Atlantic Region 2023 (Men's)

[IUPbigINDIANS]

After a wild weekend, here's where everyone stands according to "Performance Indicator" rankings:

1. Gannon
2. Cal
3. ESU
4. Charleston
5. Millersville
6. Concord
7. WLU
8. WV State
9. IUP
10. Lock Haven
11. Fairmont
12. Winston-Salem

Lots of basketball yet to be played (including some head-to-heads among the top 10). But, man, that's a power-packed "bubble" in the 7-8-9 slots!

And, consider your No. 12 is already locked in at No. 8 (or some team from the CIAA).

[Scrub]

And, consider your No. 12 is already locked in at No. 8 (or some team from the CIAA).

Yup. That was precisely why I went 12 deep in the list--wanted to get to the first CIAA team to indicate the fact that the 11 in front of them are vying for 7 slots. CIAA will get the 8 seed in the Region regardless.

[TheMadLibs]

Will be a crazy conference playoff time. Anyone unexpected at the end to win is going to be breaking hearts.

[IUPbigINDIANS]

Will be a crazy conference playoff time. Anyone unexpected at the end to win is going to be breaking hearts.

That's the toughest part of every season. One team wins the last game of the season. The rest all finish with a sour taste.

[Scrub]

That's the toughest part of every season. One team wins the last game of the season. The rest all finish with a sour taste.

Sourest for those of us lucky to be fans of teams with actual expectations. I suspect there isn't much sourness for the fans of, say, WV Wesleyan. Just business as usual.

[TheMadLibs]

I really wish d2 could reevaluate and assess a different playoff model, at least for basketball. Traveling to Glenville is no cheaper for Gannon than going to Ashland or Northwood, or Hillsdale. And less gd treacherous 😂

I was looking at old brackets from the 80s remembering how they used to pull in teams from outside regions, that regions were initial playoffs of 4 and then top two met up. Teams like WLU, ESU, IUP have deserved better pathways than what the system allows, and makes for odd perception on depth and strength when you're isolating teams to regional wins, stats, etc.

Watched a few NSIC games with insomnia the other night including MSU Mankato on the road at USF. Maybe a fluke game but comparing that to what you see right now in the region is night and day. It's a shame there's not a chance like d1 to have 6 atlantic region teams in the sweet 16.

[IUPHawks24]

I really wish d2 could reevaluate and assess a different playoff model, at least for basketball. Traveling to Glenville is no cheaper for Gannon than going to Ashland or Northwood, or Hillsdale. And less gd treacherous 😂

I was looking at old brackets from the 80s remembering how they used to pull in teams from outside regions, that regions were initial playoffs of 4 and then top two met up. Teams like WLU, ESU, IUP have deserved better pathways than what the system allows, and makes for odd perception on depth and strength when you're isolating teams to regional wins, stats, etc.

Watched a few NSIC games with insomnia the other night including MSU Mankato on the road at USF. Maybe a fluke game but comparing that to what you see right now in the region is night and day. It's a shame there's not a chance like d1 to have 6 atlantic region teams in the sweet 16.

Are you saying the PSAC/MEC is better than the NSIC? Or the other way around?

[TheMadLibs]

I thought nsic was weak comparatively in watching a supposed 2nd nationally ranked team.

There's a cliff in both PSAC and MEC, but that cliff drops off much later than what I watched Saturday night

[Ship69]

Sourest for those of us lucky to be fans of teams with actual expectations. I suspect there isn't much sourness for the fans of, say, WV Wesleyan. Just business as usual.

Watching the current season at Ship has been plenty sour after multiple 20-win seasons. Enjoy the playoffs when your team qualifies.

[IUPHawks24]

I thought nsic was weak comparatively in watching a supposed 2nd nationally ranked team.

There's a cliff in both PSAC and MEC, but that cliff drops off much later than what I watched Saturday night

Interesting. Traditionally, that’s the strongest region in the country (MIAA and NSIC). But I haven’t watched any games this year from that region to have a feel for what this year is like. The bottom of the PSAC Is horrifically bad, so it’s hard for me to believe the NSIC is worse. From what I’ve seen, the East Region is way stronger in the middle than the Atlantic this year.

Personally, I think the Atlantic is down substantially from the last couple years. But the 3 strongest programs of the last 5 years (West Liberty, IUP and Mercyhurst) are all down compared to what they have been, especially IUP and Mercyhurst. So maybe it makes sense.

[IUPbigINDIANS]

Watching the current season at Ship has been plenty sour after multiple 20-win seasons. Enjoy the playoffs when your team qualifies.

I've seen some real strange stuff happen in that conference tournament. The best teams often don't win it.

Who can get hot for a few days?

In the early 2000s I saw Cal blast IUP twice in the regular season ... only for IUP to blast them in Round 2 of the tournament at Hammer Hall.

There's certainly more pressure on the top seeds. The most dangerous team to get stuck with is that fairly good team that's simply playing with house money.

IUP could be a dangerous team in that setting if you get Bryce Radford on one of his 'in the zone' nights. Same with West Chester.

[Ship69]

I've seen some real strange stuff happen in that conference tournament. The best teams often don't win it.

Who can get hot for a few days?

In the early 2000s I saw Cal blast IUP twice in the regular season ... only for IUP to blast them in Round 2 of the tournament at Hammer Hall.

There's certainly more pressure on the top seeds. The most dangerous team to get stuck with is that fairly good team that's simply playing with house money.

