OT: D1

[Fightingscot82]

I can’t speak for DUI but Columbia County has something similar to an ARD for underage drinkers (and perhaps other crimes but I don’t know all the details) called the Youthful Offenders Program. I imagine it’s made the county a decent chunk of change over time between people paying for the course and then paying the fine for a summary offense after completing the course.

Yeah every county has an ARD program run through the probation office. Interesting fact about the court system is that the convicted PAY for their probation as if they are paying for a service.

[IUPbigINDIANS]

As someone with a grad degree from Northwestern and who has made at least a dozen trips from Pa. to Evanston to see games and even had season tickets for a few years, I was stunned by this whole affair. About the time you think that nothing in today's U.S. circus can disillusion you any more, something else rears its ugly head. Obviously the program is now dead in the water. If they were smart, which they're probably not, they'd cancel this season. I don't know what an interim coach can possibly pull out of the fire at this point. The season wasn't looking great anyway, and recruit defections are already starting. NU, a relatively small private university (undergrad enrollment is less than a couple of PASSHE schools), was always going to find it hard to compete in the new NIL transfer portal era. When Fitzgerald had good teams, they were the result of developing under-recruited three-stars and a few studs over a four-year period. That's hard to do these days.

They got caught up in the D1 arms race, tossing more than $200 million at a practice facility on the lake, renovating the basketball arena from the ground up, and planning a proposed $800 million new football stadium (which might now be on hold). On a side note, can you imagine what an $800 million injection would do for PASSHE? Once upon a time, in a much different football era, Northwestern could be somewhat competitive with the Ohio States of the world, but that time has long passed. They'd be better off getting out of the Big 10 and into some other alignment. Many people have thought a league consisting of academic-oriented schools such as Stanford, NU, Duke, Vanderbilt, etc. would make sense, and I tend to agree, but I also doubt most of them would give up the money to make it happen.

I was getting pretty sour on D1 football a long time before this, and I think this incident is probably about the final nail in the coffin for me. I'm just not really interested in the D1 any more. The proverbial bloom has gone off the rose.

So looks as if I'll primarily be following the D2 guys in PASSHE. We have our own issues with the transfer portal, but I doubt anybody in the league will be spending $200 million on a practice arena anytime soon.

I also find myself backing pretty far off D1 football -- especially the P5 ranks. Those are just professional organizations at this point. You can count on one hand in a given year before the season starts which teams actually have a chance to win the title.

Football does at least still have the 3-year waiting period from high school graduation until NFL draft eligibility. So, at least the stars are forced to stick around for a bit (at numerous schools these days). Major D1 basketball is horrendous -- vastly depleted of star players.

[IUPNation]

Yeah every county has an ARD program run through the probation office. Interesting fact about the court system is that the convicted PAY for their probation as if they are paying for a service.

It’s basically a racket that generates profits. Why anyone still drinks and drives in the era of Ubers is beyond me.

[TheBigCat2192]

Yeah every county has an ARD program run through the probation office. Interesting fact about the court system is that the convicted PAY for their probation as if they are paying for a service.

I normally don’t comment on government policy to avoid starting arguments and/or being suspended but I will make a rare exception here from my own experience. To be quite frank I came away with the impression that the Youthful Offenders Program was one step above bribing the judge to keep your license from being suspended. Why your license would be suspended for a drinking offense that doesn’t involve a motor vehicle is beyond me. I know the YOP does more than just underage drinking and serves more than just students but I’d be willing to bet that a good amount of its revenue when school is in session comes from students who want to be able to drive when they’re on break.

[Fightingscot82]

It’s basically a racket that generates profits. Why anyone still drinks and drives in the era of Ubers is beyond me.

Go further outside suburbia of a major city. It drops off pretty quickly. Also, cost. Looking right now, to schedule an Uber to pick me up at my favorite city brewery and take me 10 miles to my house would be $42. Yeah, that's cheaper than a DUI but sometimes you don't have $42.

