GVSU classification thread

[Try II]

That's not what he said, at all. He said the GLIAC is a dying fruit on the tree of D2 Football.

[IH8SVSU]

Did they say what conference?

Ohio Valley Conference

[KleShreen]

He literally spelled it out:

"...Again, what type of picture am I going to paint: an attempt to try to entice..."

Dying Fruit = GLIAC Football
Tree = D-II Football

Seems very, very, very straightforward and obvious.

[BeachinLaker]

At the end of the day, I would say Division II has been a slowly dying brand for a while. UNA, UC-Davis, UNC, NDSU, UND, USD, SDSU, TAMU-Commerce, ACU, Tarleton, Incarnate Word, Dixie, Central Ark....All great schools that made for a nice division over the decades when combining GVSU, VSU, Ferris, Pitt, NWMSU, etc. Now it's just those bottom programs with the gaps being filled in by NAIA private schools. UWF will also eventually move up, as an on-campus stadium and a move has apparently been their plan for a while.

[ctrabs74]

The increased costs of travel would be offset I think. Having 5 home games, an FBS bodybag game, and increased TV revenue from the FCS tourney would be more than worth it IMO.

I could see GV making somewhat regular trips to Kalamazoo, Mt Pleasant and Ypsilanti in the future (forget about Ann Arbor or East Lansing, since the B1G has all but banned their teams from scheduling FCS opponents). Given everything GV has in place within the program right now, I don't think it's a reach to suggest they could at least be competitive in the OVC within five years.

[ctrabs74]

At the end of the day, I would say Division II has been a slowly dying brand for a while. UNA, UC-Davis, UNC, NDSU, UND, USD, SDSU, TAMU-Commerce, ACU, Tarleton, Incarnate Word, Dixie, Central Ark....All great schools that made for a nice division over the decades when combining GVSU, VSU, Ferris, Pitt, NWMSU, etc. Now it's just those bottom programs with the gaps being filled in by NAIA private schools. UWF will also eventually move up, as an on-campus stadium and a move has apparently been their plan for a while.

Just to clarify a few...

UNC = Northern Colorado (not North Carolina-Chapel Hill)
SDSU = South Dakota State (not San Diego State)

[ctrabs74]

I would say based on your comments and the fact that the AD says they are "looking into it " means its pretty much a done deal. OVC for football and Horizon for the other sports. The truly sad deal is that the GLIAC has NO leadership at all at this time and is not pursing something to keep it together. GVSU has the funds to make this move today. Not sure what the plans for the rest of the GLIAC is. Good luck finding enough games to even make the playoffs after next year. Stacking GVSU vs Ferris has the potential to be sure neither team get into the playoffs? Once again the Lanthorn student newspaper is making things fun for everyone at GVSU.

There is precedent for a current Horizon League school sponsoring football elsewhere: Robert Morris, a private school out near Pittsburgh International Airport in Moon Township, recently moved to the Horizon from the Northeast Conference, but their football team plays in the Big South (a move that has me scratching my head, to be honest), and Youngstown State (Missouri Valley Football).

The Horizon League for non-football sports makes the most sense as that's practically a bus league. If the OVC falls apart from a football standpoint, then maybe the MVFC takes Grand Valley in. A potential Eastern Division features Youngstown State, Indiana State, Illinois State, Southern Illinois, Western Illinois and GV, while a Western Division features the North/South Dakota schools, Northern Iowa and Missouri State.

Despite my earlier misgivings in my intial reply re: nature of the article, I can't help but think that if GV makes a move, then now might be the time to do it.

[BeachinLaker]

There is precedent for a current Horizon League school sponsoring football elsewhere: Robert Morris, a private school out near Pittsburgh International Airport in Moon Township, recently moved to the Horizon from the Northeast Conference, but their football team plays in the Big South (a move that has me scratching my head, to be honest), and Youngstown State (Missouri Valley Football).

The Horizon League for non-football sports makes the most sense as that's practically a bus league. If the OVC falls apart from a football standpoint, then maybe the MVFC takes Grand Valley in. A potential Eastern Division features Youngstown State, Indiana State, Illinois State, Southern Illinois, Western Illinois and GV, while a Western Division features the North/South Dakota schools, Northern Iowa and Missouri State.

Despite my earlier misgivings in my intial reply re: nature of the article, I can't help but think that if GV makes a move, then now might be the time to do it.

Agreed on the Horizon League being a good fit. I would love to see GVSU have a rivalry with Oakland in all sports not football. I have long thought of Oakland and Grand Valley as very similar schools with the main difference between the two being football and now a medical school.