IUP could be a dangerous team in that setting if you get Bryce Radford on one of his 'in the zone' nights. Same with West Chester.

Lock Haven is a sleeper this year. They've shown the ability to contend with East Stroud the past couple of seasons.

[IUPbigINDIANS]

Interesting. Traditionally, that’s the strongest region in the country (MIAA and NSIC). But I haven’t watched any games this year from that region to have a feel for what this year is like. The bottom of the PSAC Is horrifically bad, so it’s hard for me to believe the NSIC is worse. From what I’ve seen, the East Region is way stronger in the middle than the Atlantic this year.

Personally, I think the Atlantic is down substantially from the last couple years. But the 3 strongest programs of the last 5 years (West Liberty, IUP and Mercyhurst) are all down compared to what they have been, especially IUP and Mercyhurst. So maybe it makes sense.

I don't think it's down that much. Those three may be but Cal and Gannon are WAY up. IUP and WL still have pretty good records.


IUP is certainly down by it's standards but as of today is only one loss behind West Liberty. Mercyhurst is certainly having a very odd year.

That said, I have serious doubts IUP wins in the MAC tomorrow night. That's been a house of horrors for Joe over the years. The Lakers got rattled at the KCAC. That won't happen in Erie.

IUP hasn't had a 'bad' loss yet. The teams they've lost to have an incredible combined record. The flip side of the argument is IUP is 1-6 against the best teams it has played this year. Stats are facts.

If Joe could turn back time ... this team wasn't ready for St. Thomas Aquinas and Walsh so early in the season. They'd have been much better off with two cupcakes there. He even said so himself in an interview.


All of that said, I suspect they get hammered Saturday by Gannon and will lose at Cal late in the year. The rest, they can win. With (6) losses they have no room for error in the other games.

If they win out - aside from those two, that will be 8 losses. They can win Round 1 of the PSACs but will likely lose in Rd 2 against either Cal or Gannon. That would be 9 losses. Definitely on the bubble at that stage.

[IUPHawks24]

I don't think it's down that much. Those three may be but Cal and Gannon are WAY up. IUP and WL still have pretty good records.


IUP is certainly down by it's standards but as of today is only one loss behind West Liberty. Mercyhurst is certainly having a very odd year.

That said, I have serious doubts IUP wins in the MAC tomorrow night. That's been a house of horrors for Joe over the years. The Lakers got rattled at the KCAC. That won't happen in Erie.

IUP hasn't had a 'bad' loss yet. The teams they've lost to have an incredible combined record. The flip side of the argument is IUP is 1-6 against the best teams it has played this year. Stats are facts.

If Joe could turn back time ... this team wasn't ready for St. Thomas Aquinas and Walsh so early in the season. They'd have been much better off with two cupcakes there. He even said so himself in an interview.


All of that said, I suspect they get hammered Saturday by Gannon and will lose at Cal late in the year. The rest, they can win. With (6) losses they have no room for error in the other games.

If they win out - aside from those two, that will be 8 losses. They can win Round 1 of the PSACs but will likely lose in Rd 2 against either Cal or Gannon. That would be 9 losses. Definitely on the bubble at that stage.

for me it's not just the records, it's the "eye test", (even though that can be deceptive). Last three years of a full regional:

18-19 Mercyhurst loses by 4 to the best Division II team I've ever seen in the Elite Eight
21-22 IUP advances to the Final Four
22-23 West Liberty loses in National Championship

Single game results can be deceptive, but IUP got smacked at home by St Thomas Aquinas with Dallis, West Liberty got beat pretty good by a borderline NCAA team in Dominican. If those are two mid level NCAA teams in the region this year, I don't think the region is as strong as it's been.

Gannon is difficult to figure out, because their nonconference schedule was awful, but when I watch them play I just don't see an Elite Eight level roster relative to what that usually looks like in this region. But, maybe that's a testament to Fee and his system.

[Scrub]

Gannon is difficult to figure out, because their nonconference schedule was awful, but when I watch them play I just don't see an Elite Eight level roster relative to what that usually looks like in this region. But, maybe that's a testament to Fee and his system.

Let's not forget that Fee's edition of Gannon is also enjoying their honeymoon phase in the conference. The first handful of years (maybe 6 years or so) of Crutch's implementation of the system, the rest of the league was baffled. They didn't know how to respond to it, how to defend it, or even how to recruit the right kinds of guys to run with it. That tide very much turned after that initial honeymoon phase. The MEC has adjusted and WLU came back to the pack in the conference just a bit, so to speak. Gannon is enjoying their first run of the system through a conference that hasn't seen it twice a year for 6 years. Sure, Danny knows the system well (and therefore performed pretty well against Gannon this year). Yes, IUP/Mercy/ESU/etc. have seen it a time or two in the Regional. But I would bet that Gannon's in-conference record is a touch inflated this year due to the newness of the thing. Give it a few years and they'll come back to the pack. Remember that WLU used to go, like, 22-1 in the regular season for a good run of years. Now, you can count on 3-4 conference losses out of WLU every year. The league has adjusted a bit.

All of that is to say that Gannon's record might look a little better than the boots-on-the-ground team actually is due to the newness factor. Take nothing away from what they've accomplished. They absolutely deserve to host (if the season ended today) and will be a formidable opponent in the postseason for anyone they match up with. And no one will be surprised if they represent the Atlantic in the Elite 8. But the regional field might be more wide open than it looks on paper.