OT: Pitt

[IUPbigINDIANS]

Re: OT: Pitt

No doubt. Westwood is very posh. USC is nice if you're on campus. Pass the Collesium and good luck.

UCLA has a Hollywood vibe. The campus is incredible. Yet, USC gets more of the Hollywood buzz.

I travel a lot for work out there. I never have anything to do at night so I do the tourist crap.

I actually did the OJ tour my last trip in November. I paid $65 to ride around in a van and saw all the key sights. It was weird but kind of cool.

[IUP CRIMSON HAWKS]

Re: OT: Pitt

Yeah, get too far off of the USC campus and you are in Boyz N The Hood territory.

I say that O.J. did it. Pure and simple. I guess they tore down his Rockingham estate some time ago.

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[IUPbigINDIANS]

Re: OT: Pitt

Two starters out and Duke hangs 35 on Pitt.

Not surprising but I found the -18 line interesting. Seemed low.

At least Duke sold The Pete out. Silver lining, I guess.

[IUP CRIMSON HAWKS]

Re: OT: Pitt

I remember with Jamie Dixon at the helm that I wanted to dive head first down an elevator shaft.

With Baldo in charge I want to plummet into free fall off the Tower of Learning.

I'm not sure which one is better?

I just wish they would admit they completely blew the hire two years ago and fire Baldo and get it right this time. Should have gone for Enfield last time out.

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[IUP24]

Re: OT: Pitt

I remember with Jamie Dixon at the helm that I wanted to dive head first down an elevator shaft.

With Baldo in charge I want to plummet into free fall off the Tower of Learning.

I'm not sure which one is better?

I just wish they would admit they completely blew the hire two years ago and fire Baldo and get it right this time. Should have gone for Enfield last time out.

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I'm not quite sure what anybody really wanted Pitt to do, or what they want them to do now for that matter. Everybody wanted some young up and comer to take the reigns, but many of those guys weren't interested in that job. Coaches aren't stupid. They knew what was going on at Pitt and what Jamie Dixon was leaving the Panthers with. Virtually nothing. Regardless of how good Artis and Young were, it was well documented they were both selfish guys and problems in the Pitt locker room. On a great team, you can put up with that. On one that is looking at those guys as the key leaders, it doesn't work that way. A young guy on the come up wanted to come into a team that had something established, spend 2-3 years there, and head onto his next job. The Pitt rebuild wasn't a 2-3 year job. You weren't going to attract anybody other than somebody around the age of a Kevin Stallings. You just weren't. That's the reality.

Most smart basketball people will tell you that Jamie Dixon has much more to do with the current situation at Pitt than Kevin Stallings. He couldn't recruit in the ACC. Kevin Stallings has multiple freshman on that team that are better shooters and ball handlers than what Dixon ever recruited in his last 5 years. Marcus Carr is going to be a great player at Pitt. A great one. Excellent shooter, great ball handler, good IQ at the PG position. Is Stallings the best coach in the country? No. Is Stallings a guy that wants to be at Pitt for a very long time? Absolutely. And that's what they need.

If you think Stallings was a bad hire, just imagine the pool of candidates you will have to choose from after you fire him. Again, coaches aren't stupid. If a coach gets fired less than 2 full years into a complete rebuild, Pitt basketball will be treated as an untouchable job by most qualified individuals. Give this guy some time. The man is playing virtually all freshmen. What did you honestly really expect from this team? Be realistic.

[IUP24]

Re: OT: Pitt

Regarding the Jamie Dixon topic, I'll say this... He developed an excellent formula in the Big East. When it came to recruiting, creating a coaching/playing style, knowing and manipulating the officials, and scheduling out of conference games, he knew exactly what he was doing. It didn't work in the ACC.

When you're playing a conference that likes to play free, run and gun, up-tempo basketball, you can't coach every possession the way he wanted to. When he recruited the bangers to play with the bigs of the Big East, he could control every possession. When Duke, UNC, Louisville, etc., is running up and down the floor on you, you can't do that anymore. Dixon got exposed in the ACC for being two things, an average x's and o's coach that couldn't adjust and a poor recruiter. Those are facts.

He was the new kid on the block in a lot of ways... He couldn't walk into living rooms in the south and be taken seriously among the heavyweight coaches in the conference. He didn't get the calls he did in the Big East. Let's face it, which way are officials going to bend... Jamie Dixon? Or Coach K, Roy Williams, etc.? And when he couldn't get the necessary recruits in the areas he had to recruit, he had far less talent than the other teams in the ACC. And when it came to x's and o's, he got slaughtered.

I always chuckle about the assumption that Dixon was this incredible coach with an unbreakable legacy at Pitt. For as great as people presume him to be, what banners did he hang in the rafters at The Peterson Events Center? Big East regular season title or two? Big East tournament championship or two? Come on. Great coaches win March, when it matters, because they can prepare their teams to play multiple games against multiple teams playing different styles in short turnaround times. Dixon failed miserably in that regard. If it wasn't against a half-court slugfest, he was outcoached in March considerably.

