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  • Well, and here's the other thing most of us are thinking, wheelingtopper. We're not necessarily begrudging any young man the opportunity to chase his dream. And if playing D1 is his dream, he has every right to try to achieve that. I don't think anyone is suggesting otherwise.

    The responses you're hearing (from Columbuseer and others) come from a place of disappointment. Most of these kids (and there are undoubtedly exceptions, as IUPbig mentioned with the Cobo Diaz reference) who star in D2 and try to jump to a mid-major D1 do so at their own peril. For his own sake, I hope it's not the case, but there's every possibility that a kid like Verplancken goes from being a 35-minute-per-game difference-maker at D2 to an 8-minute-per-game role-player at a place like Loyola Chicago. It saddens us fans of D2 to see kids eschew real opportunities for the growth of their game and the growth of them as young men that exist for them here at D2 in order to chase some dream that may only be nominal (i.e., they can nominally say at barbecues later in life that they played D1--even if that meant they were the "11th man"). Most of us D2 fans just wish there weren't some stigma on D2 that makes it seem to some of these kids like being a 35-minute-per-game, 21-point-scoring-average player here is "less-than" being a third-teamer at Cleveland State. There is growth to be had here at D2 (both personal and professional), and I think that's what posters like Columbuseer are pointing out. And as IUPbig said, we D2 fans simply lament the harbingers that all of this bring for the future. It will be a sad day when D2 is viewed as nothing more than a "G-league" for mid-major D1s.

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    • Originally posted by wheelingtopper62 View Post

      UINDY plays a more traditional way with a big on the floor able to contend with most LM/MM programs. Basketball is a game played differently in different regions of the country and in the Midwest the style relies on much more pace. With all respect, UINDY was a top 15 D2 program this past season and over the last decade, on a shortlist of 5-10 D2 programs who’s success is unmatched. Also IUP plays a much different style than ANY SCHOOL IN THE MEC. IUP would have a much greater chance of defeating a D1 school in my opinion. UINDY traditionally gets many D1 kickbacks from power 5, MVC, OVC, MAC schools. As much as everyone might hate to hear this on the thread, kids dreams are to play D1 regardless of the school. People growing up dreaming to play for GLENVILLE STATE are few and far between.

      **Also worth noting, playing D2 does not automatically guarantee someone better European Pro offers. Especially for a kid like Vernplancken, who is originally from Belgium and has already turned down multiple club offers. Have been to a few Atlantic Regionals in my day and 2012 when WLU hosted was quite an atmosphere, there is nothing that can compare to the chance of playing in the D1 March Madness.
      If u reread my original post I suggested he go to a school that does not mimic NBA style Never mentioned d1 or D2. It could be either. The D2 conference is not germane either. Most importantly go to the best academic school who allows u to pursue a meaningful major besides “basketball eligibility”.
      Nice thing about D1 is that they are not allowed to give partial scholarships.
      Bad thing about D1 is that they appear much more willing to revoke your scholarship after one year due to pressure in D1 to win now and large coach’s salary.
      D2 is also one Year scholarships but most ( not all) don’t churn and burn their players.
      Last edited by Columbuseer; 04-15-2020, 08:19 AM.

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      • If he is only getting looks by lower tier mid majors then his future isn’t the promise land. There is a difference between dreams and reality!

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        • Lincoln Memorial sophomore All-American and Southeast Region Player of the Year Courvoisier McCauley just tweeted that he's leaving LMU in pursuit of his "DI dream."

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          • Originally posted by IUPbigINDIANS View Post


            That's a real big 'if', however. D2 coaches aren't hired to be a developmental guide to D1. They are hired to win. Quickly. And, if they lose their stars ... they likely won't be employed at their current school very long.

            You have to remember this is a 'fan' site ... so, of course when a potential future star player leaves ... you're going to have some upset fans. And, most coaches aren't on real strong job standing. A couple bad years and it's off to file for unemployment.

            But, many D1 and D2 coaches have made it very clear that if you 'test the waters' ... you're doing it at your own risk. Your spot will likely be gone when/if you want to come back. Pitt football coach Pat Narduzzi said if you want to 'test the waters' it shows him you don't want to be there and you can pack your bags.

            Just yesterday, senior-to-be star running back Garret Owens announced he's leaving Mercyhurst and headed to (very low level D1) Duquesne for his senior season. Now, if your a Lakers fan ... and your program invested three years already in the kid ... not going to be very happy. It's also 'very' heavily rumored Notre Dame (OH) star RB will not be back in the D2 ranks. Prior to last year, Edinboro lost its senior-to-be All-American RB in a transfer to Ball State.

            Players can do what's best for themselves. So can programs and coaches.

            My fear as a true (rare) fan of the D2 level ... is this becomes the new norm. Luckily this trend hasn't hit Indiana yet but it surely could have. Joe's been extremely lucky all of his stars have stayed in Indiana. John Calipari said last year that Cobo Diaz could have not only played but started for many schools in the SEC.

