OT: D1

[Ship69]

Seems like a lot of expense for a program that doesn’t seem to want to compete for titles…

That is the cone to Jesus moment for FBS..week out programs that **** compete and add a third D1 tier..based on capability to generate revenue and fund programs to compete.

More than half of the stadium is being funded by the Ryan family. And they're getting it for about $100 million more than it's costing Penn State to renovate its Erector set. As far as wanting to compete for a title, they aren't Notre Dame and probably aren't going to ante up $20 million a year to buy a roster like the thousands of crazed Ohio State fans. What they actually do annually is produce the highest academic ranking and highest graduation rates in the Big 10 year after year. If they win that side of the equation, I'm fine with that. Even though a charter member of the Big Ten, I'm sure they could be left out when the inevitable super leagues are formed, and I'm fine with that, too.

[IUPNation]

Northwestern's new stadium, despite being the most expensive to be constructed to this point, will actually reduce seating from 47,000 in the old Ryan Field to 35,000. It is being built with the recent decline in gameday attendance in mind at many stadiums and also with a look at more opportunities for premium seating. The temporary lakefront stadium they used during the past season and will use again next season, raised as much or more on a gameday as the former stadium with about one-quarter of its seating capacity. They found people were willing to pay a price for a better viewing experience. The new venue will feature a higher percentage of premium seating, and the AD said the higher revenue from that might actually subsidize cheaper seats in other areas of the stadium. Of course they'll probably have little control over scalpers.

It really hasn't made much sense for Northwestern, with fewer than 10,000 undergrads and an alumni base spread out all over the country, to be playing in the 47,000-seat venue. The original Dyche Stadium that became Ryan Field was built in the 1920s (my mother, who lived in Evanston at the time, remembered it being built and also that she attended a birthday party for the Northwestern coach's daugher when she was about 6 years old.) The stadium was considered a huge football palace at the time as, hard as it is to believe now, Northwestern was something of a football powerhouse through the 1930s into the '40s, an era that included three Big Ten championships and that ended with a strong team led by Otto Graham. At one point seating at that stadium was over 50,000, and they'd draw good crowds in the '50s when Ara Parseghian's NU teams would play someone such as Notre Dame. He beat Notre Dame like a drum, which is one reason the Irish hired him away from NU. After 1970, NU had a series of administrations that didn't give a damn about football, and the team, which had about a .500 all-time record up to then, became a joke for the next 25 years.

Seems like a lot of expense for a program that doesn’t seem to want to compete for titles…

That is the cone to Jesus moment for FBS..week out programs that **** compete and add a third D1 tier..based on capability to generate revenue and fund programs to compete.

[Ship69]

Now the trend in stadium design is the opposite. It’s more pronounced in the pros but even college teams are cutting out the cheap seats or standing room only spots to build luxury boxes or premium seats since they typically generate more revenue. I’m a bit curious to see what happens with these 100k stadium teams as their facilities age. When they get too old will the next stadium be as big or will they be more in the NFL range of 75-80k?

Northwestern's new stadium, despite being the most expensive to be constructed to this point, will actually reduce seating from 47,000 in the old Ryan Field to 35,000. It is being built with the recent decline in gameday attendance in mind at many stadiums and also with a look at more opportunities for premium seating. The temporary lakefront stadium they used during the past season and will use again next season, raised as much or more on a gameday as the former stadium with about one-quarter of its seating capacity. They found people were willing to pay a price for a better viewing experience. The new venue will feature a higher percentage of premium seating, and the AD said the higher revenue from that might actually subsidize cheaper seats in other areas of the stadium. Of course they'll probably have little control over scalpers.

It really hasn't made much sense for Northwestern, with fewer than 10,000 undergrads and an alumni base spread out all over the country, to be playing in the 47,000-seat venue. The original Dyche Stadium that became Ryan Field was built in the 1920s (my mother, who lived in Evanston at the time, remembered it being built and also that she attended a birthday party for the Northwestern coach's daugher when she was about 6 years old.) The stadium was considered a huge football palace at the time as, hard as it is to believe now, Northwestern was something of a football powerhouse through the 1930s into the '40s, an era that included three Big Ten championships and that ended with a strong team led by Otto Graham. At one point seating at that stadium was over 50,000, and they'd draw good crowds in the '50s when Ara Parseghian's NU teams would play someone such as Notre Dame. He beat Notre Dame like a drum, which is one reason the Irish hired him away from NU. After 1970, NU had a series of administrations that didn't give a damn about football, and the team, which had about a .500 all-time record up to then, became a joke for the next 25 years.