The high water mark for Pitt basketball will of course be that 2009 team. Great team. Fantastic talent. I won't ever forget the regular season finale. Pitt was #4 in the country and they hosted #1 UCONN. Pitt won that game in front of a raucous crowd at The Pete. That was Pitt's second win over UCONN that year while they were ranked #1. That win clinched the Big East regular season title. The image I'll always have is Sam Young getting a steal in the closing minutes and throwing down a breakaway dunk that iced the game. Those were good days.

People say that Pitt won't ever reach that level again. I'm one of those. That will likely forever be the high water mark of that program. Stallings more than likely will not get them to a Final Four, or even to an Elite 8. But, I can assuredly say that they weren't going to get there with Dixon either.

[IUPbigINDIANS]

Re: OT: Pitt

Jamie to the ACC was Kevin Reynolds to the MEC.

[IUP CRIMSON HAWKS]

Re: OT: Pitt

IUP24-- Those are actually some excellent thoughts on the matter to be honest. I don't at all disagree with you. I was glad when they got rid of Dixon and still do think they could have taken the program in a more positive direction with a more inspired hire than Stullings. I thought it a morose hire.

I do believe that Pitt could have a much-better athletic program. But the reality is that they don't seem to be able to get over the hump with much of anything in football and MBB. It's a bit maddening. They once upon a time did have extremely nationally competitive programs. 1976 national champs and a football team that was at the top of the polls consistently in the early 1980s with a bevy of NFL number one draft picks. I think the 1987-88 MBB team was my favorite to be honest. Charles Smith, Jerome Lane, Sean Miller, et al were just plain fun to watch.

Hopefully there are better days ahead. What do you think of the lady AD? Is she a good person for this job?

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[IUP24]

[IUPbigINDIANS]

Re: OT: Pitt

Football is a tough sell at Pitt. From a fan view ... it's just boring. There's 'zero' college atmosphere. There's very little buzz unless a big opponent visits.

Winning cures all. But, how do you win at Pitt? Year after year, the few 'blue chips' produced in Western PA are on the first flight out -- either to Creepy Valley, Columbus, Ann Arbor or South Bend. WVU even snags some of them. Pitt gets the occasional guy to stay home, but largely they get the leftovers. Some turn in to stars but not enough. Pitt is a great academic school. Great campus ... far from it.

I don't know how much more money you can pump in to the football program. They share a practice facility with an NFL team. That's cool in itself. Despite the delusional ploys ... there is never going to be a stadium built in Oakland. Side note for those who didn't get to experience old Pitt Stadium ... it was dump. And, ironically, usually half empty. On the rare occasion it was filled up ... the shear joy of 45,000 extra people trying to drive through Oakland (and park) was a fantastic experience.

Do I think Pitt could ever be a football power? No. Not at all. But, I do think they could build a consistent 8-3 type of program (kind of like they had under Walt and Wanny ... oh, wait, ... yeah ....).

Basketball, on the other hand, is the one Pitt has the better chance of becoming a consistent power (much like earlier this century). The Pete isn't the selling point it once was ... 'The Pete' type arena's began popping up all over. But, unlike football, basketball has proved to be a draw here -- so long as you win. Pitt Basketball was the toughest ticket in Pittsburgh for years. Literally. The Pete had a run there from say, 2007-2011 as being probably one of the hardest venues for visitors to win in ... in the whole country. That luster is long gone now but could return quickly. Pitt doesn't need to land so many stud recruits in basketball compared to football. You only have to convince a few comparatively.

Do you ever feel like this conversation regarding Pitt goes on and on and on and ... it's like making four left turns all day long?

[IUP CRIMSON HAWKS]

Re: OT: Pitt

Football is a tough sell at Pitt. From a fan view ... it's just boring. There's 'zero' college atmosphere. There's very little buzz unless a big opponent visits.

Winning cures all. But, how do you win at Pitt? Year after year, the few 'blue chips' produced in Western PA are on the first flight out -- either to Creepy Valley, Columbus, Ann Arbor or South Bend. WVU even snags some of them. Pitt gets the occasional guy to stay home, but largely they get the leftovers. Some turn in to stars but not enough. Pitt is a great academic school. Great campus ... far from it.

I don't know how much more money you can pump in to the football program. They share a practice facility with an NFL team. That's cool in itself. Despite the delusional ploys ... there is never going to be a stadium built in Oakland. Side note for those who didn't get to experience old Pitt Stadium ... it was dump. And, ironically, usually half empty. On the rare occasion it was filled up ... the shear joy of 45,000 extra people trying to drive through Oakland (and park) was a fantastic experience.

Do I think Pitt could ever be a football power? No. Not at all. But, I do think they could build a consistent 8-3 type of program (kind of like they had under Walt and Wanny ... oh, wait, ... yeah ....).