[Fightingscot82]

I normally don’t comment on government policy to avoid starting arguments and/or being suspended but I will make a rare exception here from my own experience. To be quite frank I came away with the impression that the Youthful Offenders Program was one step above bribing the judge to keep your license from being suspended. Why your license would be suspended for a drinking offense that doesn’t involve a motor vehicle is beyond me. I know the YOP does more than just underage drinking and serves more than just students but I’d be willing to bet that a good amount of its revenue when school is in session comes from students who want to be able to drive when they’re on break.

The magistrate ARD programs for citations like underage drinking are usually total BS. A relative who got an underage while a high school student did ARD through their magistrate and paid something like $150 to go to the magistrate's office once a week for 3 weeks and watch 3 different MADD videos for an hour with the magistrate's receptionist. A county ARD for selling alcohol without a license or DUI done through the courthouse or probation office will involve probation, drug testing, coursework, community service, etc. You still have John McStatejob running things but at least it has some teeth.

[TheBigCat2192]

The magistrate ARD programs for citations like underage drinking are usually total BS. A relative who got an underage while a high school student did ARD through their magistrate and paid something like $150 to go to the magistrate's office once a week for 3 weeks and watch 3 different MADD videos for an hour with the magistrate's receptionist. A county ARD for selling alcohol without a license or DUI done through the courthouse or probation office will involve probation, drug testing, coursework, community service, etc. You still have John McStatejob running things but at least it has some teeth.

For Columbia County YOP it was 12 hours of classroom instruction done on Saturday and Sunday in the Bloomsburg town hall/police station from roughly 8-3 with a break for lunch. At least it was; I have no idea if they still do it that way. They did require some community service as well (or perhaps BU did, I honestly can’t remember the details on that part) but it was fairly short and one of the university offices had a list of service organization contacts to help students find their hours.

[IUPNation]

Go further outside suburbia of a major city. It drops off pretty quickly. Also, cost. Looking right now, to schedule an Uber to pick me up at my favorite city brewery and take me 10 miles to my house would be $42. Yeah, that's cheaper than a DUI but sometimes you don't have $42.

It just seems crazy for anyone to take a risk.

[IUPbigINDIANS]

Baseball coach at Northwestern also fired.

[IUPNation]

Yinz Pitt fans must be wondering where yinz are gonna wind up after this major consolidation.

The SEC will eventually poach the cream of ACC.

I don’t think the Northern schools of the ACC will be invited into the SEC.

[IUPbigINDIANS]

Oregon and Washington seem headed to the Big 10.


Arizona State and Utah have applied to the Big 12.

[IUPNation]

Oregon and Washington seem headed to the Big 10.


Arizona State and Utah have applied to the Big 12.

They’ve all been accepted.

The PAC 12 is now the PAC 4: Stanford, Cal, Oregon State and Washington State.

[IUP24]

Yinz Pitt fans must be wondering where yinz are gonna wind up after this major consolidation.

The SEC will eventually poach the cream of ACC.

I don’t think the Northern schools of the ACC will be invited into the SEC.

The Big 12's Grant of Rights deal (which is loose at best), only last for the next six years. It expires before the SEC's, Big Ten's, and ACC's. All the Big 12 really did yesterday was ensure that they survived beyond the Pac 12. By 2030, the 'new' Big 12 will be raided, and the programs within the league will willingly make themselves available because they need to find a league that has a TV deal entrenched.

I'm asking this as an honest question, have you read up on the ACC's Grant of Rights? It's iron clad and it's agreed to by every member institution. No other league has a document that is as iron clad and binding as what they currently have. No school can willingly leave until 2036. If they choose to do so, it would cost roughly half a billion dollars up front, PLUS every cent of television revenue that would be accrued until the current GOR deal ends. So the cost for Florida State to leave is what it is. They would need to pay 300-500 million. And then every cent of the SEC TV money they would make would be required, by law, to get forked over to the ACC. So they can leave, but that's the cost. For the ACC's Grant of Rights to get dissolved, or ripped up, it would require each member to vote unanimously to do so. Tell me that Boston College or Syracuse would agree to do that, and I have beach front property in Oklahoma to sell you.