[EyeoftheHawk]

I was at the Ohio State game this year and it was a good experience overall. No doubt the place needs a renovation and bleacher seating is what it is, but there is no atmosphere like that place on game day. I’ve been to several stadiums and there truly is nothing like it. Anyway, we paid $80 to park, had a reasonable walk to the stadium, and didn’t have any issues with getting in and out of restrooms or long waits at concession stands. Saying that, it sounds like where you’re sitting can dramatically impact the experience.

My second favorite experience was at the old Pitt Stadium. Despite being run down toward the end it was a great college football atmosphere. The last game I went to there was when Michael Vick was at VA Tech the year they went to the natty. Pitt came up short but it was a great game. The games I’ve been to in Acrisure/Heinz just aren’t the same. Those who never got to experience Pitt Stadium will never know what they’re missing.

[Bart]

It was much easier seeing a Penn State game in 1976. We parked in the Eisenhower Auditorium parking lot and stood around eating out of the car's trunk before walking up to the stadium. No charge to park there. Same thing in 1981 which was my last game at PSU as a graduate student.

[IUPbigINDIANS]

You paid 175 to park at The game???

Oh hell no. I would have parked somewhere in State College for free and walked a few miles. You mean every lot on that campus was 175 bucks?

Our 'vehicle' paid that price. Granted, it was luckily divided among a few people.

[IUPNation]

State College is an outlier in many regards. Getting 110,000 up there on Dec. 21 in 20-some degrees -- with tons of students long gone -- is crazy.

I'd venture to guess you could probably count on one hand how many schools could draw like that (playoff or no playoff).

Beaver Stadium (to the bleacher people) is a gigantic high school stadium. The new NFL stadiums are like high-end hotels.

Even "Heinz Field" in Pittsburgh is already a relic -- and it's only in its early 20s.

The culture in the 'big boy' P4 and NFL is so vastly different now than 20-25 years ago. It's so expensive to attend these games. With that, the clientele level has gone up and people demand more for their $400 tickets and $150 parking.

I can't even fathom what PSU generates during one game weekend just in parking. This past Saturday we paid $175 and it felt like we parked in Lock Haven.

I went to a lot of NHL Penguins' games as a kid. Those games were insane in the 80s and 90s. You go there now (it costs a fortune) and the crowd has the same vibe as being at a hipster martini bar in Lower Manhattan. It's close to a grand for me to take the family to a Pens game -- decent tickets, parking, food, blah blah blah.

You paid 175 to park at The game???

Oh hell no. I would have parked somewhere in State College for free and walked a few miles. You mean every lot on that campus was 175 bucks?

[IUPbigINDIANS]

I thought Oakland’s new stadium was around 75k as well. Honest mistake on my part. I know SDSU just built a new stadium recently and it’s more like an MLS stadium in terms of capacity. For G5 and lesser P5 schools that may be the way forward while even the bigger P5 schools dip towards NFL capacities if attendance trends continue as they have been.

State College is an outlier in many regards. Getting 110,000 up there on Dec. 21 in 20-some degrees -- with tons of students long gone -- is crazy.

I'd venture to guess you could probably count on one hand how many schools could draw like that (playoff or no playoff).

Beaver Stadium (to the bleacher people) is a gigantic high school stadium. The new NFL stadiums are like high-end hotels.

Even "Heinz Field" in Pittsburgh is already a relic -- and it's only in its early 20s.

The culture in the 'big boy' P4 and NFL is so vastly different now than 20-25 years ago. It's so expensive to attend these games. With that, the clientele level has gone up and people demand more for their $400 tickets and $150 parking.

I can't even fathom what PSU generates during one game weekend just in parking. This past Saturday we paid $175 and it felt like we parked in Lock Haven.

I went to a lot of NHL Penguins' games as a kid. Those games were insane in the 80s and 90s. You go there now (it costs a fortune) and the crowd has the same vibe as being at a hipster martini bar in Lower Manhattan. It's close to a grand for me to take the family to a Pens game -- decent tickets, parking, food, blah blah blah.

[TheBigCat2192]

Even that range is high for the NFL, there are only 7 franchises above 75k for seating (Giants/Jets, Cowboys, Packers, Cheifs, Broncos and Panthers).

Florida State just did a bunch of renovations to their stadium taking it from around 80k from their heyday to now about 65k.

I thought Oakland’s new stadium was around 75k as well. Honest mistake on my part. I know SDSU just built a new stadium recently and it’s more like an MLS stadium in terms of capacity. For G5 and lesser P5 schools that may be the way forward while even the bigger P5 schools dip towards NFL capacities if attendance trends continue as they have been.

