THE IUP Football Thread

[IUPbigINDIANS]

What stood out to me was the bond amount. That tells me it was more than just a little misunderstanding or accidentally being locked out.

Kids make mistakes and a lot of them are “good” kids for the most part that just have a lapse in judgement. We’ll see how it plays out but this gets back to the leadership comments earlier in the thread. Being out at 2:30 AM and breaking in to places is not leadership, or conducting yourself as a responsible human being. It should also be pointed out that he’s 21, so one of the older players on the team that should know better. It’s a pretty quick turnaround on the preliminary hearing so we’ll have a pretty good indication of where this is going soon.

That is an enormous bond amount for criminal trespass (typically $1k to $3k).

[EyeoftheHawk]

So, what are the legalities associated with these charges?

Criminal trespass is not the same as burglary (drastically less, if any, time up state). The article did state he 'broke in' to the residence. Recall last year we had a player kick in a door. I suppose that, too, was considered breaking in.


Based on the time (230am), I would hope he was just drunk as a skunk and wanted to crash a party. It could be as simple as the door was locked and he wanted inside. Of course, they obviously did call the police. He is quite a big dude.

I can say the accused is not a bad young man. Quite the opposite, actually, which makes this even worse.

Hopefully he can get this cleared up, do some community service and move along. The justice system works quite differently in Indiana for star athletes. Keep that in mind.

Not that it matters much, but I beleive Tort suspended Stewart just one game last year (naturally the game they lost in Erie).

What stood out to me was the bond amount. That tells me it was more than just a little misunderstanding or accidentally being locked out.

Kids make mistakes and a lot of them are “good” kids for the most part that just have a lapse in judgement. We’ll see how it plays out but this gets back to the leadership comments earlier in the thread. Being out at 2:30 AM and breaking in to places is not leadership, or conducting yourself as a responsible human being. It should also be pointed out that he’s 21, so one of the older players on the team that should know better. It’s a pretty quick turnaround on the preliminary hearing so we’ll have a pretty good indication of where this is going soon.

[IUP24]

They're going to experience what some schools like Clarion and Edinboro are experiencing now. Your most enthusiastic supporters don't have a lot of cash to give and most others aren't of generations that are likely to donate to their schools.

I think the 40-60 age bracket is donating across the parking lot in the KCAC. That should be where they are focusing efforts to try to get program funds, while also finding ways to energize more young people to gain interest in the program.

Show students and young alumni a reason to be interested in the program and they are more likely to donate later. But as we’ve discussed at length, the “getting the students interested” part is an uphill battle.

[IUPbigINDIANS]

Some players respond to bad losses by spending a little extra time in the film room, or maybe taking out their frustration by throwing around some weights or doing drills well into the night. Others relieve the pressure by breaking and entering. From the Indiana Gazette:

On Sunday at 2:22 a.m., according to Indiana Borough Police, a [prominent IUP football player], of Indiana, broke into an occupied residence along the 200 block of South Seventh Street. [The player] was arraigned Sunday morning before Blairsville Magisterial District Judge Robert Steele Bell Sr. on criminal trespass and criminal mischief charges and released on $20,000 unsecured bond pending a preliminary hearing on Nov. 8 at 9 a.m.

I excluded the name in the 1% chance it’s someone else with the same name and age, but you can find it in today’s crime and punishment section. Must have been pretty serious to require $20,000 bond. Innocent until proven guilty, of course.

So, what are the legalities associated with these charges?

Criminal trespass is not the same as burglary (drastically less, if any, time up state). The article did state he 'broke in' to the residence. Recall last year we had a player kick in a door. I suppose that, too, was considered breaking in.


Based on the time (230am), I would hope he was just drunk as a skunk and wanted to crash a party. It could be as simple as the door was locked and he wanted inside. Of course, they obviously did call the police. He is quite a big dude.

I can say the accused is not a bad young man. Quite the opposite, actually, which makes this even worse.

Hopefully he can get this cleared up, do some community service and move along. The justice system works quite differently in Indiana for star athletes. Keep that in mind.

Not that it matters much, but I beleive Tort suspended Stewart just one game last year (naturally the game they lost in Erie).

[Fightingscot82]

Obviously they aren't dropping the sport but the real elephant in the room is the aging donor base. They aren't getting any younger. IUP Football has an extremely old core following.

How many donors has the Tort regime turned off? That's a major problem.

They're going to experience what some schools like Clarion and Edinboro are experiencing now. Your most enthusiastic supporters don't have a lot of cash to give and most others aren't of generations that are likely to donate to their schools.