Basketball, on the other hand, is the one Pitt has the better chance of becoming a consistent power (much like earlier this century). The Pete isn't the selling point it once was ... 'The Pete' type arena's began popping up all over. But, unlike football, basketball has proved to be a draw here -- so long as you win. Pitt Basketball was the toughest ticket in Pittsburgh for years. Literally. The Pete had a run there from say, 2007-2011 as being probably one of the hardest venues for visitors to win in ... in the whole country. That luster is long gone now but could return quickly. Pitt doesn't need to land so many stud recruits in basketball compared to football. You only have to convince a few comparatively.

Do you ever feel like this conversation regarding Pitt goes on and on and on and ... it's like making four left turns all day long?

I actually do think that they could, at least in theory, recapture their past glory days of being a nationally relevant football program. How exactly that happens though is completely beyond my capability of comprehension. I guess the formula could be as simple as just getting more money into the program, great university leadership towards athletics, a great coach and landing great football players. But that is true of any program I suppose.

But LOL, yeah the discussion on this matter is a lot like making four left turns all day long or expecting the folks of the old show Wagon Train to actually come out somewhere. They just kept going and going. So it goes for followers of Pitt football and men's hoops.

And goodness I really hate that navy blue the hoops team wears. I just wish Pitt would once and for all get back to the blue and gold colors of their glory days of years gone by. It's just a mess down there every which way. Just when you think things are on the upswing about something you know that the bottom will fall right out rather quickly. It doesn't take long.

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[IUPbigINDIANS]

Re: OT: Pitt

Watched the Pitt game at Syracuse last night. It wasn't pretty (59-45 loss).

I kept thinking while watching it that Lock Haven's Amir Hinton and Shippensburg's Dustin Sleva would be Pitt's two best players -- starters from Day 1 this year. Cobo would also log major minutes.

Pitt wouldn't win the D2 title this year.

[Fightingscot82]

Re: OT: Pitt

I actually do think that they could, at least in theory, recapture their past glory days of being a nationally relevant football program. How exactly that happens though is completely beyond my capability of comprehension. I guess the formula could be as simple as just getting more money into the program, great university leadership towards athletics, a great coach and landing great football players. But that is true of any program I suppose.

But LOL, yeah the discussion on this matter is a lot like making four left turns all day long or expecting the folks of the old show Wagon Train to actually come out somewhere. They just kept going and going. So it goes for followers of Pitt football and men's hoops.

And goodness I really hate that navy blue the hoops team wears. I just wish Pitt would once and for all get back to the blue and gold colors of their glory days of years gone by. It's just a mess down there every which way. Just when you think things are on the upswing about something you know that the bottom will fall right out rather quickly. It doesn't take long.

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Maybe. Remember that their only national championships were awarded by the press. No playoff or conference championship wins on their resume. With today's SEC worshipping press they'd be no more respected than Boise State, TCU, or Central Florida.

The roadblock with Walt Harris was Miami. Now it's Clemson and Miami and eventually Florida State.

I think the only way for Pitt football to regain national prominence they just need to win. I agree that consistent 8-4 should be the goal. With some luck they can go 9-3 or 10-2. But even at 11-1 they'd probably need to ditch the FCS games plus do the leg work to make WVU and Penn State their non conference schedule to boost their SOS enough to be in the CFP conversation.

[IUP CRIMSON HAWKS]

Re: OT: Pitt

Watched the Pitt game at Syracuse last night. It wasn't pretty (59-45 loss).

I kept thinking while watching it that Lock Haven's Amir Hinton and Shippensburg's Dustin Sleva would be Pitt's two best players -- starters from Day 1 this year. Cobo would also log major minutes.

Pitt wouldn't win the D2 title this year.

They really needed to get the hire right when they ditched Dixon a few years ago. They blew it. Isn't Baldo pretty old already? They needed to get a young up and comer. Course, the second that he had any success at all he would most likely bolt Pitt.

I'm surprised that nobody down at the Zoo has not taken a plunge off of a high city bridge yet over this stuff.

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[IUP CRIMSON HAWKS]

Re: OT: Pitt

Maybe. Remember that their only national championships were awarded by the press. No playoff or conference championship wins on their resume. With today's SEC worshipping press they'd be no more respected than Boise State, TCU, or Central Florida.

The roadblock with Walt Harris was Miami. Now it's Clemson and Miami and eventually Florida State.

I think the only way for Pitt football to regain national prominence they just need to win. I agree that consistent 8-4 should be the goal. With some luck they can go 9-3 or 10-2. But even at 11-1 they'd probably need to ditch the FCS games plus do the leg work to make WVU and Penn State their non conference schedule to boost their SOS enough to be in the CFP conversation.

But Pitt was an independent the last time they won a national title in 1976. No idea about the 1937 championship team. Penn State and Notre Dame also won titles as independents.


Pitt has actually beaten both Clemson and Miami in recent years. Great signature wins. They need to concentrate their efforts better on the "middle of the pack" ACC teams that dot their schedule. It wouldn't hurt to do much better in their so-called creampuff games at the beginning of the season. They tend to get embarrassed far too often in those.

The ACC is not a conference to sneeze at nationally speaking. Florida State and Clemson both won national titles in recent years to legitimize it. It's not just about the SEC all the time to be considered relevant.

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