July 1 - Moving Day 2023

[libertybearcat]

I see the reports on the ACC looking into adding them but I just don't know why they would. California fans aren't tuning into 9 am games when there schools are out east for football, and they surely won't be tuning in at 3pm during a weekday basketball matchup.

Their best bet is independence, because they will never allow themselves to be a Mountain West affiliate. Big Ten clearly doesn't want them. Big 12 doesn't want them.

These moves are mostly about money, they don't move the needle for money. You already have FSU publicly saying we need more revenue or we're going to have to look elsewhere...media rights locked up until 2036...can't see how Stanford and Cal can move the media into renegotiating their contract with the ACC and that is a long time to add two more teams for little to no more money.

[chapmaja]

D2 proposals being reviewed:

Number of teams needed to establish/maintain all D2 championship sports set at 35 teams; currently it's 40 for women's sports and 50 for men's sports. The exception for Olympic sports falling below this number would be eliminated. This will fast-track four more championships to D2. Currently Bowling is over 40, Men's Volleyball has 36, Acrobatics & Tumbling has 37, and Women's Wrestling has 33. Those numbers include known future programs some of which begin in 2023-24. Field Hockey has 35 and has been hovering around that number for a while; it will increase to 37 with 2 future programs. The one sport that could be hurt is Rowing. There are only 15 D2 teams including 2 future programs. This is a sport that Football schools should be looking to add to help Title IX. Rowing allows 20 scholarships and the average roster size in D2 is 29. D1 has 92 teams and D3 has 41 teams.

Granting AQ's in all non-football team sports. Field Hockey and (M+W) Lacrosse are the only team sports that do not have an AQ.

Dropping the ranking requirement for Earned Access in Football. Ensures that all 16 conferences (counting Carolinas) will have a team in the bracket.

Capping the AQ (and Football equivalent) at 60% of the bracket with the process of bracket expansion beginning when the bracket reaches 50% AQ. This is a non-issue for the sports currently with AQ as the bracket size would have to be reduced, some drastically, for the AQ to exceed 60%. We have 23 conferences in D2 and if all conferences had the AQ in a sport the bracket would exceed 60% AQ at 38 teams. Men's Soccer has a 40-team bracket but only 19 conferences sponsor the sport so it would be over the limit with a 31-team bracket. Football is just 1 above what would be allowed. Provided Field Hockey and (M+W) Lacrosse begin using the AQ, they would be forced to expand their brackets which has been long overdue.

Permitting Football to kickoff in the week before the Thursday before Sep 6. A Week 0 or a new Week 1. Gives D2 football scheduling flexibility in having 12 weeks to play 11 games. Makes it easier for schools in conferences with an odd number of teams and in smaller conferences to get an OOC game to start the season rather than in the middle or end of the season.

Softball limited to a 56-game/scrimmage championship season and an 8-game/scrimmage non-championship period. The Softball regular season is already limited to 56 games so this would essentially add some "Fall ball".

Championship access ratio for team sports of 4.25-6.00. This policy change was approved. All team sports are within this range except (M+W) Lacrosse. Women's Lacrosse has a 6.938 ratio and Men's Lacrosse has a 6.333 ratio. These are by far the two worst ratios in D2. Football is at 5.893 and their bracket is where it should be for now but will need expanding to a max of 32 teams due to the addition of new programs to keep the ratio under 6.000 while Field Hockey is at 5.833 and their bracket would be forced to expand due to the 60% AQ policy. The Lacrosse brackets have not been able to keep up with the pace of new programs being added. There are 8 future Lacrosse programs for each gender and if the brackets are not expanded the ratios will be over 7.000.

DII Management Council recommends 3 Convention proposals be sponsored

They (football schools) have to be careful with rowing as an offset to football for Title IX purposes. When Michigan State cut their swimming and diving programs, and was involved in a lawsuit regarding the Title IX implications of that decision, one of the issues that came out was counting "novice" rowers as athletes in an effort to balance the numbers for Title IX compliance. The courts didn't seem to like the idea Michigan State was counting a bunch of "novice" (ie JV) athletes against the count for varsity athletes in men's sports like football. If you take out the novice rowers from a rowing roster, the roster is nowhere near as big.

[chapmaja]

These moves are mostly about money, they don't move the needle for money. You already have FSU publicly saying we need more revenue or we're going to have to look elsewhere...media rights locked up until 2036...can't see how Stanford and Cal can move the media into renegotiating their contract with the ACC and that is a long time to add two more teams for little to no more money.

The ACC is in a major bind right now, but also has the schools virtually locked in with the current contract the way it is written. The only way the ACC really changes (in or out), will be if someone challenges the "Grant of Rights" aspect of the agreement and it is ultimately struck down by the courts.

Unless this happens, I don't see school entering of leaving the conference.

