OT: D1

[Fightingscot82]

Lincoln Park is hilarious. It's insanity.

WPIAL basketball star Elijah Minnie lived in Monessen, 3 counties or 75 miles away from Midland. There's NO WAY IN HELL he made that drive twice each day. They also were a financial racket for those running it. I believe several were indicted for misspending the money coming in.

[IUPbigINDIANS]

What sucks about the new 6-level system is that A level football is essentially very small, financially modest communities...and small wealthier private schools. The school district next to mine plays A and the school district in financial crisis, still has a grass football field, and a couple years ago didn't know if they could find the money to replace the football field lights. My wife's hometown has maybe 35 kids a grade anymore (and shrinking) so its only a matter of time they have to co-op for football like some of the smaller schools in that conference.

Philadelphia's location makes it really easy to take kids from Delaware and New Jersey because people live in those places and work in greater Philly. My wife's cousin lives in Chadds Ford but her kids went to a private boys school in Delaware because its a lacrosse magnet. Some smaller area private schools like Bishop McDevitt in Harrisburg or Cathedral Prep in Erie is that they are one of the very few private school options in the region making them an easy way to build and attract talented kids. Rather than separate public & private, I think its VERY fair to say only PA resident students can compete for a state championship. Sure, win your conference with all the DE & NJ kids you want, but they can't play in the PIAA playoffs. This also prevents a Kennedy Catholic from bringing in every 7 foot teen they can find in eastern Europe.

My issue with Imhotep is that they're a charter school pulling from the entire city. They are a de facto All Star Team for the School District of Philadelphia outsourced to the Imhotep board. No cost barrier for a charter school vs. St. Josephs or Father Judge. Doesn't anyone find it odd that out of 190,000 students and 57 high schools, it looks like NOT ONE public high school from Philadelphia has ever played in the PIAA championship game? (Please correct me if I'm wrong). I had the same problem with Lincoln Park Performing Arts Charter High School operating out of beyond depressed Midland, PA (so poor they closed the high school & kids go to high school in Ohio), who was pulling kids from as far as a 2 hour drive to play basketball. And of the ones I personally met, there's NO WAY in hell they were doing any performing arts not called basketball. My dog was smarter. Imagine kids from Bucks County attending a specific charter school in Chester, PA.

Lincoln Park is hilarious. It's insanity.

[iupgroundhog]

I don't think that this is even remotely true whatsoever. Not even in the slightest.

I think any gripe you hear about the current landscape of anything related to high school sports in Pennsylvania is that the decision to ultimately restructure everything to six classifications hurt the competitive balance of the WPIAL and kind of ruined the "mystique" of the league in general. It watered everything down significantly. You pretty much had an equal number of highly competitive athletic programs, for all sports, in each of the four classifications. The move to six just wasn't good for the WPIAL. It didn't impact areas like District 6 or District 5 given that most of those schools were all going to remain classified as A or AA. But when you have just a handful of 6A schools and schools who are jumping back and forth between AAA, Quad A, and 5A every reclassification cycle, no structure makes sense in that league. People complain about travel and distance between schools all the time. Those issues never existed prior to the move to 6 classifications.

I don't believe for a second that was the driver behind going to six classifications, but I think many across the state, especially east of Harrisburg, were happy to put out a proposal that was likely going to negatively impact what everyone else likes to call District 7.

There's no other part of Pennsylvania where winning your district is vastly more important than winning a state championship. Most kids didn't grow up in the Pittsburgh area dreaming of playing at Hershey in December, (or now, Cumberland Valley). Every kid grew up wanting to play at Three Rivers Stadium or Heinz Field on Black Friday for a shot to win the WPIAL title.

That's an interesting rationalization.

[Fightingscot82]

What sucks about the new 6-level system is that A level football is essentially very small, financially modest communities...and small wealthier private schools. The school district next to mine plays A and the school district in financial crisis, still has a grass football field, and a couple years ago didn't know if they could find the money to replace the football field lights. My wife's hometown has maybe 35 kids a grade anymore (and shrinking) so its only a matter of time they have to co-op for football like some of the smaller schools in that conference.

