAU
UAM
ATU
ETBU
DSU

GAC West
SEOSU
ECU
OK Baptist
SNU
SWOSU
NWOSU
NEOK
MC

This provides a 8-week conference schedule, a week for a GAC Championship Game and room for each team to schedule two OC opponents.

[OldBison]

Check that. My previous provides a 7-game conference schedule, a championship game and 3 OC games. Whereas finding three OC opponents can be a headache, with the LSC, RMAC and MIAA teams all looking for OC opponents, it shouldn’t be too difficult.

[OldBison]

There are a few challenges with my proposed GAC East and West scenario. One of them being a 9 1/2 hour bus trip from Clinton, MS to Altus, OK for the Choctaws to play the Rangers.

[OldBison]

That 9 1/2 hour drive from Clinton, MS to Altus, OK could get old for the Choctaws and Rangers.

[Finchwidget]

Ok. I’ll play along. Here’s one possible scenario:

GAC East
Harding
Ouachita Baptist
Henderson State
SAU
UAM
ATU
ETBU
DSU

GAC West
SEOSU
ECU
OK Baptist
SNU
SWOSU
NWOSU
NEOK
MC

This provides a 8-week conference schedule, a week for a GAC Championship Game and room for each team to schedule two OC opponents.

Why put MC in the West division? I get that ETBU is a little closer to Arkansas, but switching them with MC would give you a clean division along state lines. East division of Arkansas/Mississippi and a West division of Oklahoma/East Texas

[OPSUALUM77&81]

That 9 1/2 hour drive from Clinton, MS to Altus, OK could get old for the Choctaws and Rangers.

Western Oklahom a College in Altus, OK, is a junior college that doesn't play football.

[OldBison]

Western Oklahom a College in Altus, OK, is a junior college that doesn't play football.

I was referring to Northwestern Oklahoma State University, a member of the GAC. They do play although not that well in recent years.

[OldBison]

[QUOTE=Finchwidget;n826683]

Why put MC in the West division? I get that ETBU is a little closer to Arkansas, but switching them with MC would give you a clean division along state lines. East division of Arkansas/Mississippi and a West division of Oklahoma/East Texas[/QUOTE

I was just using geography. Northeastern OK is closest to most of GAC Oklahoma schools. East Texas Baptist is closer to the Arkansas schools than either of Mississippi schools. That leaves the two Mississippi schools. Of the two, DSU in Cleveland, MS is closer to the Arkansas schools than Mississippi College in Clinton.