[Brandon]

At the end of the day, I would say Division II has been a slowly dying brand for a while. UNA, UC-Davis, UNC, NDSU, UND, USD, SDSU, TAMU-Commerce, ACU, Tarleton, Incarnate Word, Dixie, Central Ark....All great schools that made for a nice division over the decades when combining GVSU, VSU, Ferris, Pitt, NWMSU, etc. Now it's just those bottom programs with the gaps being filled in by NAIA private schools. UWF will also eventually move up, as an on-campus stadium and a move has apparently been their plan for a while.

This is all about perspective.

There were people in 2000, when all those schools were still a part of the division, who were saying the same thing because schools like Troy and Southwest Texas were no longer in D2.

It's funny. Commerce had recent history, but has largely been irrelevant for over 20 years. South Dakota State and South Dakota had a good team or two, but SDSU never made the playoffs. Incarnate Word was never a thing nor was Dixie State.

UC-Davis, UNA, NDSU, UND, ACU, UCA, and UNC were the true losses.

[tip79]

Agreed on the Horizon League being a good fit. I would love to see GVSU have a rivalry with Oakland in all sports not football. I have long thought of Oakland and Grand Valley as very similar schools with the main difference between the two being football and now a medical school.

Oakland used to play basketball in the GLIAC. I'm not sure if they competed in other non-football sports.

[KleShreen]

This is all about perspective.

There were people in 2000, when all those schools were still a part of the division, who were saying the same thing because schools like Troy and Southwest Texas were no longer in D2.

It's funny. Commerce had recent history, but has largely been irrelevant for over 20 years. South Dakota State and South Dakota had a good team or two, but SDSU never made the playoffs. Incarnate Word was never a thing nor was Dixie State.

UC-Davis, UNA, NDSU, UND, ACU, UCA, and UNC were the true losses.

I would argue that SDSU and USD have had more football success at FCS than they ever did at D-II.

[Redwing]

Anyone find it odd that there's not one thread or post here about the upcoming game Saturday? Kind of reflects a touch about the GLIAC. And frankly, I don't blame the posters a bit.

Personally, I think the GLIAC leadership has dropped the ball with trying to keep schools from leaving and finding creative means to schedule future contests.

I don't have the solution, but from the outside looking in, I don't see where the GLIAC members have actively attempted to solidify the conference in football. I'm not a big a fan for the other sports, so maybe they are on solid ground and the current conf. members aren't as focused on football? For sure, something isn't lining up.

[ctrabs74]

Anyone find it odd that there's not one thread or post here about the upcoming game Saturday? Kind of reflects a touch about the GLIAC. And frankly, I don't blame the posters a bit.

Personally, I think the GLIAC leadership has dropped the ball with trying to keep schools from leaving and finding creative means to schedule future contests.

I don't have the solution, but from the outside looking in, I don't see where the GLIAC members have actively attempted to solidify the conference in football. I'm not a big a fan for the other sports, so maybe they are on solid ground and the current conf. members aren't as focused on football? For sure, something isn't lining up.

It makes you wonder if, in a few years, the remaining GLIAC football schools will simply be absorbed into the GLVC (see: GNAC/LSC football merger). If (or, if the rumors are to believed, when) Grand Valley moves up to FCS, that leaves six GLIAC football schools (Davenport, Ferris, Michigan Tech, Northern Michigan, Saginaw Valley and Wayne State) and eight GLVC football schools (UIndy, Lindenwood, McKendree, Missouri S&T, Quincy, Southwest Baptist, Truman State and William Jewell). You could easily form two divisions, keeping the seven of the eight GLVC schools in one division while moving UIndy into the "GLIAC Division" with six divisional games and three cross-division games with the ability to schedule two non-conference games.

That might be something that's going to be tough to swallow in Bay City, but at this point, the league's leadership - or lack thereof - is going to force more than a few hands here. And, keep in mind that GV's potential departure drops the GLIAC to nine members (including Lake Superior State, Purdue Northwest and Wisconsin-Parkside), which could put the league into some serious turmoil.

[ctrabs74]

Oakland used to play basketball in the GLIAC. I'm not sure if they competed in other non-football sports.

Oakland was a full D2/GLIAC member until the late 1990s when they joined the Summit League. The men's and women's swimming teams won D2 national titles in the 1990s (women five straight from 1990-1994, then three straight runner-up placements from 1995-1997; men in 1990 then four straight from 1994-1997).

[TheGreatestLaker2019]

I still think us going to FCS is a bad fit. I hope it's a transitory move and we can go to the MAC in a decade or so.