PASSHE Institutions Merging

[Ship69]

You also have to wonder how schools like Clarion are even keeping the lights on. I went up there for IUP's football game this year and felt like I was in an abandoned town.

We have some schools now with very high percentages of the enrollment being just athletes.

As you said it will shake itself out but we are soon going to have about 5-6 more versions of Mansfield.

Yeah, with Mansfield they already don't have football, and you have to wonder how long they can keep it up. It's been a long time since they've been competitive in any of the major sports and it's hard to see them getting better. When I was going to school in the way-back of the '60s, they actually were one of the league's better basketball programs, but that went downhill to the extent that even Ship, hardly one of the league's better basketball programs prior to the Chris Fite era, has a 48-9 series edge over them since 1983. It's still a rather remote location up there, which is a turnoff for a lot of kids. A high school girl from our church some years ago was looking to major in music and took a trip up there to check it out. She noted that the big thing there seemed to be a trip to Wal-Mart and quickly crossed it off her list. Along with Clarion, their location is really a minus. Slippery Rock and IUP look pretty solid in the West, and West Chester is probably too big to fail in the East. I think Ship and Millersville can probably survive as long as they have good leadership. We'll see.

[Bart]

Sad to see the campus changes. At Bloom I spent my first summer semester living in Montour Hall, visited Waller Administration to deal with financial aid, and took a few courses in Old Science. They have all been scheduled for demolition for the past few years. https://buvoice.com/7485/news/montou...her%20projects.

Old Science Hall was what I thought a college building should be with old creaky hardwood floors and wood trim everywhere; Something out of an old movie with tiered seating with fixed long desks, huge chalkboards, and a formal look. It cost about $100,000 when it was built in 1906, and was renovated twice, last in1988. Now only Carver Hall is left as the oldest building on campus. What a loss. I barely recognize the campus anymore.

[iupgroundhog]

Sad to see the campus changes. At Bloom I spent my first summer semester living in Montour Hall, visited Waller Administration to deal with financial aid, and took a few courses in Old Science. They have all been scheduled for demolition for the past few years. https://buvoice.com/7485/news/montou...her%20projects.

Old Science Hall was what I thought a college building should be with old creaky hardwood floors and wood trim everywhere; Something out of an old movie with tiered seating with fixed long desks, huge chalkboards, and a formal look. It cost about $100,000 when it was built in 1906, and was renovated twice, last in1988. Now only Carver Hall is left as the oldest building on campus. What a loss. I barely recognize the campus anymore.

At least Sutton Hall is on the National Register of Historic Places so I think it has some protection.

[Bart]

At least Sutton Hall is on the National Register of Historic Places so I think it has some protection.

It is Carver Hall, built in 1867 that is on the National Register of Historic Places. Are you using AI again? Sutton Hall that is on IUP campus. When I was at IUP, that was the library.

[iupgroundhog]

It is Carver Hall, built in 1867 that is on the National Register of Historic Places. Are you using AI again? Sutton Hall that is on IUP campus. When I was at IUP, that was the library.

Yes, I was referring to John Sutton Hall at IUP. I changed campuses. I confirmed it on AI.

BTW, I'm so old I remember Thomas Sutton Hall.

[Bart]

Yes, I was referring to John Sutton Hall at IUP. I changed campuses. I confirmed it on AI.

BTW, I'm so old I remember Thomas Sutton Hall.

Remember it. I am so old it was still there during my time.

[iupgroundhog]

Are you using AI again?

A better reply would have been that AI is using me.

[Bart]

A better reply would have been that AI is using me.

It took nearly 24 minutes and two replies ago to come up with that? AI would be faster if it was using you. I have to go shovel snow. God bless.

[Tdobson]

At least Sutton Hall is on the National Register of Historic Places so I think it has some protection.

I used to love walking past Sutton Hall with its Christmas decorations. It was beautiful. I always wished I had the opportunity to see the whole thing before they tore part of it down to build the library.

When I attended IUP, Sutton Hall still had an old elevator. Does anyone know if it is still around? I mean, old, it was open and had just like a gate that you closed.

[ssidiver]

Any truth to the rumblings I'm hearing that Commonwealth has just enough money in the coffers to make it to October of this year?

[Tdobson]

Any truth to the rumblings I'm hearing that Commonwealth has just enough money in the coffers to make it to October of this year?

Whoa? I hope that isn't true.

[Fightingscot82]

Any truth to the rumblings I'm hearing that Commonwealth has just enough money in the coffers to make it to October of this year?