Philadelphia's location makes it really easy to take kids from Delaware and New Jersey because people live in those places and work in greater Philly. My wife's cousin lives in Chadds Ford but her kids went to a private boys school in Delaware because its a lacrosse magnet. Some smaller area private schools like Bishop McDevitt in Harrisburg or Cathedral Prep in Erie is that they are one of the very few private school options in the region making them an easy way to build and attract talented kids. Rather than separate public & private, I think its VERY fair to say only PA resident students can compete for a state championship. Sure, win your conference with all the DE & NJ kids you want, but they can't play in the PIAA playoffs. This also prevents a Kennedy Catholic from bringing in every 7 foot teen they can find in eastern Europe.

My issue with Imhotep is that they're a charter school pulling from the entire city. They are a de facto All Star Team for the School District of Philadelphia outsourced to the Imhotep board. No cost barrier for a charter school vs. St. Josephs or Father Judge. Doesn't anyone find it odd that out of 190,000 students and 57 high schools, it looks like NOT ONE public high school from Philadelphia has ever played in the PIAA championship game? (Please correct me if I'm wrong). I had the same problem with Lincoln Park Performing Arts Charter High School operating out of beyond depressed Midland, PA (so poor they closed the high school & kids go to high school in Ohio), who was pulling kids from as far as a 2 hour drive to play basketball. And of the ones I personally met, there's NO WAY in hell they were doing any performing arts not called basketball. My dog was smarter. Imagine kids from Bucks County attending a specific charter school in Chester, PA.

[IUP24]

I think the fact schools from the City of Philadelphia are dominating is the problem. The Yinzers can't stand the fact the WPIAL isn't everything and winning every title.

I don't think that this is even remotely true whatsoever. Not even in the slightest.

I think any gripe you hear about the current landscape of anything related to high school sports in Pennsylvania is that the decision to ultimately restructure everything to six classifications hurt the competitive balance of the WPIAL and kind of ruined the "mystique" of the league in general. It watered everything down significantly. You pretty much had an equal number of highly competitive athletic programs, for all sports, in each of the four classifications. The move to six just wasn't good for the WPIAL. It didn't impact areas like District 6 or District 5 given that most of those schools were all going to remain classified as A or AA. But when you have just a handful of 6A schools and schools who are jumping back and forth between AAA, Quad A, and 5A every reclassification cycle, no structure makes sense in that league. People complain about travel and distance between schools all the time. Those issues never existed prior to the move to 6 classifications.

I don't believe for a second that was the driver behind going to six classifications, but I think many across the state, especially east of Harrisburg, were happy to put out a proposal that was likely going to negatively impact what everyone else likes to call District 7.

There's no other part of Pennsylvania where winning your district is vastly more important than winning a state championship. Most kids didn't grow up in the Pittsburgh area dreaming of playing at Hershey in December, (or now, Cumberland Valley). Every kid grew up wanting to play at Three Rivers Stadium or Heinz Field on Black Friday for a shot to win the WPIAL title.

[IUP24]

Oh, come on. It doesn’t matter what end of the state these private schools are located. NONE of them should be competing in the championships with private schools and any suggestion that they should be, and that it’s an even playing field, is ridiculous.

Yeah, I agree completely. I think it's important to recognize that there's differences in how some of these schools operate within athletics. Not all schools are recruiting or poaching kids on a national level. St. Joe's should be competing against the likes of IMG Academy. The manner in which they operate isn't even necessarily on the same playing field as say, Central Catholic, who is just plucking the best kids from surrounding areas. But that's neither here nor there.

[Fightingscot82]

Fair point. They have a lot of kids who want to go there (and commute an hour each way to do so). Same with Pine-Richland.

It always makes me chuckle when a kid from NA or P-R gets recruited by a PSAC school and takes a visit. Their stadiums and ammenities are 100x nicer than any PSAC school. They are going from modern everything to an all-inclusive tour of the 1970s.

They're very attractive suburbs. Fox Chapel and Sewickley are wealthier but in the old money way; Mt. Lebanon and Upper St Clair are probably similarly attractive but you're stuck in the South Hills. NA and PR don't have a tunnel or a commute with lights into the city, PR is also along Route 8 if someone needs that, and as Cranberry/Mars becomes a workplace you're also right there. 20 minutes from the Wexford exit to downtown Pittsburgh without ever dealing with tunnel traffic, 28 construction, or Ohio River Boulevard lights; 20-25 minutes to the airport. There are some other exurbs also with newer developments of big houses but again, they're also in less desirable school districts or you have to take 376, 28, or 65 into the city.