[Ram040506]

Now the trend in stadium design is the opposite. It’s more pronounced in the pros but even college teams are cutting out the cheap seats or standing room only spots to build luxury boxes or premium seats since they typically generate more revenue. I’m a bit curious to see what happens with these 100k stadium teams as their facilities age. When they get too old will the next stadium be as big or will they be more in the NFL range of 75-80k?

Even that range is high for the NFL, there are only 7 franchises above 75k for seating (Giants/Jets, Cowboys, Packers, Cheifs, Broncos and Panthers).

Florida State just did a bunch of renovations to their stadium taking it from around 80k from their heyday to now about 65k.

[TheBigCat2192]

Years back -- in the 'biggest capacity pi$$ing matches' -- the 'lines' on the bleachers were actually crunched closer together. All those 'inches' added up and increased seating capacity by the thousands.

I don't know the exact measurements, but they went from something like 16" to 12".

Now the trend in stadium design is the opposite. It’s more pronounced in the pros but even college teams are cutting out the cheap seats or standing room only spots to build luxury boxes or premium seats since they typically generate more revenue. I’m a bit curious to see what happens with these 100k stadium teams as their facilities age. When they get too old will the next stadium be as big or will they be more in the NFL range of 75-80k?

[IUPbigINDIANS]

I had the luck to see a game there about 6 years ago when a family member won a pair of tickets through a work raffle to see a pretty good PSU team host a pretty good Michigan team for the whiteout game. Unfortunately despite my family member working for Penn State Health and getting seats marked for that group we were way up in the nosebleed bleachers and the lines to make out each “seat” are almost comically small. You can tell the stadium was built when people were much thinner.

I didn’t have as much of a wait in my restroom trips but I’m pretty sure they were still using the old trough style which was quite the departure from what I was most familiar with from my time at BU.

And yeah as hard as it is to like a lot of them their fans are very intense. I recall wishing I had brought earplugs for a few third and fourth downs, particularly late in the game when Michigan was driving into the student section. I can only imagine that a playoff atmosphere is about two times as crazy.

Years back -- in the 'biggest capacity pi$$ing matches' -- the 'lines' on the bleachers were actually crunched closer together. All those 'inches' added up and increased seating capacity by the thousands.

I don't know the exact measurements, but they went from something like 16" to 12".

[TheBigCat2192]

Speaking of Penn State ...

It was my first time back at Beaver Stadium in about 12 years or so. The atmosphere is incredible. No denying. Like the PSU fan base or not, they make it a living hell on visitors.

As for the actual 'fan experience' ... it certainly has some flaws.

For starters, just 'entering' the stadium is a nightmare. It's a matter of time until somebody is killed in a stampede. The mobile ticketing really slows things down. There are only a few gates, which just get overrun. If you're going in ... go in very early to avoid the drunken stampede closer to kickoff. If you have kids with you, go in very early or after kickoff.

Once inside, if you must hit the restroom, you'll miss about a quarter of the game. I'm sure there are some 'secret' restrooms inside for public use, but the the main ones all have a 30-45 minute line.

Concessions? Eat before you go in. You'll miss another quarter. If you must, just have a lot of money.

The bleacher seating is what it is but those 11" or 12" each person gets is pretty comical. Nobody sat Saturday so it didn't really matter.

Security, while I know it exists, is nearly invisible. There are no ushers. The walk-ways up and down the bleachers are full of standing drunks. They don't keep the 'lane clear' like most stadiums. It further adds time to the food or restroom walk if you are higher up. It takes 10 minutes or so to bob-and-weave through that chaos (each way).

They sell booze inside the stadium now so that adds a new wrinkle. My personal favorite was the two idiots in front of me. They barely made it up the bleachers, then immediately went on a beer run. They missed the entire first quarter. They got back up ... and immediately spilled two full beers on the family in front of them. The group to the right of us showed up mid-way through the first quarter. They all somehow got full bottles of wine through security. Their youngest was about 20 or 21. He immediately fell straight backwards upon trying to walk through the bleacher crowd to his seat. It took several people to get him up. Behind me I had the group of 50-somethings who were likely smashing Jack Daniels since 8 am and for some reason speaking 'Bruh' language.

I paid more for parking than my game ticket - and still had a roughly (1) mile walk.

All of that said, I'm glad I went. It was an experience. It was obviously not a warm day, but 110,000 filled the place up.

It was also an experience I won't be re-living any time soon.

I had the luck to see a game there about 6 years ago when a family member won a pair of tickets through a work raffle to see a pretty good PSU team host a pretty good Michigan team for the whiteout game. Unfortunately despite my family member working for Penn State Health and getting seats marked for that group we were way up in the nosebleed bleachers and the lines to make out each “seat” are almost comically small. You can tell the stadium was built when people were much thinner.

