PASSHE Institutions Merging

[iupgroundhog]

There is another question there. Does it end up being one athletic fundraising arm for all three? What happens with endowed scholarships should a school give up a sport? Bloom received a gift of 10 million dollars this year, do they have to share? Students receive free admission to athletic events, I believe partly because some student fees are approved by student government for certain athletic related events, such as supporting coaches to travel to conferences. What happens now?

Another question, does state appropriation get cut equally among the three schools by the assigned school leadership? If Bloom has twice as many students as the other two combined, who gets the student paid tuition dollars? Do they get split among the three or do the dollars follow the student to the school they go too? (like Republicans have been pushing for elementary and h.s.)

I don't want to support another school's athletic program with my donation, like LHU wrestling. No offense. I think schools could lose the support of their alumni.

Seriously, though, I think it's premature to ask these questions. These questions might become relevant in the future, i.e. maybe in 2-3 years but right now I think the focus is on trying to "right-size" things at LHU and Mansfield and become more fiscally viable. They aren't going to be that integrated during the 2021-22 academic year, although the current scenario did develop really fast.

Plus, this model is going to hit all of the member schools so the 3 schools shouldn't feel too special.

[iupgroundhog]

There is another question there. Does it end up being one athletic fundraising arm for all three? What happens with endowed scholarships should a school give up a sport? Bloom received a gift of 10 million dollars this year, do they have to share? Students receive free admission to athletic events, I believe partly because some student fees are approved by student government for certain athletic related events, such as supporting coaches to travel to conferences. What happens now?

Another question, does state appropriation get cut equally among the three schools by the assigned school leadership? If Bloom has twice as many students as the other two combined, who gets the student paid tuition dollars? Do they get split among the three or do the dollars follow the student to the school they go too? (like Republicans have been pushing for elementary and h.s.)

I don't want to support another school's athletic program with my donation, like LHU wrestling. No offense. I think schools could lose the support of their alumni.

Don't worry. They know what they're doing.

[Bart]

You're probably correct. None of that stuff bothers me so long as LHU can stay in the top 25 of D1 wrestling. I would add an "lol" except that I'm serious.

There is another question there. Does it end up being one athletic fundraising arm for all three? What happens with endowed scholarships should a school give up a sport? Bloom received a gift of 10 million dollars this year, do they have to share? Students receive free admission to athletic events, I believe partly because some student fees are approved by student government for certain athletic related events, such as supporting coaches to travel to conferences. What happens now?

Another question, does state appropriation get cut equally among the three schools by the assigned school leadership? If Bloom has twice as many students as the other two combined, who gets the student paid tuition dollars? Do they get split among the three or do the dollars follow the student to the school they go too? (like Republicans have been pushing for elementary and h.s.)

I don't want to support another school's athletic program with my donation, like LHU wrestling. No offense. I think schools could lose the support of their alumni.

[iupgroundhog]

Well we certainly don't want to repeat the mistake IUP made back in 1983. Bloom would have to consider LHU and Mansfield in any decision they make going forward, which doesn't seem to help the campus community. There may be a unified leadership team, a single academic program array, a unified enrollment management strategy, a unified budget, etc.. It could mean a loss of freedom to run their own house.

There is a reason why LHU and Mansfield combined enrollment is about half of Bloom. Most students in the state go to a state school within 75 miles of their home. Bloom is the exception in this threesome, as there is a large population from Philadelphia and its neighboring counties. They didn't choose to take classes at LHU or Mansfield.

I understand Bloom has led consolidation efforts for years. BU's human resource department provides services to Mansfield already,. Bloom also provides procurement and purchasing services for a number of the other state schools. The more you do, the more is expected from you. I think it holds back and waters down Bloom.

You're probably correct. None of that stuff bothers me so long as LHU can stay in the top 25 of D1 wrestling. I would add an "lol" except that I'm serious.

[Bart]

Bart, I am surprised by your reaction against the Bloom/LHU/Mansfield alliance. You seem to believe that Bloom is getting screwed in the deal.

I see it as a perfectly sensible, even inevitable, progression given the PASSHE plan, overall. Furthermore, I don't see Bloom losing identity or status with it. Bloom might even gain status as a result if it is seen as being the dominant player among the three.

In this arrangement, Mansfield is losing a lot, LH is next, and Bloom so far isn't losing much.

But this kind of parochialism can't get in the way of the plan. Territorialism will only hold the system back.

In fact, this isn't anything new. The schools have been tied together as one system since 1983. When PASSHE was formed, it was IUP that lost a degree of distinctiveness. The rest did not, including Bloom. In fact, the rest of the system gained. We have lived with that for 37 years. I thought then, and I still do now, that IUP should have gone the state-related route. Of course, they didn't.

At this point, I think we have to look at what is good for the system as a whole. None of the schools can stand on their own, with the exception of perhaps West Chester.

They are making a big deal of the % enrollment declines for LHU and Mansfield. However, these are small numbers. The bigger problems are at bigger schools that have lost large percentages, albeit not as large percentage-wise as LHU and Mansfield. Think IUP, Ship, Cal, Boro, and Clarion.

The eastern schools like Bloom, Ville, and ESU may have only lost ~ 15% of enrollment, as compared to 25-35% elsewhere; however, they are not in good shape. It's likely another 15% is coming.

BTW, Kutztown's situation is similar to the western schools. Not sure what happened there.

Well we certainly don't want to repeat the mistake IUP made back in 1983. Bloom would have to consider LHU and Mansfield in any decision they make going forward, which doesn't seem to help the campus community. There may be a unified leadership team, a single academic program array, a unified enrollment management strategy, a unified budget, etc.. It could mean a loss of freedom to run their own house.