[IUPbigINDIANS]

North Allegheny doesn't recruit for the same reason models aren't on dating apps.

Fair point. They have a lot of kids who want to go there (and commute an hour each way to do so). Same with Pine-Richland.

It always makes me chuckle when a kid from NA or P-R gets recruited by a PSAC school and takes a visit. Their stadiums and ammenities are 100x nicer than any PSAC school. They are going from modern everything to an all-inclusive tour of the 1970s.

[Fightingscot82]

Literally one private school won a state title this year. Imothep is a public charter school.

There were other Catholic schools in the brackets that were defeated by public high schools.

Obviously North Allegheny didn’t get out recruited by Yinzerburgh Central Catholic.

North Allegheny doesn't recruit for the same reason models aren't on dating apps.

[EyeoftheHawk]

So? If you exclude schools than the ones included really aren't "State Champions"

It is why when they had playoffs and the Philadelphia Public and Catholic Leagues were not included...those schools that won in those years were not necessarily the best teams in the Commonwealth.

I think the fact schools from the City of Philadelphia are dominating is the problem. The Yinzers can't stand the fact the WPIAL isn't everything and winning every title.

Oh, come on. It doesn’t matter what end of the state these private schools are located. NONE of them should be competing in the championships with private schools and any suggestion that they should be, and that it’s an even playing field, is ridiculous.

[Bart]

The transfer portal for high school. Colleges have finally caught up, but it still doesn't help Gannon and Mercyhurst win the league.

[IUPNation]

Oh Please. St. Joseph's Prep has now won six of the last eight big-school titles. Yeah, some in the brackets got beat this year, but a lot of them were in the brackets through expert recruiting practices. Bishop McDevitt in my district a few years back actually recruited a kid from my high school alma mater, which is several districts away and across the Susquehanna River from McDevitt. There was another Catholic high school located in the kid's public school district, so I'm sure he went to McDevitt for the Catholic education. Kid was a halfback who ended up playing extensively at Penn State — not bad. I know several HS athletic directors who'd be glad to tell you what's been done in their districts.

So? If you exclude schools than the ones included really aren't "State Champions"

It is why when they had playoffs and the Philadelphia Public and Catholic Leagues were not included...those schools that won in those years were not necessarily the best teams in the Commonwealth.

I think the fact schools from the City of Philadelphia are dominating is the problem. The Yinzers can't stand the fact the WPIAL isn't everything and winning every title.

[Ship69]

Literally one private school won a state title this year. Imothep is a public charter school.

There were other Catholic schools in the brackets that were defeated by public high schools.

Obviously North Allegheny didn’t get out recruited by Yinzerburgh Central Catholic.

Oh Please. St. Joseph's Prep has now won six of the last eight big-school titles. Yeah, some in the brackets got beat this year, but a lot of them were in the brackets through expert recruiting practices. Bishop McDevitt in my district a few years back actually recruited a kid from my high school alma mater, which is several districts away and across the Susquehanna River from McDevitt. There was another Catholic high school located in the kid's public school district, so I'm sure he went to McDevitt for the Catholic education. Kid was a halfback who ended up playing extensively at Penn State — not bad. I know several HS athletic directors who'd be glad to tell you what's been done in their districts.

[IUPNation]

Literally one private school won a state title this year. Imothep is a public charter school.

There were other Catholic schools in the brackets that were defeated by public high schools.

Obviously North Allegheny didn’t get out recruited by Yinzerburgh Central Catholic.

[EastStroud13]

Ridiculous. Playing schools that don't play by the same rules must be ridiculous for some of the public school coaches.

I hope they continue to make a stink about it, because it is ridiculous. Sure, every 4 years there's a public team stacked enough to stick with and/or beat St. Joe's. But there are countless more great teams that have their seasons ended by an all-star team. Mind you, an all-star team that knows full well that they should be competing beyond Pennsylvania: their schedule featured 4 PCL opponents and 5 out-of-state opponents.

I don't blame St. Joe's for maximizing their program; I blame PIAA for allowing them to compete with everyone else. Even just saying "if you're a school that isn't operated by a Pennsylvania school district, at least 75% of your schedule must be from Pennsylvania to be playoff-eligible" would be an improvement. But I don't think the issue is fully solved until non-boundary schools have their own playoff brackets. If it wasn't St. Joe's, some other school would soak up the talent. It's up to PIAA to acknowledge that.