[IUPbigINDIANS]

I'm not sure they have the money. There are scholarship minimums and any D1 conference that takes them will most likely be lowest level private schools who recruit with coupon codes instead of golf outing revenue and alumni donations. Redistribute IUP's 25ish football scholarships to the other sports and its possible they're high enough to make minimum funding levels. The other piece is travel. IUP has it pretty dang good that conference travel is no more than a 5 hour bus ride. Moving up will most likely blow up their usual travel budgets. A lot more overnight trips to Fairfield, Connecticut or Macomb, Illinois.

Scholarship wise its possible they could meet minimums and be competitive if they cut football and redistribute to other men's programs. Operationally, its possible that the additional March Madness revenue helps offset the increased travel. BUT - moving up usually hurts winning at least at first. Will IUP fans continue to throw money at IUP athletics a) without their more prominent sport, and b) if they aren't dominating?

Obviously they aren't dropping the sport but the real elephant in the room is the aging donor base. They aren't getting any younger. IUP Football has an extremely old core following.

How many donors has the Tort regime turned off? That's a major problem.

[Fightingscot82]

They could just shut down the football program and go D1 in all of the remaining sports. Seems like there might be some support for that. Of course, we've looked into the D1 thing a couple of times in the past but maybe now is the time. What do you think?

I'm not sure they have the money. There are scholarship minimums and any D1 conference that takes them will most likely be lowest level private schools who recruit with coupon codes instead of golf outing revenue and alumni donations. Redistribute IUP's 25ish football scholarships to the other sports and its possible they're high enough to make minimum funding levels. The other piece is travel. IUP has it pretty dang good that conference travel is no more than a 5 hour bus ride. Moving up will most likely blow up their usual travel budgets. A lot more overnight trips to Fairfield, Connecticut or Macomb, Illinois.

Scholarship wise its possible they could meet minimums and be competitive if they cut football and redistribute to other men's programs. Operationally, its possible that the additional March Madness revenue helps offset the increased travel. BUT - moving up usually hurts winning at least at first. Will IUP fans continue to throw money at IUP athletics a) without their more prominent sport, and b) if they aren't dominating?

[IUPbigINDIANS]

They could just shut down the football program and go D1 in all of the remaining sports. Seems like there might be some support for that. Of course, we've looked into the D1 thing a couple of times in the past but maybe now is the time. What do you think?

They need a start-over. Tort and his good 'ol boy network needs to go. They got old. It happens. Regardless, it's time to exit the stage.

They'd be swimming in good applicants for that job -- highly likely to include many sitting PSAC HCs.


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[IUP24]

I don't think anybody actually expects them to win the Region yearly. History of late shows Cal has owned the series and SRU is about .500


I accept they won't sweep them yearly.

I don't accept, however, what I've watched this year. Losing to ESU (in that fashion) made me sick. Losing to Seton Hill is just embarrassing. Listening to every thing and person under the sun get blamed has been nauseating. Seeing a
​​​​​talented team so aloof in attention to detail is maddening. Missing 9 extra points, etc , etc., etc.

When the congregation stops listening to the preacher ... you've got problems.

I'm not disagreeing with that whatsoever. It goes back to the sentiment of what I alluded to.. What are you doing when you aren't in position to really win? I'll accept not making the playoffs if it means you have a BIG year every 3-4 seasons.

I'm not speaking in a micro level pertaining to this year, rather at a macro of the region and how IUP fits into it.

I've never once said I don't think there should be a coaching change (whether that happens or not is an entirely different discussion). The timeout fiasco was laughable. The continued slow starts are tiresome. Getting boatraced in a huge game against your biggest rival is indefensible. The other consistent issues that are never fixed are alarming.

So... "What are you doing when you aren't in position to really win?" If this is the answer, that's bad. Really bad.

[iupgroundhog]

The other reality is this is costing them a lot of revenue.

People can believe all they want there was 2,125 at that Edinboro game. I was there. If there was more than 600 I'd be shocked. I counted 8 cars tailgating. The second camp scrimmage had a bigger crowd.

This Gannon game won't draw squat (as it shouldn't).

What's 3,500 less per game equal in cash flow? It has to be a decent chunk.

They could just shut down the football program and go D1 in all of the remaining sports. Seems like there might be some support for that. Of course, we've looked into the D1 thing a couple of times in the past but maybe now is the time. What do you think?

[IUP24]

I think what’s adding fuel to the fire is the way things have gone down this year, combined with having seen this type of giving up previously.