There is a reason why LHU and Mansfield combined enrollment is about half of Bloom. Most students in the state go to a state school within 75 miles of their home. Bloom is the exception in this threesome, as there is a large population from Philadelphia and its neighboring counties. They didn't choose to take classes at LHU or Mansfield.

I understand Bloom has led consolidation efforts for years. BU's human resource department provides services to Mansfield already,. Bloom also provides procurement and purchasing services for a number of the other state schools. The more you do, the more is expected from you. I think it holds back and waters down Bloom.

[iupgroundhog]

https://triblive.com/opinion/colin-m...e-predicament/

Bart, I am surprised by your reaction against the Bloom/LHU/Mansfield alliance. You seem to believe that Bloom is getting screwed in the deal.

I see it as a perfectly sensible, even inevitable, progression given the PASSHE plan, overall. Furthermore, I don't see Bloom losing identity or status with it. Bloom might even gain status as a result if it is seen as being the dominant player among the three.

In this arrangement, Mansfield is losing a lot, LH is next, and Bloom so far isn't losing much.

But this kind of parochialism can't get in the way of the plan. Territorialism will only hold the system back.

In fact, this isn't anything new. The schools have been tied together as one system since 1983. When PASSHE was formed, it was IUP that lost a degree of distinctiveness. The rest did not, including Bloom. In fact, the rest of the system gained. We have lived with that for 37 years. I thought then, and I still do now, that IUP should have gone the state-related route. Of course, they didn't.

At this point, I think we have to look at what is good for the system as a whole. None of the schools can stand on their own, with the exception of perhaps West Chester.

They are making a big deal of the % enrollment declines for LHU and Mansfield. However, these are small numbers. The bigger problems are at bigger schools that have lost large percentages, albeit not as large percentage-wise as LHU and Mansfield. Think IUP, Ship, Cal, Boro, and Clarion.

The eastern schools like Bloom, Ville, and ESU may have only lost ~ 15% of enrollment, as compared to 25-35% elsewhere; however, they are not in good shape. It's likely another 15% is coming.

BTW, Kutztown's situation is similar to the western schools. Not sure what happened there.

[Bart]

enrollment declines and very high costs per student

https://triblive.com/opinion/colin-m...e-predicament/

[IUPbigINDIANS]

The theory is that required courses in Physics for example can be taught to LHU students on-line from Bloom or Mansfield - covid validated the ability to do this. Or they may keep a physical science department, to teach physics, and Geology classes required by other majors. I wonder if anyone has floated the idea of PSU - Mansfield, or PSU LockHaven.? The latter would be popular with students because of the access to the football games. Throw in free tickets, and you'd probably double the enrollment.

I wouldn't doubt Pitt or PSU would love to take over a couple of our schools.

[Bart]

The math and history majors will end, not the departments. They still need to provide the courses needed to complete general education and other courses needed for other majors.

I didn't know LHU had a music major. That one is particularly expensive. Beyond classroom courses, you also need faculty to lead ensembles and teach private instrumental lessons. Plus, Mansfield has an excellent music program.

When they say they are going to have a moratorium on the activity of the departments, what else could it be a suspension of their activity. The merger is considering a single faculty and staff, so faculty may be moved to another university or teach online. Sounds like LHU students would take all their history and math general education courses on line. The other possibility thrown out there is to have seamless transitions between universities. Evidently now some classes aren't accepted at all the universities. One proposal is a student could end up attending 2 or more universities to get the degree they want.

[Fightingscot82]

LHU proposal:



https://www.lockhaven.com/news/local...al-challenges/

It is difficult to imagine a university without a history or math department. This isn't going to end well.

LHU union:



LHU president:


https://www.lockhaven.com/news/local...stees-meeting/

The math and history majors will end, not the departments. They still need to provide the courses needed to complete general education and other courses needed for other majors.

I didn't know LHU had a music major. That one is particularly expensive. Beyond classroom courses, you also need faculty to lead ensembles and teach private instrumental lessons. Plus, Mansfield has an excellent music program.

[IUPbigINDIANS]

100% of the people in jail have been found to have broken the law. You don't want to go to jail, don't break the law. Or cut a deal...See Ray Lewis.

Cops don't go to prison?? I refer you to this: https://www.ranker.com/list/ex-cops-...n/ranker-crime But I'm sure you will dismiss it as irrelevent and then call me a white police racist. Facts are just sooo very inconvenient!

Where's Ray's tuxedo? Lol. Poof. Gone forever.

[IUPNation]

100% of the people in jail have been found to have broken the law. You don't want to go to jail, don't break the law. Or cut a deal...See Ray Lewis.

Cops don't go to prison?? I refer you to this: https://www.ranker.com/list/ex-cops-...n/ranker-crime But I'm sure you will dismiss it as irrelevent and then call me a white police racist. Facts are just sooo very inconvenient!

Cops walk more than they get sent to jail.

[IUPbigINDIANS]

It's the end of the world as we know it
It's the end of the world as we know it
It's the end of the world as we know it
And I feel fine

Underrated song.

[Bart]

The end is near.

It's the end of the world as we know it
It's the end of the world as we know it
It's the end of the world as we know it
And I feel fine

[ironmaniup]

LHU proposal:



https://www.lockhaven.com/news/local...al-challenges/

It is difficult to imagine a university without a history or math department. This isn't going to end well.

LHU union:



LHU president:


https://www.lockhaven.com/news/local...stees-meeting/

The theory is that required courses in Physics for example can be taught to LHU students on-line from Bloom or Mansfield - covid validated the ability to do this. Or they may keep a physical science department, to teach physics, and Geology classes required by other majors. I wonder if anyone has floated the idea of PSU - Mansfield, or PSU LockHaven.? The latter would be popular with students because of the access to the football games. Throw in free tickets, and you'd probably double the enrollment.