Now, as for what happens to the remaining 4 PAC 12 teams. Stanford and Cal will likely end up in the Big 10. I know it seems like their isn't interest now, but I think in the end they will follow the Washington-Oregon-USC and UCLA into the Big 10. Washington State and Oregon State should have already been swept up by the Mountain West. They are honestly a perfect fit for the conference in terms of sports offered and location.

People talk about the academic level of Stanford, but it isn't like California is bad academically, they actually would rank only behind Northwestern among National Universities who are full time Big Ten Athletic Members. Athletically, people seem to think Stanford is really good (and they are), but California overall isn't exactly chopped liver athletically either. They finished 22nd in the Directors Cup Standings in 2022-2023 (ahead of schools like Oklahoma, and Oregon). California finished behind only current Big Ten Members Ohio State, Michigan and Penn St, as well as future members USC, UCLA and Washington).

[IUPNation]

Guess I called it…get ready for that Cal-Boston College game in two years!

https://www.espn.com/college-sports/...ford-additions

Because nothing says Atlantic Coast Conference like two schools from the San Francisco Bay Area.

[IUPNation]

Big Ten might want Stanford. They are really good academically, honestly they do have a solid overall athletic department and are part of a huge market. Better yet, the Cardinal might be enough of a carrot to entice Notre Dame should the ACC start crumbling.

Realistically, at this point, college football should just break away and let all the other sports go back to their original, geographical conferences.

This.

[IUPNation]

The ACC is in a major bind right now, but also has the schools virtually locked in with the current contract the way it is written. The only way the ACC really changes (in or out), will be if someone challenges the "Grant of Rights" aspect of the agreement and it is ultimately struck down by the courts.

Unless this happens, I don't see school entering of leaving the conference.

Now, as for what happens to the remaining 4 PAC 12 teams. Stanford and Cal will likely end up in the Big 10. I know it seems like their isn't interest now, but I think in the end they will follow the Washington-Oregon-USC and UCLA into the Big 10. Washington State and Oregon State should have already been swept up by the Mountain West. They are honestly a perfect fit for the conference in terms of sports offered and location.

People talk about the academic level of Stanford, but it isn't like California is bad academically, they actually would rank only behind Northwestern among National Universities who are full time Big Ten Athletic Members. Athletically, people seem to think Stanford is really good (and they are), but California overall isn't exactly chopped liver athletically either. They finished 22nd in the Directors Cup Standings in 2022-2023 (ahead of schools like Oklahoma, and Oregon). California finished behind only current Big Ten Members Ohio State, Michigan and Penn St, as well as future members USC, UCLA and Washington).

The BIG should take them to balance out the conference geographically and it locks up another massive TV market in the San Francisco/Oakland/San Jose market.

The BIG already has most of the biggest TV markets sown up.

New York - Rutgers
Philadelphia - Penn State
Baltimore/Washington - Maryland
Detroit - Meatchicken schools
Chicago - Northwestern/Illinois
Los Angeles - USC/UCLA

And it has several larger ones in play too
Pittsburgh - It shares it with Pitt...but Pitt is still second fiddle by a mile in PA.
Cleveland/Columbus - The Overrated State University
Indianapolis - Purdue/Indiana
Milwaukee - Wisconsin
Minneapolis/St. Paul - Minnesota
Portland - Oregon
Seattle - Washington

[libertybearcat]

The ACC is in a major bind right now, but also has the schools virtually locked in with the current contract the way it is written. The only way the ACC really changes (in or out), will be if someone challenges the "Grant of Rights" aspect of the agreement and it is ultimately struck down by the courts.

Unless this happens, I don't see school entering of leaving the conference.

Now, as for what happens to the remaining 4 PAC 12 teams. Stanford and Cal will likely end up in the Big 10. I know it seems like their isn't interest now, but I think in the end they will follow the Washington-Oregon-USC and UCLA into the Big 10. Washington State and Oregon State should have already been swept up by the Mountain West. They are honestly a perfect fit for the conference in terms of sports offered and location.

People talk about the academic level of Stanford, but it isn't like California is bad academically, they actually would rank only behind Northwestern among National Universities who are full time Big Ten Athletic Members. Athletically, people seem to think Stanford is really good (and they are), but California overall isn't exactly chopped liver athletically either. They finished 22nd in the Directors Cup Standings in 2022-2023 (ahead of schools like Oklahoma, and Oregon). California finished behind only current Big Ten Members Ohio State, Michigan and Penn St, as well as future members USC, UCLA and Washington).

Agree on most of what you've said...I don't think Stanford and Cal move the money needle enough to get the B1G to take them...I'd wager they're waiting to see if FSU or some other ACC team can either pushback enough on the Grant of Rights or they get 8 total teams to say they're leaving, thus breaking the contract and allowing them to be able to move.

Definitely interesting times for CFB.

Chip Kelly said something intriguing...he said let the power 64 teams break away for FB only...and let the other sports fall into conferences that better honor rivalries and geography...kinda like Notre Dame and their situation being indy in FB and the ACC for the remainder of their sports. That might just work!