- Forgetting how many timeouts you have and costing your team a game is unacceptable. Not owning up to it and taking responsibility is worse.
- Losing to Slippery Rock is going to happen, but getting your doors blown off and looking completely lost is not.
- Losing to California is going to happen, but it can’t happen in the same year you lose to SRU. Also, that was a slightly better than average Cal team that came to Indiana and won pretty easily. Yes, the QB got hurt, but winning that game was a tossup at best even with Hunter.
- Losing to Seton Hill is not acceptable under any circumstances. As was pointed out, Slippery Rock, Cal, and Shepherd don’t lose those games…ever.
- Personal fouls have not been cleaned up and last weekend in Greensburg was rock bottom. Instead of taking responsibility, we have to hear about the officials.
- Players committing felonies and even a coach that probably shouldn’t have been here in the first place. It’s not fair to expect coaches to have a handle on what everyone is doing all the time, but this is still concerning.

That’s a summary of the main complaints I’ve seen on the board, not necessarily my take on all of them. I may be missing a few. I think HOW this season has gone down is what has a lot of people heading to campus with pitchforks and fire.

Yes, agreed with all of this.

[IUPbigINDIANS]

I think what’s adding fuel to the fire is the way things have gone down this year, combined with having seen this type of giving up previously.

- Forgetting how many timeouts you have and costing your team a game is unacceptable. Not owning up to it and taking responsibility is worse.
- Losing to Slippery Rock is going to happen, but getting your doors blown off and looking completely lost is not.
- Losing to California is going to happen, but it can’t happen in the same year you lose to SRU. Also, that was a slightly better than average Cal team that came to Indiana and won pretty easily. Yes, the QB got hurt, but winning that game was a tossup at best even with Hunter.
- Losing to Seton Hill is not acceptable under any circumstances. As was pointed out, Slippery Rock, Cal, and Shepherd don’t lose those games…ever.
- Personal fouls have not been cleaned up and last weekend in Greensburg was rock bottom. Instead of taking responsibility, we have to hear about the officials.
- Players committing felonies and even a coach that probably shouldn’t have been here in the first place. It’s not fair to expect coaches to have a handle on what everyone is doing all the time, but this is still concerning.

That’s a summary of the main complaints I’ve seen on the board, not necessarily my take on all of them. I may be missing a few. I think HOW this season has gone down is what has a lot of people heading to campus with pitchforks and fire.

The other reality is this is costing them a lot of revenue.

People can believe all they want there was 2,125 at that Edinboro game. I was there. If there was more than 600 I'd be shocked. I counted 8 cars tailgating. The second camp scrimmage had a bigger crowd.

This Gannon game won't draw squat (as it shouldn't).

What's 3,500 less per game equal in cash flow? It has to be a decent chunk.

[Fightingscot82]

You mostly proved my point. "The bigger question to ask is what are you doing in the years where your program isn't in position to go on a run?" If the answer is "nothing," then that's a problem.

I'll continue to say...

1) I don't expect them to beat SRU, Cal, and Shepherd every year. There are some here who do.
2) I don't expect them to play in the SR1 championship every year. There are some here who do.
3) I don't expect them to win the PSAC every year. There are some here who do.

Set realistic expectations. If you're program plays in a regional championship 3 years out of 10, in reality, that's pretty good. But what are you doing on the off years? That's my overall point. Curt's team in 2014 took a lot of lumps because they were young, but there was clear and natural progression. This team quit when they had a lot of returning talent. I would say they are different circumstances.

My thoughts exactly. Every word - except the you're/your mixup lol.

[iupgroundhog]

rhymes with growler.

Thanks for confirming.

[IUPbigINDIANS]

You mostly proved my point. "The bigger question to ask is what are you doing in the years where your program isn't in position to go on a run?" If the answer is "nothing," then that's a problem.

I'll continue to say...

1) I don't expect them to beat SRU, Cal, and Shepherd every year. There are some here who do.
2) I don't expect them to play in the SR1 championship every year. There are some here who do.
3) I don't expect them to win the PSAC every year. There are some here who do.

Set realistic expectations. If you're program plays in a regional championship 3 years out of 10, in reality, that's pretty good. But what are you doing on the off years? That's my overall point. Curt's team in 2014 took a lot of lumps because they were young, but there was clear and natural progression. This team quit when they had a lot of returning talent. I would say they are different circumstances.

I don't think anybody actually expects them to win the Region yearly. History of late shows Cal has owned the series and SRU is about .500


I accept they won't sweep them yearly.

I don't accept, however, what I've watched this year. Losing to ESU (in that fashion) made me sick. Losing to Seton Hill is just embarrassing. Listening to every thing and person under the sun get blamed has been nauseating. Seeing a
​​​​​talented team so aloof in attention to detail is maddening. Missing 9 extra points, etc , etc., etc.

When the congregation stops listening to the preacher ... you've got problems.