That's a little overblown and oversimplified. Our schools run on a lot of periodic dumps of revenue: state appropriation is transferred quarterly and federal funding from grants, loans, and programs like FWS come twice a year (a very small amount in summer). That's about 80% of the revenue. But where this could have some truth behind it was the state budget fiasco. The state budget wasn't passed until mid-November, so PASSHE didn't get its money until December and the system raised tuition a smidge to help float the difference. Based on publicly shared info, as of June 30, Commonwealth had cash on hand to cover 72 days of operation. To compare, East Stroudsburg had cash on hand to cover 241 days of operation and Indiana had 95 days worth. Slippery Rock's the best with 298 days of cash on hand. Commonwealth's operating budget projects a -7.3% operating margin. That's negative. ESU is the best with a projected 3.3% margin.

Commonwealth, Cheyney, and Penn West are all in a significant financial strain as they're stuck in a cycle of fixed costs and continuous drops in revenue (tuition). A drop in this year's enrollment likely leads to a budget shortfall and triggers a smaller appropriation next year. But budgeting is also getting harder to predict. Several schools have experienced large swings in freshmen enrollment and the effects of inflation will continue to be a challenge. The largest expense (payroll) is largely fixed and easy to budget for with nearly every employee being under a 5-year union contract.

[Tdobson]

Yeah, with Mansfield they already don't have football, and you have to wonder how long they can keep it up. It's been a long time since they've been competitive in any of the major sports and it's hard to see them getting better. When I was going to school in the way-back of the '60s, they actually were one of the league's better basketball programs, but that went downhill to the extent that even Ship, hardly one of the league's better basketball programs prior to the Chris Fite era, has a 48-9 series edge over them since 1983. It's still a rather remote location up there, which is a turnoff for a lot of kids. A high school girl from our church some years ago was looking to major in music and took a trip up there to check it out. She noted that the big thing there seemed to be a trip to Wal-Mart and quickly crossed it off her list. Along with Clarion, their location is really a minus. Slippery Rock and IUP look pretty solid in the West, and West Chester is probably too big to fail in the East. I think Ship and Millersville can probably survive as long as they have good leadership. We'll see.

Question about Mansfield. Even when they had D2 football, did they have many winning seasons? I don't recall them having many during their active years, but I may just be to young to know.

[Ship69]

Question about Mansfield. Even when they had D2 football, did they have many winning seasons? I don't recall them having many during their active years, but I may just be to young to know.

They were not very good in football. They'd have an occasional winning or .500 season interspersed with some really bad seasons. Their football history actually went back a long way to the early 20th century. By the '80s and '90s they were pretty terrible. I think their last winning season was an 8-3 outlier in 2003, but after some horrible seasons the next couple of years they dropped D2 football.

I don't think we played Mansfield during my four years at Ship in the '60s. We only played eight- and nine-game seasons then, so you could go quite a while without playing someone. Also, I believe they were in the East and Ship was in the West at that time. It was quite a while ago. West Chester was the East power, and Clarion and Cal had some good teams when I was there. IUP and Slippery Rock were very so-so at the time, certainly nothing like they are now. But of course that was before we had a D2. It was either big-college or small-college ball back then.

[Fightingscot82]

They were not very good in football. They'd have an occasional winning or .500 season interspersed with some really bad seasons. Their football history actually went back a long way to the early 20th century. By the '80s and '90s they were pretty terrible. I think their last winning season was an 8-3 outlier in 2003, but after some horrible seasons the next couple of years they dropped D2 football.

I don't think we played Mansfield during my four years at Ship in the '60s. We only played eight- and nine-game seasons then, so you could go quite a while without playing someone. Also, I believe they were in the East and Ship was in the West at that time. It was quite a while ago. West Chester was the East power, and Clarion and Cal had some good teams when I was there. IUP and Slippery Rock were very so-so at the time, certainly nothing like they are now. But of course that was before we had a D2. It was either big-college or small-college ball back then.

Yep. The one outlier year was when Mansfield somehow landed Ernest "Poohbear" McNeal, a 5-7 RB transfer from Bowling Green who rushed for over 3,600 yards in three seasons. He transferred to IUP and was the favorite to replace Chris Morgan but ended up accumulating only 600 yards in 12 games.

Your memory is right about playing Mansfield. Since Ship was still considered a "West" team, they likely wouldn't have played them. As you said, the schedule was shorter but also I believe the league wasn't mandating or scheduling crossovers. I just did a quick glance at Edinboro's historical schedule and they played a grand total of three games in the 1960s against what were then PSAC East teams: Cheyney and East Stroudsburg in 1967 and just East Stroudsburg in 1968.