What's Going to Happen To D2

[Brandon]

And what southern teams would you consider D2 powers?

[Herb Street]

Number one, perhaps "powers" might not be the best word choice. Maybe "full budget, large state schools" (ACU excepted) might be the better descriptor. I admittedly don't keep up a whole lot with the LSC living in Arkansas, but I believe that Commerce won a national championship fairly recently in D2. ACU and Tarleton have had success. I believe North Alabama was quite good in D2, as well as Troy, etc. As schools exceed 10,000 undergraduate enrollment, they begin to have the $ funds to toy with the idea of moving to FCS and Division 1 in the other sports. I have no idea the enrollments of the various LSC state schools, but I'm guessing a lot of them are 10,000 and up.

Not trying to pick an argument here. I may be way off base. I don't see any particular advantages to Division 2 ball from a business standpoint, and I suspect a lot of these schools feel the same or they wouldn't have moved or begun the process of moving. No offense intended.

[Brandon]

Number one, perhaps "powers" might not be the best word choice. Maybe "full budget, large state schools" (ACU excepted) might be the better descriptor. I admittedly don't keep up a whole lot with the LSC living in Arkansas, but I believe that Commerce won a national championship fairly recently in D2. ACU and Tarleton have had success. I believe North Alabama was quite good in D2, as well as Troy, etc. As schools exceed 10,000 undergraduate enrollment, they begin to have the $ funds to toy with the idea of moving to FCS and Division 1 in the other sports. I have no idea the enrollments of the various LSC state schools, but I'm guessing a lot of them are 10,000 and up.

Not trying to pick an argument here. I may be way off base. I don't see any particular advantages to Division 2 ball from a business standpoint, and I suspect a lot of these schools feel the same or they wouldn't have moved or begun the process of moving. No offense intended.

No offense was taken. I am not D2. I'm just someone that covers it. Your descriptors helped clear things up.

UNA's enrollment was in the 7,000's when they made the transition.

If I were to criticize your reasoning, it would be your understanding of Division III, actually. There are a lot of "scholarships" granted to Division III athletes, but they're not considered athletic scholarships. It is a way to entice students to go to those schools. It's no different than any level except the budgets are smaller than the FBS.

To apply the same logic you have used, there is no benefit to expenses below the P5.

The truth is that each school makes a cost benefit analysis in terms of student recruitment, visibility, campus culture. They're not run like businesses, although I think that might change at all levels.

Getting guarantees from FBS schools doesn't pay for reclassification. Hopefully the schools that reclassify have business partners and donors with deep pockets. The good thing for schools like Commerce is that the budgets in the SLC are not large.

Some random budgets. The "scholarships" are not included in the DIII budgets, but are in the others.

Hardin Simmons - $3,233,052
Mary Hardin Baylor - $5,039,757
Wisconsin-Whitewater - $4,594, 675
Mount Union - $3,754,888

A&M-Commerce - $11,755,537
West Florida - $11,193,566
Grand Valley - $15,257,563
Angelo State - $8,615,187

James Madison - $48,062,926
Nicholls State - $10,438,587
Sam Houston - $20,010,161
Stephen F. Austin - $18,175,572

[Herb Street]

No offense was taken. I am not D2. I'm just someone that covers it. Your descriptors helped clear things up.

UNA's enrollment was in the 7,000's when they made the transition.

If I were to criticize your reasoning, it would be your understanding of Division III, actually. There are a lot of "scholarships" granted to Division III athletes, but they're not considered athletic scholarships. It is a way to entice students to go to those schools. It's no different than any level except the budgets are smaller than the FBS.

To apply the same logic you have used, there is no benefit to expenses below the P5.

The truth is that each school makes a cost benefit analysis in terms of student recruitment, visibility, campus culture. They're not run like businesses, although I think that might change at all levels.

Getting guarantees from FBS schools doesn't pay for reclassification. Hopefully the schools that reclassify have business partners and donors with deep pockets. The good thing for schools like Commerce is that the budgets in the SLC are not large.

Some random budgets. The "scholarships" are not included in the DIII budgets, but are in the others.

Hardin Simmons - $3,233,052
Mary Hardin Baylor - $5,039,757
Wisconsin-Whitewater - $4,594, 675
Mount Union - $3,754,888

A&M-Commerce - $11,755,537
West Florida - $11,193,566
Grand Valley - $15,257,563
Angelo State - $8,615,187

James Madison - $48,062,926
Nicholls State - $10,438,587
Sam Houston - $20,010,161
Stephen F. Austin - $18,175,572

[SW_Mustang]

Basically, yes. DIII schools can't offer athletic scholarships, but there's no rule prohibiting them from offering academic scholarships to athletes. Tuition to DIII schools is often far more expensive than even FBS schools, so it's a way to subsidize education for those players.

[Uwfalum98]

So in other words if you want to make the jump to FCS and be competitive you will need boosters with really deep pockets. This is the reason I don't see West Florida making the jump any time soon. I don't believe they have the necessary private funding to allow them to be competitive in all sports and I can't see them being satisfied with simply being D1. It seems to me that a school has to have some folks who really want to make the jump and are willing to foot the bill and that just doesn't seem to be the case at UWF.

[Herb Street]

[Brandon]

That's especially true sub-P5.

[Uwfalum98]

Maybe but UWF students already pay more per credit hour for athletics than any other State University in Florida.

[WT&TTECHfan]

[ASUPops]

And by big donor you mean huge! That's a multimillion dollar per year donation.....$5M, $8M, $10M PER YEAR.

[SW_Mustang]

Yikes - I don't like nickeling and diming the general student body for facilities and services they aren't entitled to use.

Fees and "extras" are partly why the cost of college has skyrocketed so much.

[El_Hoggie]

[Twincitiesmav]

[WT&TTECHfan]

Heard expansion for the LSC in football only.The LSC and the rest of the GNAC schools are almost finalized for Central Washington,Western Oregon and Simon Frazier to join the LSC in football only.Should hear an official announcement in a couple of weeks.