            I guess if you have stars ... enjoy them while you have them. It may only be one season.
            Fans can also root for what's best for the program. All this sappy and emotional crap about "we should want what's best for the kid" is bologna. Absolute nonsense. And everybody knows it. You root for a college team just like you do a pro team. A college player transferring for a "better opportunity" is no different than a professional athlete that you drafted, developed, and adored all during his first 5 or so years in the league immediately bolting at the first chance for more money.

            Problem is, even that side of sports is changing. We're a soft society now. Too sappy. Far too many people are virtue signalers that try to act as though they care more than you. That's more true now than it's ever been. All those guys on ESPN telling you sports aren't important. Well I got news for them... Keep saying that and you'll find out how important sports really are (for them). This continues into the long haul, all those virtue signalers will be out of jobs.

            If a kid turns his back on the school, his teammates, the fans, etc... Don't let the door hit you. I don't have to root for you to succeed when you just gave me, the fan, a middle finger.

            Comment


            • Originally posted by Scrub View Post
              Is that perhaps why WLU has had such success with recruiting kids who weren't projected to be stars (i.e., Bolon, Dyer, etc.) and helping them to work toward becoming stars? If you get a projected star (i.e., Dave Dennis, Yahel Hill, Clay Guillozet, etc.), they might go try to chase stardom somewhere else. If you get a guy who has to work toward his stardom, he may just stick it out with you once he earns his spot. Just spitballing a bit here. In other words, maybe it's less about being fortunate that Bolon stayed, but rather a targeted recruiting strategy of getting a "project guy" with the right mindset?
              I've long held the opinion that the reason WLU has such success in their recruiting is that they largely bring in kids from the middle of nowhere. If you look at their roster makeup most years, most of the players are from really, really small schools. Most of the schools are small, desolate, rural farming communities in Ohio and West Virginia. Obviously there are some exceptions, but so many of their players come from those areas.

              Obviously getting talented players is one thing. But it's always been clear to me that they go to areas to recruit where nobody else is. That's both a blessing and a curse. It can work out tremendously for you because you have little recruiting competition. Then others catch on and come in, however, WLU is a big D2 program, so it's not like a school like Clarion building up this way and then trying to hold off IUP and WLU.

              Reality is that there's not much to do in West Liberty, WV. Nearby Wheeling is a big city for most of those kids. You compare Indiana to West Liberty and there's no comparison. Bar scene, population, general entertainment, etc. They're just different places. I think why West Liberty doesn't have guys leave is mostly because the kids are just comfortable there. You have a group of players from similar backgrounds, communities, and areas who can all confide in each other. Take one of those kids and plop them in a more urban university, their experience might be different and they could be overwhelmed. I think the way they manage to get adjusted and acclimated to college life based on their backgrounds, for many at least, is why they manage to stay at West Liberty. Success always helps too.

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              • Originally posted by wheelingtopper62 View Post

                Vernplancken offers from Southern Illinois, McNeese, Quinnipiac, Southern Utah, Saint Bonny
                lots of MM D1 tracking
                Southern Illinois is his choice via his Twitter two hours ago.

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                • Originally posted by IUPalum View Post

                  Southern Illinois is his choice via his Twitter two hours ago.
                  Good academic choice.
                  #123 among public universities
                  13:1 faculty student ratio
                  9000 students 1100 acre campus
                  $150m endowment.

                  looks like a great opportunity!
                  wish him well!

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                  • Robbie Heath to Pepperdine.

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                    • Originally posted by Bart View Post
                      Robbie Heath to Pepperdine.
                      West Chester to Malibu.


                      Slight change.

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                      • Originally posted by IUPbigINDIANS View Post

                        West Chester to Malibu.


                        Slight change.
                        Closer to home :)

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                        • Originally posted by Horror Child View Post

                          Closer to home :)
                          Only an ocean away by Sarah Brightman.

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                          • Originally posted by Bart View Post

                            Only an ocean away by Sarah Brightman.
                            I walked the Pepperdine campus one night last year while out there for a work trip. It's surreal. Malibu is just like its own world.

                            I also did USC and UCLA. UCLA is beautiful. USC is nice as long as you stay within the boundries of campus. You go past the Coliseum and buyer beware.

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                            • Originally posted by IUPbigINDIANS View Post

                              I walked the Pepperdine campus one night last year while out there for a work trip. It's surreal. Malibu is just like its own world.

                              I also did USC and UCLA. UCLA is beautiful. USC is nice as long as you stay within the boundries of campus. You go past the Coliseum and buyer beware.
                              I guess that's why rich parents dress their kids up like rowers and water polo players, and bribe the coach to get them in to the school. Beautiful schools for rich, beautiful people.

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                              • Originally posted by Bart View Post

                                I guess that's why rich parents dress their kids up like rowers and water polo players, and bribe the coach to get them in to the school. Beautiful schools for rich, beautiful people.
                                Correct. USC is tough to get in even for the wealthy ... unless you tote the rock or drain treys.

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