[zimmy21]

Agree on most of what you've said...I don't think Stanford and Cal move the money needle enough to get the B1G to take them...I'd wager they're waiting to see if FSU or some other ACC team can either pushback enough on the Grant of Rights or they get 8 total teams to say they're leaving, thus breaking the contract and allowing them to be able to move.

Definitely interesting times for CFB.

Chip Kelly said something intriguing...he said let the power 64 teams break away for FB only...and let the other sports fall into conferences that better honor rivalries and geography...kinda like Notre Dame and their situation being indy in FB and the ACC for the remainder of their sports. That might just work!

Of the remaining Power 4 conferences, Stanford and Cal would best fit in to the Big Ten. However, this is twice now the Big Ten has taken in PAC 12 schools and twice they've passed on Stanford and Cal. If the Big Ten wanted them, they would be members already. Academics are perfectly in line, and athletics are decent enough, but they don't move the needle like you said. The Big Ten knows there is blood in the water and they are waiting for the ACC to vote on dissolving itself.

The Big Ten would simply have to tell UNC/Virginia/Boston College/Duke that they have invites pending. SEC and Big 12 can invite any combination of Clemson/Florida State/Miami/Virginia Tech/ Louisville/NC State and the ACC would be done within a week. Only needs 8, and we know 2 are pounding on the door with UNC/Duke/Miami/Virginia/Virginia Tech/Louisville just waiting to hear from the rival conferences.

[libertybearcat]

Of the remaining Power 4 conferences, Stanford and Cal would best fit in to the Big Ten. However, this is twice now the Big Ten has taken in PAC 12 schools and twice they've passed on Stanford and Cal. If the Big Ten wanted them, they would be members already. Academics are perfectly in line, and athletics are decent enough, but they don't move the needle like you said. The Big Ten knows there is blood in the water and they are waiting for the ACC to vote on dissolving itself.

The Big Ten would simply have to tell UNC/Virginia/Boston College/Duke that they have invites pending. SEC and Big 12 can invite any combination of Clemson/Florida State/Miami/Virginia Tech/ Louisville/NC State and the ACC would be done within a week. Only needs 8, and we know 2 are pounding on the door with UNC/Duke/Miami/Virginia/Virginia Tech/Louisville just waiting to hear from the rival conferences.

I believe we're largely in agreement. 😁

[cwfenn]

Chip Kelly said something intriguing...he said let the power 64 teams break away for FB only...and let the other sports fall into conferences that better honor rivalries and geography...kinda like Notre Dame and their situation being indy in FB and the ACC for the remainder of their sports. That might just work!

I like that idea. I would take it further and take all the FBS schools and set up two tiers. The top tier would be what’s happening now, with the top 70 or so teams. The second tier would be everyone else. Put the teams in both tiers into geographic pods of like 10-12 teams. The teams in the top tier would be allowed to qualify for the national championship. The teams in the second tier would be allowed to play for entry through bowl games or a playoff into the top tier to replace the worst teams in the top tier, who would stay or go through bowl games or a playoff.

So basically it’s the promotion/relegation system they use in Euro soccer. Some people have mentioned something like this in other places, so it’s not all my idea, but it keeps football separate from the other sports and it gives non-power schools an opportunity to play with the big dogs. I’m sure there are some flaws, but it’s past my bedtime and I’m writing stuff on message boards to think of them.

[sportsvine]

Might want to specify that Roosevelt would be joining the GLIAC and not the GLVC, since they both start with "Great Lakes" =)

I have always thought that the GLVC was geographically similar to the GLIAC, just a lesser version. But that's not really true, geographically. Most of the GLVC footprint is in Missouri and Southern Illinois, and none of the football-playing GLVC schools are anywhere near any of the Great Lakes. If anything, the GLVC is kinda a lesser version of the MIAA.

[sportsvine]

According to this awesome website, there are 163 football playing D2 schools in this coming 2023 season. Can anyone name the state with the most teams? (That should be pretty easy). Sixteen states do NOT have any D2 representation. Can anyone name these states?

[IUPNation]

According to this awesome website, there are 163 football playing D2 schools in this coming 2023 season. Can anyone name the state with the most teams? (That should be pretty easy). Sixteen states do NOT have any D2 representation. Can anyone name these states?

Pennsylvania.

[libertybearcat]

I’m sure there are some flaws, but it’s past my bedtime and I’m writing stuff on message boards to think of them.

As long as you're not drunk too...you should be alright! :)

[SW_Mustang]

According to this awesome website, there are 163 football playing D2 schools in this coming 2023 season. Can anyone name the state with the most teams? (That should be pretty easy). Sixteen states do NOT have any D2 representation. Can anyone name these states?

Most: Pennsylvania

0: Alaska, Hawaii, California, Arizona, Wyoming, Montana, Idaho, Wisconsin, Vermont, New Hampshire, New York, Nevada, Utah, Illinois, Maryland, Maine?

EDIT: 12/16 ain't bad. Missed a couple obvious ones, and one of them actually surprised me that they don't have a D2 school.