I'm not saying that the ACC is in a great spot, but I think you're overstating, today, what this means for the ACC, and for Pitt. It doesn't really mean anything new. All the Big 12 really did was just outlast the Pac 12. The ACC's television deal is still stronger and for longer. Yesterday, college football went from 5 major conferences to 4. It will eventually get to 3. And then ultimately down to 2. And that was always going to be the B1G and the SEC. There was never a debate about that.

The Pitt angle to the overall discussion is that they need to align themselves with three other schools: Louisville, NC State, and Virginia Tech.

For the last 3 or so years, the discussion about the ACC and the B1G always involved 5 schools: UNC, Duke, Virginia, Georgia Tech, and Miami.

It was always a forgone conclusion that when this all shakes out, whether tomorrow or in 2036 when the ACC's Grant of Rights expires, is that Clemson and Florida State would make the move to the SEC.

That leaves Pitt, Louisville, NC State, Va Tech, Wake Forest, Syracuse, and Boston College.

4 of those 7 will find a home; likely as a group in the same conference. And I'll be honest, it makes far more sense for 4 of those 7 to land in the SEC than in the B1G. When you consider territory, television markets, etc. A cluster of Pitt, NC State, VA Tech, and Louisville is an attractive add for the SEC. Adds VA/DC, Raleigh, Pittsburgh, and Louisville for television. Gives you a couple schools in a northern cluster. And say what you want about Pitt, but the fact is they are a program that's been ascending. Since 2014, they've been the 2nd best team in the ACC. Numbers factually bear that out. 2nd most conference wins and 2nd highest conference winning % behind Clemson. Since joining the league, only 3 teams have played for the conference championship more than once: Clemson, FSU, and Pitt. Pitt is the only team since the expansion that has won the league outside of Clemson and FSU. They are the only team in the country since 2015 to have 2 or more wins against Clemson. Pitt may not be the brand they once were, but they shouldn't be considered an afterthought in college football expansion talks. They'll land somewhere.

[IUP24]

To add onto all of this...

I believe yesterday was a sad day for college football. It was really a death nail. A formality to what we all new was eventually coming. Two major conferences will be the finality. Whether tomorrow, next week, or next decade. What I can't understand is why people are excited about this. Fans aren't seeing a cut of this money. All that's really happening is rich institutions and rich people are becoming richer, while the overall product becomes worse.

I feel bad for fans of Washington State, Cal, Stanford, and Oregon State. You just got told by the rest of the country that you're not worthy. You've played major college football since your existence, and now you just told that nobody wants you. And I understand why fans of somebody like Utah or Arizona are stoked today. They get to see tomorrow. But look holistically at this... How is this exciting for people long term?

Think about rooting for Iowa or Wisconsin. You could always hang your hat on having a chance to win the Big Ten. You could debate anyone and say, "Yeah, but we're the best program in the B1G West." And you would have merit saying it. You're now like the 7th best team in your conference. You have no shot. How is that good? Or exciting?

And the second angle to this is that cannibalization is going to occur within those two major conferences. At some point, somebody in Tuscaloosa, or Athens, or Baton Rouge, is going to ask why Vanderbilt is getting paid the same amount of money to be in the SEC as everyone else. And people in Columbus and State College will ask the same thing about the schools in Piscataway or Evanston. Those bottom dwellers aren't going to last in those leagues either.

[TDBoi8136]

I think FBS will cycle back to what is was. It'll eventually cause the mega conferences to slowly split and form new geographical conferences. How likely will this happen, who knows. But sports (and almost everything in life) has a tendency to cycle back around.