I didn’t have as much of a wait in my restroom trips but I’m pretty sure they were still using the old trough style which was quite the departure from what I was most familiar with from my time at BU.

And yeah as hard as it is to like a lot of them their fans are very intense. I recall wishing I had brought earplugs for a few third and fourth downs, particularly late in the game when Michigan was driving into the student section. I can only imagine that a playoff atmosphere is about two times as crazy.

[Fightingscot82]

Yeah, their seating is certainly all about the bucks. I remember going to a game there in the '90s and a friend of mine and his wife were their with their infant daughter. They were charged full boat for the kid, despite the fact that she wasn't even using a seat. You paid mucho dinero to park in a farm field a good distance from the stadium, and from what you say it isn't any better now. Northwestern's old stadium seated 47,000, is located in a built-up city neighborhood, and had little parking, but by walking a couple of blocks to the el or taking shuttle buses (to a free parking area), I was always able to get in an d out of there much quicker than at Penn State. We'll see what happens when they do the promised $700 million renovation. I'll never forget the first game I attended up there in 1966 (Joe Paterno's second game as coach). Stadium seated about 46,000 and was open at both ends. They actually used to have band days when high school bands were invited to attend. You're never going to see that again in the days of NIL.

Interesting argument for NIL - music students there on scholarship are allowed to take paid performances outside of school. Some of those students are expressly recruited to fill spots in university bands. One of my best friends in high school was an incredible trumpet player and he had his pick of schools and often the sales pitch was "come here, you can make thousands gigging on the side in the city".

[Ship69]

Speaking of Penn State ...

It was my first time back at Beaver Stadium in about 12 years or so. The atmosphere is incredible. No denying. Like the PSU fan base or not, they make it a living hell on visitors.

As for the actual 'fan experience' ... it certainly has some flaws.

For starters, just 'entering' the stadium is a nightmare. It's a matter of time until somebody is killed in a stampede. The mobile ticketing really slows things down. There are only a few gates, which just get overrun. If you're going in ... go in very early to avoid the drunken stampede closer to kickoff. If you have kids with you, go in very early or after kickoff.

Once inside, if you must hit the restroom, you'll miss about a quarter of the game. I'm sure there are some 'secret' restrooms inside for public use, but the the main ones all have a 30-45 minute line.

Concessions? Eat before you go in. You'll miss another quarter. If you must, just have a lot of money.

The bleacher seating is what it is but those 11" or 12" each person gets is pretty comical. Nobody sat Saturday so it didn't really matter.

Security, while I know it exists, is nearly invisible. There are no ushers. The walk-ways up and down the bleachers are full of standing drunks. They don't keep the 'lane clear' like most stadiums. It further adds time to the food or restroom walk if you are higher up. It takes 10 minutes or so to bob-and-weave through that chaos (each way).

They sell booze inside the stadium now so that adds a new wrinkle. My personal favorite was the two idiots in front of me. They barely made it up the bleachers, then immediately went on a beer run. They missed the entire first quarter. They got back up ... and immediately spilled two full beers on the family in front of them. The group to the right of us showed up mid-way through the first quarter. They all somehow got full bottles of wine through security. Their youngest was about 20 or 21. He immediately fell straight backwards upon trying to walk through the bleacher crowd to his seat. It took several people to get him up. Behind me I had the group of 50-somethings who were likely smashing Jack Daniels since 8 am and for some reason speaking 'Bruh' language.

I paid more for parking than my game ticket - and still had a roughly (1) mile walk.

All of that said, I'm glad I went. It was an experience. It was obviously not a warm day, but 110,000 filled the place up.

It was also an experience I won't be re-living any time soon.

Yeah, their seating is certainly all about the bucks. I remember going to a game there in the '90s and a friend of mine and his wife were their with their infant daughter. They were charged full boat for the kid, despite the fact that she wasn't even using a seat. You paid mucho dinero to park in a farm field a good distance from the stadium, and from what you say it isn't any better now. Northwestern's old stadium seated 47,000, is located in a built-up city neighborhood, and had little parking, but by walking a couple of blocks to the el or taking shuttle buses (to a free parking area), I was always able to get in an d out of there much quicker than at Penn State. We'll see what happens when they do the promised $700 million renovation. I'll never forget the first game I attended up there in 1966 (Joe Paterno's second game as coach). Stadium seated about 46,000 and was open at both ends. They actually used to have band days when high school bands were invited to attend. You're never going to see that again in the days of NIL.